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why does zilwicki know about bolthole?

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Re: why does zilwicki know about bolthole?
Post by ThinksMarkedly   » Fri Sep 01, 2023 9:29 pm

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Theemile wrote:The big question is when was this statement made - remember, the RoH lost 50% of it's systems from the height of the PRH. And most of the lost growth was the systems towards (and past) Trevor's star that had recently been captured by the PRH, with systems like Seaford 9 (and probably Barnet) abandoned because they only had military value, with the only population supporting the military facilities.

If this statement was originally made at the height of the PRH, the Calvin wormhole could be just outside the central 1/3rd of the RHN. not centralized, but not on the outskirts either.


I agree with you the most likely loss in the RoH were prosperous systems. The most likely source of that would be wealthy and strong neighbours, especially those with wormholes. That is, those closer to Manticore and Erewhon.

I do think the PRH would have grown before and after the discovery of this wormhole out in the other direction, like La Martine. Those systems were probably very poorly defended, so they probably got absorbed into the PRH by simply having strong words. That those additions may have been a net negative to the Peep economy may not have played a role if the militants in the Legislaturalist Government insisted. And those systems are also likely not to have left the Republic afterwards: they wouldn't have been too oppressed and the economic turnaround starting with Pierre's reforms and continuing with Pritchart.

But we don't know for sure.

Anyway, yes, the Calvin Wormhole might be now closer to a greater proportion of the systems in the RoH. And yet I think that's a distinction without a difference. Haven itself is probably the single largest contributor and the oldest daughter colonies the next in line.
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Re: why does zilwicki know about bolthole?
Post by SharkHunter   » Fri Sep 01, 2023 10:01 pm

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Back to the original question about why Zilwicki knows what he knows... besides being a super spook, keep in mind that his teammate is almost on a short retainer directly to the President of the Republic of Haven. So after he and Victor Cachat pop-out halfway expecting Capitol Fleet to be floating dust-bunnies, but no Admiral Harrington-Alexander, don't you think it obvious that certain clearances might have been lowered <i>slightly</i> when Prichart sends them home to Manticore?

I think it is a given that all the smart people in the room know that neither Cachat nor Zilwicki will spill beans and maybe not even to each other for any reason short of "this star system /planet will die if we don't..." and then they would argue about it. AKA no danger of leaks through former Captain Z., correct?
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All my posts are YMMV, IMHO, and welcoming polite discussion, extension, and rebuttal. This is the HonorVerse, after all
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Re: why does zilwicki know about bolthole?
Post by ZVar   » Mon Sep 04, 2023 2:21 am

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HappyLibra wrote:
markusschaber wrote:I am not sure whether Zilwicki actually knows where bolthole is. Knowing about its existence, purpose and maybe even capacity does not imply knowing about its location.


Ok but this is strange, not knowing the location.



Why? Do you know where the Pentagon is? I mean can you drive to it without using a map?
We know it's in Washington DC right? Well no, it's across the river in Virginia actually.

That's just one example I'm sure I could pull up tons of others.
Fort Liberty?
Fort Hood?
Multiple others.
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Re: why does zilwicki know about bolthole?
Post by Daryl   » Mon Sep 04, 2023 3:10 am

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The disadvantage of an autocratic state is that the leader can have favourites and direct unofficial underlings, with the potential for corruption.
The advantage of an autocratic state is that the leader can have favourites and direct unofficial underlings, which enables quicker and more effective action.
By the western world's (in OTL) standards, both Haven and Manticore are midway between a participative democracy and an autocracy, perhaps more on the democracy side with free press and active oppositions, but with a capable and assertive Monarch and President they are more autocratic than we are. Imagine Biden or King Charles acting like those in the Honorverse?.
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Re: why does zilwicki know about bolthole?
Post by Jonathan_S   » Mon Sep 04, 2023 11:06 am

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I wonder if Zilwicki, in his guise as a spook, was involved in tracking down rumors of Bolthole before the end of the wars with Haven?

That might have put him sufficiently in the loop to still be aware that it became a major post-war Grand Alliance yard - without necessarily being aware of it's R&D efforts, where it was, or exactly what designs it was building.
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