What's the chance of a Streek Drive Super Dreadnought?

psy9o wrote:The reason I said that in short distances the speed advantage of the streak drive is minimal is that in short distances it is your acceleration that is most important for travel time. It is even possible that in any travel less then week the current manticore ships are actually faster then the streak drive because they can accelerate much faster towards their top speed and can climb much faster in the hyper bands. Getting the streak drive isn't going to change that very much because the higher bands only start paying of when you can stay in them for longer times at top cruise speed. In the case of HToQ white haven would probably have much more benefit from the grayson compensators then from the streak drive. Remember that every shift to another band results in a loss of the ships actual speed.

Psy: One does not need to accelerate in a hyper band to reach the next hyper band, not to mention you lose a large portion of your velocity changing hyper bands. Therefore it is the time required to go from n-space to say, Iota. Once in Iota band its just a velocity multiplier and time required to reach 0.6c due to your acceleration. For instance kapa band(streak drive) is 40% higher velocity multiplier than even Iota. So, acceleration time curve to 60% of 0.6c or 0.36c in kappa is equivalent to .6c in Iota.

HUGE time savings with said streak drive. At what point does a high enough hyper band negate the need for wormholes? For sure the short wormholes will be used less and less, or more likely their service fees will drop. The long wormholes obviously still will far outweigh even a HUMONGOUS change in hyper generator. What this means is that small groups of systems can act as a more cohesive unit as their transportation times are decreases. It makes systems that used to be off the beaten path more economical to do business in opening up more opportunities compared to those along the major trade routes of linked wormholes.

Relax wrote:One does not need to accelerate in a hyper band to reach the next hyper band, not to mention you lose a large portion of your velocity changing hyper bands. Therefore it is the time required to go from n-space to say, Iota. Once in Iota band its just a velocity multiplier and time required to reach 0.6c due to your acceleration. For instance kapa band(streak drive) is 40% higher velocity multiplier than even Iota. So, acceleration time curve to 60% of 0.6c or 0.36c in kappa is equivalent to .6c in Iota.

Furthermore, we don't know whether the Streak Drive allows faster translation between hyper bands. If it does, that makes it a winner even when it isn't used to reach higher bands.

psy9o wrote:I don't think this a critical factor for warships for several reasons.

No, increasing your strategic mobility by 50% is almost as good as having 50% more ships, and it doesn't require paying for 50% more ships. Hence if this can be done for a cost that is as low as I think it will cost everyone who can will install the streak mod in every single new military ship.

Hi all,

I quite agree with the below, to quote Confederate General Forest (later founder of the KKK and responsible for the massacre of US Black troops at Fort Pillow, and thus not exactly untarnished), "Get there firstest with the mostest." As good a summary of wining tactics as any one ever put so succinctly.

Poker

Castenea wrote:Once the bugs are worked out Streak drive will be standard on all military ships. Remember that all military ships currently have hype generators that are bigger and/or more maintenance intensive than the main civilian ones. While the new drive is likely to be larger than the old one, the greater strategic speed is going to be worth what will need to be cut in magazine space. Getting there first is very important, think of the implications of access to the next hyper band on the final ship battle in HotQ. White Haven, could have told Honor to take her ship back for repairs, while he dealt with Thunder of God.

kzt wrote:

psy9o wrote:I don't think this a critical factor for warships for several reasons.

No, increasing your strategic mobility by 50% is almost as good as having 50% more ships, and it doesn't require paying for 50% more ships. Hence if this can be done for a cost that is as low as I think it will cost everyone who can will install the streak mod in every single new military ship.

Warships in HH aren't usually constantly moving from system to system. Most of the time warships are either on picked or patrol duty in a system or are in orbit around a planet as a defense of the planet, the reason being that a ship in hyper is a ship you can't use to defend or patrol a system. So you want to have your ship to stay in the same place as much as possible. This is not the same as on earth were a force can always be used whether it is traveling or stationary. We have seen in the second havenite war that it is almost impossible to arrive on time to help defend against a well thought out attack simply because you don't know their there until they come out of hyper and it is to late and they are already gone back in hyper when help arrives.
Also since when can ships jump in to hyper and immediately reach the highest hyper band, it is clearly stated that you need a base speed to translate in to hyper and for going up in the hyper bands. Translating bleeds of speed starting at 95% and going down with 1 or 2 % per band. So it is going to take some time to reach the highest hyper band. If ships could immediately reach the highest hyper band then the term crash translation would never be needed in HH.

