Honorverse Humor or lack thereof.

Spiders

"How stealthy are we? We've been parked in Sol's orbit stealing half-cent rounding errors from the League for years. They'll never detect us. Though that's not saying much. They couldn't see a neon sign if it was parked right in front of them."

Pinching Pennies


"Honor, you are cheating the system when you claim exempt from junction fees while on vacation. You are not always traveling to Grayson in your capacity as a Steadholder. When traveling to Sphinx, you are not exempt."

"Oh come on Beth!"

"Stop being cheap Honor. It isn't like you can't afford to pay the transit fees."

"You know I read a lot Beth. All of Earth's billionaires learned to squeeze a dollar and pinch a penny."

"Honor!!!"

...


"Well can you at least validate my parking?"

penny wrote: Pinching Pennies


"Honor, you are cheating the system when you claim exempt from junction fees while on vacation. You are not always traveling to Grayson in your capacity as a Steadholder. When traveling to Sphinx, you are not exempt."

There's no junction transit from the MBS to Grayson.

ThinksMarkedly wrote:

penny wrote: Pinching Pennies


"Honor, you are cheating the system when you claim exempt from junction fees while on vacation. You are not always traveling to Grayson in your capacity as a Steadholder. When traveling to Sphinx, you are not exempt."

There's no junction transit from the MBS to Grayson.

Thanks, I guess that's how Honor's illegal exemptions were discovered during one of the junction's audits.

Anyway, you are missing the big picture. The thing to remember is that when Steadholder Harrington travels she is immune to junction fees and all of her parking is validated. As a Steadholder, Honor is a head of state. She is immune to paying toll charges just as all heads of state are. Just as the Queen and probably all of the royal family are immune to junction fees. And taxes for that matter. Just as it is in England. Mayhew certainly does not pay transit fees. Neither does Honor when she travels in her capacity as a Steadholder. So, what does that mean across the board for Honor?

What it means is that Honor has so many people to see and things to do. Honor's plate is so full that she even has people to do.*

In her capacity as the Salamander, she is quite busy and can hardly find the time to visit Sphinx. Let alone to visit Grayson. So when she finally gets a chance to shed the Queen’s uniform in favor of a sexy gown to travel to Grayson, she is traveling in her capacity as a Steadholder. Which means she can dart to Sphinx for a day or so before she decides to head to Grayson. She can dart through to Beowulf for a day or two after -- or even before -- her visit to Sphinx. And she can dart through any junction as many times as she wants, back and forth, like a teenager burning gas. Point being, as Steadholder Harrington, Honor is immune to fees while in her Grayson persona. But as Honor Harrington she is not. Therefore, Honor Harrington traveling to Grayson by way of a detour to another system through the junction is not free.

But I'm with Honor. She's earned it. Although it's
still cheating the system.

* Also, while in her Steadholder persona, any contingent traveling with Honor is also immune to fees, even if Honor sends one of the contingents through to Beowulf on a quick errand. But in her capacity as Honor Harrington, she could not legally get the junction fees waived and the parking validated for anyone when they were helping her to fight Young, his hired hands, and his many cronies.

Plus, even though she is wearing her gorgeous flowing Grayson gown, claiming exemption while using a junction should also be illegal if it is not connected to her travel to Grayson as a Steadholder. IOW if she is simply traveling to Grayson while on vacation. How many employees do you know, including yourself, who have written off trips as business trips when they were not? Honor's only human. And she's complicated.

"S'times I get the many hats mixed up Beth."


High Ridge: "Make sure that witch pays transit fees if she uses a junction. She's been banished. She isn't travelin' in her Steadholder persona!"

penny wrote:Anyway, you are missing the big picture. The thing to remember is that when Steadholder Harrington travels she is immune to junction fees and all of her parking is validated. As a Steadholder, Honor is a head of state. She is immune to paying toll charges just as all heads of state are. Just as the Queen and probably all of the royal family are immune to junction fees. And taxes for that matter. Just as it is in England. Mayhew certainly does not pay transit fees. Neither does Honor when she travels in her capacity as a Steadholder. So, what does that mean across the board for Honor?

What? When did immunity extend to not having to pay for things? Immunity may work when you're charged with theft and thus the prosecution may be unable to bring a case forward. This would mean she could stand up after her dinner at Dempsey's and walk out, without paying the bill, and Dempsey's may be unable to collect. This would mean Dempsey's would refuse to serve her the next time (or, well, if it were anyone but her). And this only works if she's dining alone, otherwise Dempsey's may want to collect from her dinner companions.

