cthia wrote:Within the constraints of our own universe. There may be other universes with completely different physical laws. Which means none of our scientific truths are absolute.
A meaningless statement, as the universe we currently occupy is the only one we can make any observations on. There may be universes with gods or god-likes in them, but there is no evidence that they exist, so.....
I've searched and searched the internet for this Godometer you use to make that claim. Christians know for a fact that God exists. Perhaps it is the special gene which Joat says we have that senses the Almighty?
You
don't "know for a fact", though. You strongly believe, in the absence of objective fact. Weren't you yourself engaged in a project to find objective facts? What happened to that? Have you gotten any repeatable proof yet, or is it still eluding you?
Well, everybody believes in "gods." The small "g" is money, gold, and bronze statues. The trick is not to worship them.
But I do believe the conversation is about God. The big G. K?
What's the difference? Humanity has come up with several competing concepts for divinity, yours isn't special or more true than any of the others as far as I can tell.
To quote Terry Pratchett:
“All right," said Susan. "I'm not stupid. You're saying humans need... fantasies to make life bearable."
REALLY? AS IF IT WAS SOME KIND OF PINK PILL? NO. HUMANS NEED FANTASY TO BE HUMAN. TO BE THE PLACE WHERE THE FALLING ANGEL MEETS THE RISING APE.
"Tooth fairies? Hogfathers? Little—"
YES. AS PRACTICE. YOU HAVE TO START OUT LEARNING TO BELIEVE THE LITTLE LIES.
"So we can believe the big ones?"
YES. JUSTICE. MERCY. DUTY. THAT SORT OF THING.
"They're not the same at all!"
YOU THINK SO? THEN TAKE THE UNIVERSE AND GRIND IT DOWN TO THE FINEST POWDER AND SIEVE IT THROUGH THE FINEST SIEVE AND THEN SHOW ME ONE ATOM OF JUSTICE, ONE MOLECULE OF MERCY. AND YET—Death waved a hand. AND YET YOU ACT AS IF THERE IS SOME IDEAL ORDER IN THE WORLD, AS IF THERE IS SOME...SOME RIGHTNESS IN THE UNIVERSE BY WHICH IT MAY BE JUDGED.
"Yes, but people have got to believe that, or what's the point—"
MY POINT EXACTLY.”
cthia wrote:Quite possibly in those times more than in any other time, you were either... 1) A believer or 2) A scientist or a scientist's flunky. You were either for or against God.
Is this the result of you not knowing anything about Rome except what the bible taught you?
Cos it sure seems like it.
Disbelief in something or someone who does exist makes them unreal?
There is no proof for the existence of any god. No experiment I can perform to arrive at a conclusion, no check, no test, no established standard. Therefore, as a scientifically minded person, I choose to err on the side of not giving any deference to god(s), yours or anyone else's.
There is, however, strong evidence that human cognition is predisposed to seeking patterns in the environment, a faculty that helps us handle the world and slice it up into recognizable pieces, but that can sometimes lead us to making connections that aren't there. It is better, in evolutionary terms, for us to see Lions, Tigers and Bears where there are none than for us to not see them where they are, so it is inevitable that sooner or later someone would come to the conclusion that there is a connection between unconnected events (like, for example, prayer and rain after a drought).