No, the advantage of strategic speed is that you can mass forces very effectively. This allows you to take the covering forces off a series of points and move them somewhere else to produce a crushing level of local superiority and then move them back before your opponent can react.

And no, the typically hyperspace tactic is to transit to the band you want to move in and then accelerate. The limiting factor for velocity of translation is the UPPER limit, which is ~0.3C for the alpha wall (it's not stated if there are limits to the other bands). It's well established that you can translate to/from hyper at zero velocity.

psy9o wrote:Warships in HH aren't usually constantly moving from system to system. Most of the time warships are either on picked or patrol duty in a system or are in orbit around a planet as a defense of the planet, the reason being that a ship in hyper is a ship you can't use to defend or patrol a system. So you want to have your ship to stay in the same place as much as possible. This is not the same as on earth were a force can always be used whether it is traveling or stationary. We have seen in the second havenite war that it is almost impossible to arrive on time to help defend against a well thought out attack simply because you don't know their there until they come out of hyper and it is to late and they are already gone back in hyper when help arrives.

You put the improved hyper generators in the war ships to reduce the time it takes your nodal response force to come deal with the incursion. DBs will use this first reducing the first leg of the communications loop, but you will want the response force to also have the the new hyper generators to reduce the second leg. Especially in the early books it is explicitly stated that forces often spend hours and sometimes days maneuvering for advantage before the first shots are fired.

The ability to summon reinforcements that arrive sooner than an attacker expects can change the course of a battle, remember first Hancock.

Castenea wrote:The ability to summon reinforcements that arrive sooner than an attacker expects can change the course of a battle, remember first Hancock.

Indeed, with the new generators, First Hancock would've gone very differently, since Admiral Danislav's dreadnoughts would've already been in position when the Peeps arrived, and Admiral Parks would've come back in time to hit the main Peep force from behind while they were trapped inside the hyper limit.

psy9o wrote:Also since when can ships jump in to hyper and immediately reach the highest hyper band, it is clearly stated that you need a base speed to translate in to hyper and for going up in the hyper bands.

No one is saying "immediately".

I need to see the textev for the "base speed" you're talking about. We have seen many battles in which a DD lying in stealth is assigned the "Paul Revere" role to pop into hyper (which DW has said produces no translation signature on the n-space side provided that the impellers aren't engaged) to one of the lower bands to signal a waiting "hammer" force where to mousetrap an attacker.

In fact, I have this specific Pearl that seems to explicitly contradict the notion of a required "base speed" for a hyper tranalation

Does the transition have to be made under impeller drive or Warshawski sail, or either?

Outside a grav wave's area of influence, you do not necessarily have to be underway to make a hyper transit; it's just a little safer because the forward movement gives you more dimensional stability when you crack the wall. If, however, you are making transit into a grav wave, you must have rigged at least one set of Warshawski sails, or grav shear will destroy your vessel as you enter the grav wave's area of influence.

Of course, the entire idea of "speed" is a little fuzzy according to Relativistic mechanics, which teaches that it is impossible to state that one space ship is moving and the other stationary vs. vice versa, when both are on ballistic courses at the time the observations are made. The business of "bleeding speed" when moving between hyper bands therefore must impose a privileged frame of reference upon the universe, which violates the basic principles of Relativity.

Well even an SD(8M tons) only takes 12 minutes to charge its hyper drive, who knows about civi. So for a typical freighter, it takes all of 3 translations or is it 4? To get to their standard Delta bands. Or as little as 40 minutes out of a trip lasting a week or more... Not exactly a deal breaker.

If a streak drive does allow kappa, and 5000C multiplier, what does this say about civis only using 1000c multiplier Delta bands? Seems 5X speed increase for a freighter would blow away(compensate) any financial initial vested capital considerations in a VERY short time period. Your single Freighter just multiplied its carried trade by 4X. I took 1X out for transhipping intervals(time in port).

TheMonster wrote:

Relax wrote:One does not need to accelerate in a hyper band to reach the next hyper band, not to mention you lose a large portion of your velocity changing hyper bands. Therefore it is the time required to go from n-space to say, Iota. Once in Iota band its just a velocity multiplier and time required to reach 0.6c due to your acceleration. For instance kapa band(streak drive) is 40% higher velocity multiplier than even Iota. So, acceleration time curve to 60% of 0.6c or 0.36c in kappa is equivalent to .6c in Iota.

Furthermore, we don't know whether the Streak Drive allows faster translation between hyper bands. If it does, that makes it a winner even when it isn't used to reach higher bands.