I guess it would be similar to paying taxes: if she refuses, the Crown can't bring a prosecution case on someone who's immune. But the Crown may begin refusing services to someone who isn't paying taxes anyway, thus making their life a bureaucratic hell.

And thus, if she refuses to pay for the Junction fees when she goes on a jaunt to see her family on Beowulf, the Junction traffic control could start refusing to slot her in the next time. Or, if it were anyone but her; I'm sure every single bureaucrat in the Crown Government would think "this is above my paygrade" until it reaches either the Prime Minister or the Queen/Empress herself.

What it means is that Honor has so many people to see and things to do. Honor's plate is so full that she even has people to do.*

Visiting Basilisk to see how the Stilts are doing would be official business; visiting Gregor to go talk to von Habenstrage would be too, as would transiting to Trevor's Star to go to Haven, or Beowulf to speak to the Board of Directors.

In her capacity as the Salamander, she is quite busy and can hardly find the time to visit Sphinx. Let alone to visit Grayson. So when she finally gets a chance to shed the Queen’s uniform in favor of a sexy gown to travel to Grayson, she is traveling in her capacity as a Steadholder. Which means she can dart to Sphinx for a day or so before she decides to head to Grayson. She can dart through to Beowulf for a day or two after -- or even before -- her visit to Sphinx. And she can dart through any junction as many times as she wants, back and forth, like a teenager burning gas. Point being, as Steadholder Harrington, Honor is immune to fees while in her Grayson persona. But as Honor Harrington she is not. Therefore, Honor Harrington traveling to Grayson by way of a detour to another system through the junction is not free.

As a foreign head of state, she's not immune to fees per se. Maybe the Manticore-Grayson as well as the full Alliance or Union treaties do waive Junction fees for official government business of all members of the Alliance, in which case she would have to pay nothing. That does not mean immunity, it means the charge is zero.

If the charge is not zero and she refuses to pay, then the Crown may charge the Sword, and Benjamin Mayhew would probably pay.

But I'm with Honor. She's earned it. Although it's
still cheating the system.

And she's also got a lot of money and, pardon the pun, Honor has honour, so she would pay her bills.

* Also, while in her Steadholder persona, any contingent traveling with Honor is also immune to fees, even if Honor sends one of the contingents through to Beowulf on a quick errand. But in her capacity as Honor Harrington, she could not legally get the junction fees waived and the parking validated for anyone when they were helping her to fight Young, his hired hands, and his many cronies.

First, the fee is probably charged per vessel to the owner/operator of the vessel, not to each person aboard. In a commercial liner, that's probably included in their fare, though: if you buy an aeroplane ticket and bother to look at the fine lines of the air fare, you'll see all sorts of small fees for airport use, overflying other countries, etc. If she's travelling as her Duchess persona aboard her yacht, she is responsible for all fees; if she's flying her Steading flag, maybe the treaty (as I said above) waives all fees. But this is not immunity.

Second, her entourage is not head of state. They're her staff. Whether anyone but the diplomat gets immunity is subject of treaty. We know her Guardsmen are guaranteed immunity for any acts done in her protection or through her orders, but not for acts of their own volition. Moreover, the Steadholder is responsible for the acts: remember when she wanted to send Andrew to blow up her statue? Andrew would have been immune, but she wouldn't. Plus, the statue was fully insured and the artist would have been happy to be commissioned a replacement.

Plus, even though she is wearing her gorgeous flowing Grayson gown, claiming exemption while using a junction should also be illegal if it is not connected to her travel to Grayson as a Steadholder. IOW if she is simply traveling to Grayson while on vacation. How many employees do you know, including yourself, who have written off trips as business trips when they were not? Honor's only human. And she's complicated.

What I have done is extend a business trip so I could get vacation, but the extra days came out of my pocket. I just didn't have to pay for the air fare. This is well within the company's Code of Conduct, as is bringing a spouse or significant other, so long as you cover their expenses.

More importantly, I am not (and especially was not when I was younger) as wealthy as Honor is. Someone who can afford her own yacht and all the costs associated with maintaining it won't squibble over a few thousand Manticore dollars of Junction fees.

High Ridge: "Make sure that witch pays transit fees if she uses a junction. She's been banished. She isn't travelin' in her Steadholder persona!"

And this is something not even High Ridge would have been able to touch: her Steadholder persona would have been subject of the treaty of Alliance with Grayson and they weren't ready to abrogate the treaty completely at this time. And her Duchess persona was not something they would ever dream of touching because of the precedent it would set for their own titles and privileges.

