Masada and Maccabeans in Honor of the Queen

Previously I asked whether the author officially informed us that the original religion is indeed Jewish. If so, that very well may explain why Houseman was so adamant that trade would be an option. That would make Houseman's mistake a very honest one.

It would also make Grayson the State of Israel.

penny wrote:Hi Bradman. I must admit I wasn't aware Masada and the Maccabeans, and by implication Grayson, were officially (by decree of the author) Jewish.

penny wrote:Previously I asked whether the author officially informed us that the original religion is indeed Jewish. If so, that very well may explain why Houseman was so adamant that trade would be an option. That would make Houseman's mistake a very honest one.

It would also make Grayson the State of Israel.

We do not know Houseman's religion (he is from Manticore which has numerous religions); but he is an economist from a liberal university, so his politics are driven by an egotistical view of the power of his knowledge (not by a racial stereotype).

ThinksMarkedly has already pointed out that the Grayson religion is an offshoot of Christianity.

A little bit of history: Bradman started this thread with a complaint that the use of the names "Masada" and "Maccabeans" in HotQ by the Faithful defamed important elements of Jewish history on Earth. Never was it implied that the Faithful were themselves Jewish, only that they were bad people misusing historic names.

penny wrote:Previously I asked whether the author officially informed us that the original religion is indeed Jewish. If so, that very well may explain why Houseman was so adamant that trade would be an option. That would make Houseman's mistake a very honest one.

It would also make Grayson the State of Israel.

The Grayson "Church of Humanity Unchained" is an offspring of the Christian religion, adding the "Book of the New Way" by Austin Grayson as third book to the old and new testaments. They left Earth to escape technology (Yes, we know how well that worked out.)

The Masadan church is an offspring of the "Church of Humanity Unchained", thus indirectly also of christian origin, and only related to the Jewish religion insofar as Christianity is an offspring of Jewish religion.

tlb wrote:

penny wrote:Hi Bradman. I must admit I wasn't aware Masada and the Maccabeans, and by implication Grayson, were officially (by decree of the author) Jewish.

penny wrote:Previously I asked whether the author officially informed us that the original religion is indeed Jewish. If so, that very well may explain why Houseman was so adamant that trade would be an option. That would make Houseman's mistake a very honest one.

It would also make Grayson the State of Israel.

We do not know Houseman's religion (he is from Manticore which has numerous religions); but he is an economist from a liberal university, so his politics are driven by an egotistical view of the power of his knowledge (not by a racial stereotype).

ThinksMarkedly has already pointed out that the Grayson religion is an offshoot of Christianity.

A little bit of history: Bradman started this thread with a complaint that the use of the names "Masada" and "Maccabeans" in HotQ by the Faithful defamed important elements of Jewish history on Earth. Never was it implied that the Faithful were themselves Jewish, only that they were bad people misusing historic names.

Sigh.

Saying that Jews are business-minded is not a racial stereotype. Truth is not a stereotype. I have known many Jews. From a very young age of about 5-yrs old. I have never known a Jew that was not business-minded. And the fact that they certainly like trading.

Besides, you misunderstood what I said. I said, since someone else misinterpreted Masada's actual religion, then perhaps Houseman did too. He didn't exactly shine when doing his homework.

penny wrote:Besides, you misunderstood what I said. I said, since someone else misinterpreted Masada's actual religion, then perhaps Houseman did too. He didn't exactly shine when doing his homework

Houseman thought religion was irrelevant compared to economics, which should trump everything in his mind. So he did NOT misinterpret Masada's religion, as much as completely ignored it.

PS: Who exactly did you think was the "someone else" who misinterpreted Masada's actual religion?

tlb wrote:

penny wrote:Besides, you misunderstood what I said. I said, since someone else misinterpreted Masada's actual religion, then perhaps Houseman did too. He didn't exactly shine when doing his homework

Houseman thought religion was irrelevant compared to economics, which should trump everything in his mind. So he did NOT misinterpret Masada's religion, as much as completely ignored it.

PS: Who exactly did you think was the "someone else" who misinterpreted Masada's actual religion?

Even if true that he respected or revered religion less than he did economics (and/or understood religion less than he did economics) did not mean that he did not use the info about the religion as part of his plan.

Bradman, he who created this thread misinterpreted the religion. And we, as readers, probably know as much about Grayson's actual religion as Houseman. Especially if he did not respect religion. And since the MBS is a long way from the Endicott System. Who says Housman actually respected his own religion.

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penny wrote:Sigh.

Saying that Jews are business-minded is not a racial stereotype. Truth is not a stereotype. I have known many Jews. From a very young age of about 5-yrs old. I have never known a Jew that was not business-minded. And the fact that they certainly like trading.

I'll just say that that hasn't been my experience. I've also known quite a few Jewish people, and while some of them are business-minded, quite a few are not.

Jonathan_S wrote:

penny wrote:Sigh.

Saying that Jews are business-minded is not a racial stereotype. Truth is not a stereotype. I have known many Jews. From a very young age of about 5-yrs old. I have never known a Jew that was not business-minded. And the fact that they certainly like trading.

I'll just say that that hasn't been my experience. I've also known quite a few Jewish people, and while some of them are business-minded, quite a few are not.

I have never met a single one who isn't business-minded. I have met those who inherited wealth who let someone else worry about it.

Believe it or not, all Black people don't like watermelon either. They are simply rare exceptions to the rule.

penny wrote:Bradman, he who created this thread misinterpreted the religion. And we, as readers, probably know as much about Grayson's actual religion as Houseman. Especially if he did not respect religion. And since the MBS is a long way from the Endicott System. Who says Housman actually respected his own religion.

Since Bradman was complaining about demeaning Jewish history by having bad people misuse the names of Masada and the Maccabeans, I think it is incorrect to say that he misinterpreted the Faithful's religion. He never said that anyone at Grayson or Masada was Jewish, that was where you leaped to a conclusion.

Houseman's problem seems to be that he totally believes in the economic ideal of the rational consumer: an economic concept that presupposes that when making a choice, consumers will always focus primarily on the maximisation of their private benefits. In decision making, rational consumers select the option that will bring the most utility and satisfaction to them.

As an economist the only satisfaction he sees is in material benefit and totally misses the satisfaction that can be had by grinding your enemies beneath your heel.

Following his Peace without Conquest speech, on the way back to the white house, LBJ said, confidently of his plan to create a new TVA along the Mekong, “Old Ho can’t turn me down”, convinced that the obvious economic advantages would compel Ho Chi Min to agree.

Narator: “LBJ, like most Democrats, had no idea how to handle a man or a people whose actions and motivations were based on faith or ideals, not on how it enriched him personally or his people. And Old Ho could and did turn him down, confident that he would eventually win thw war.”