ThinksMarkedly wrote:

penny wrote:Anyway, you are missing the big picture. The thing to remember is that when Steadholder Harrington travels she is immune to junction fees and all of her parking is validated. As a Steadholder, Honor is a head of state. She is immune to paying toll charges just as all heads of state are. Just as the Queen and probably all of the royal family are immune to junction fees. And taxes for that matter. Just as it is in England. Mayhew certainly does not pay transit fees. Neither does Honor when she travels in her capacity as a Steadholder. So, what does that mean across the board for Honor?

What? When did immunity extend to not having to pay for things? Immunity may work when you're charged with theft and thus the prosecution may be unable to bring a case forward. This would mean she could stand up after her dinner at Dempsey's and walk out, without paying the bill, and Dempsey's may be unable to collect. This would mean Dempsey's would refuse to serve her the next time (or, well, if it were anyone but her). And this only works if she's dining alone, otherwise Dempsey's may want to collect from her dinner companions.

I guess it would be similar to paying taxes: if she refuses, the Crown can't bring a prosecution case on someone who's immune. But the Crown may begin refusing services to someone who isn't paying taxes anyway, thus making their life a bureaucratic hell.

And thus, if she refuses to pay for the Junction fees when she goes on a jaunt to see her family on Beowulf, the Junction traffic control could start refusing to slot her in the next time. Or, if it were anyone but her; I'm sure every single bureaucrat in the Crown Government would think "this is above my paygrade" until it reaches either the Prime Minister or the Queen/Empress herself.

What it means is that Honor has so many people to see and things to do. Honor's plate is so full that she even has people to do.*

Visiting Basilisk to see how the Stilts are doing would be official business; visiting Gregor to go talk to von Habenstrage would be too, as would transiting to Trevor's Star to go to Haven, or Beowulf to speak to the Board of Directors.

In her capacity as the Salamander, she is quite busy and can hardly find the time to visit Sphinx. Let alone to visit Grayson. So when she finally gets a chance to shed the Queen’s uniform in favor of a sexy gown to travel to Grayson, she is traveling in her capacity as a Steadholder. Which means she can dart to Sphinx for a day or so before she decides to head to Grayson. She can dart through to Beowulf for a day or two after -- or even before -- her visit to Sphinx. And she can dart through any junction as many times as she wants, back and forth, like a teenager burning gas. Point being, as Steadholder Harrington, Honor is immune to fees while in her Grayson persona. But as Honor Harrington she is not. Therefore, Honor Harrington traveling to Grayson by way of a detour to another system through the junction is not free.

As a foreign head of state, she's not immune to fees per se. Maybe the Manticore-Grayson as well as the full Alliance or Union treaties do waive Junction fees for official government business of all members of the Alliance, in which case she would have to pay nothing. That does not mean immunity, it means the charge is zero.

If the charge is not zero and she refuses to pay, then the Crown may charge the Sword, and Benjamin Mayhew would probably pay.

But I'm with Honor. She's earned it. Although it's
still cheating the system.

And she's also got a lot of money and, pardon the pun, Honor has honour, so she would pay her bills.

* Also, while in her Steadholder persona, any contingent traveling with Honor is also immune to fees, even if Honor sends one of the contingents through to Beowulf on a quick errand. But in her capacity as Honor Harrington, she could not legally get the junction fees waived and the parking validated for anyone when they were helping her to fight Young, his hired hands, and his many cronies.

First, the fee is probably charged per vessel to the owner/operator of the vessel, not to each person aboard. In a commercial liner, that's probably included in their fare, though: if you buy an aeroplane ticket and bother to look at the fine lines of the air fare, you'll see all sorts of small fees for airport use, overflying other countries, etc. If she's travelling as her Duchess persona aboard her yacht, she is responsible for all fees; if she's flying her Steading flag, maybe the treaty (as I said above) waives all fees. But this is not immunity.

Second, her entourage is not head of state. They're her staff. Whether anyone but the diplomat gets immunity is subject of treaty. We know her Guardsmen are guaranteed immunity for any acts done in her protection or through her orders, but not for acts of their own volition. Moreover, the Steadholder is responsible for the acts: remember when she wanted to send Andrew to blow up her statue? Andrew would have been immune, but she wouldn't. Plus, the statue was fully insured and the artist would have been happy to be commissioned a replacement.

Plus, even though she is wearing her gorgeous flowing Grayson gown, claiming exemption while using a junction should also be illegal if it is not connected to her travel to Grayson as a Steadholder. IOW if she is simply traveling to Grayson while on vacation. How many employees do you know, including yourself, who have written off trips as business trips when they were not? Honor's only human. And she's complicated.

What I have done is extend a business trip so I could get vacation, but the extra days came out of my pocket. I just didn't have to pay for the air fare. This is well within the company's Code of Conduct, as is bringing a spouse or significant other, so long as you cover their expenses.

More importantly, I am not (and especially was not when I was younger) as wealthy as Honor is. Someone who can afford her own yacht and all the costs associated with maintaining it won't squibble over a few thousand Manticore dollars of Junction fees.

High Ridge: "Make sure that witch pays transit fees if she uses a junction. She's been banished. She isn't travelin' in her Steadholder persona!"

And this is something not even High Ridge would have been able to touch: her Steadholder persona would have been subject of the treaty of Alliance with Grayson and they weren't ready to abrogate the treaty completely at this time. And her Duchess persona was not something they would ever dream of touching because of the precedent it would set for their own titles and privileges.

I did not literally mean immune. The Steadholder is immune because she is exempt. Immunity by exemption. Keep it in context.

Bottom line. Foreign dignataries and diplomats do not pay toll fees. And why should they? Stopping at toll booths is inconvenient and unsecure. If I am traveling in a motorcade, I am not going to stop at toll booths and give some assassin tactical access to me. A superpower like the US does not have to charge the Queen of England or the PM of England toll charges. That would be so petty, childish and embarrassing to me as an American. Are we that cheap?

Besides, if they come most likely we invited them and or we mutually benefit from their visit. But they will never have to pay to accept our invitation. “I am the Queen of England, I have to pay to come to America?”

Even cops get free donuts, firemen get free movie tickets and senior citizens get free drinks. Heads of State get free junction transits.

BTW, the "immunity" from paying toll charges has some merit. Technically, diplomats have immunity from prosecution. They generally cannot get away with murder in most cases, but then again they are immune from prosecution. Depends on if their government backs them. But if a diplomat is immune from prosecution of a serious crime, what kind of trouble do you think he's going to get into for charging through your toll booth? Especially when it is a security risk.

penny wrote:Bottom line. Foreign dignataries and diplomats do not pay toll fees. And why should they? Stopping at toll booths is inconvenient and unsecure. If I am traveling in a motorcade, I am not going to stop at toll booths and give some assassin tactical access to me. A superpower like the US does not have to charge the Queen of England or the PM of England toll charges. That would be so petty, childish and embarrassing to me as an American. Are we that cheap?
[cut]
BTW, the "immunity" from paying toll charges has some merit. Technically, diplomats have immunity from prosecution. They generally cannot get away with murder in most cases, but then again they are immune from prosecution. Depends on if their government backs them. But if a diplomat is immune from prosecution of a serious crime, what kind of trouble do you think he's going to get into for charging through your toll booth? Especially when it is a security risk.

Indeed, but in this case the motorcade will often have communicated with the advance beaters and opened the toll booth barriers so the motorcade can pass through without having to stop. The booth operators don't have to know who the foreign dignitary is, that they're exempt, and how many cars are in their motorcade. All this is coordinated ahead of time, sometimes with even clearing the roads of other vehicles for the same security purposes.

So if a foreign dignitary is going to use the Junction and not spring the visit as a surprise, this is all going to be handled by the Foreign Office and probably with an RMN escort. Even if they do arrive as a surprise, the Foreign Office would be notified and can send a reply back within half an hour. For the foreseeable future, I expect that Honor's yacht will have an RMN escort in the Junction zone whether she is using her Duchess, Steadholder, or retired admiral personae.

The one dignitary I expect to never avail themselves of such regalia is Queen Berry. She'd sic the Minister of the Posterior on you instead and she has a constitutional right to banish one person per year.

Will the dynamic duo miss the latest iterations of the MAN's missile?


Same Bat-Time! Same Bat-Station!

The Verdict

The captain of the courier boat sued Harrington for destroying his beta nodes in an unsafe maneuver which kicked off the First Battle of Basilisk.

The captain of the courier boat was charged with parking too close to a fire hydrant; Harrington.

Invading Darius
MAN chatter on an unsecure channel

“Oh My Tester Milady. That is a huge horde of LACs! And they sure do look funny.”

“Captain, I’ve decoded a lot of chatter on an unsecure channel. They are referring to the LACs as a mess of smitts???”

“Messerschmitts!!!???”