Axelrod and SKM relationship

It would be POSSIBLE for Axelrod to set up it's own station at the wormhole and keep all traffic from going into the binary system. Possibly citing ongoing civil disturbances and terrorism by the former monarchy that was running interplanetary pirate operation which was disrupted by the Dutch of (your paying we will provide troops)

"We are still chasing down the pirates hiding on-planets. It's not safe for extra-system transients to land on Manticore or the other habitat planets at this time but we have provided a transfer platform relative to the wormhole for drop-shipments to or from Manticore or warehousing of transhipments beyond Manticore or into the League.. Please bear with us while we resolve these ongoing problems"

Nobody gets a close look, everything coming out is censored, Shipping is all handled by Manticore Shipping and Warehousing Corp.
Heck, how long would it be from the successful defeat of the RMN and the submission of the House of Winton- after which dam near everybody in the succession or senior governmental positions and all of at least the RMN or RMA officers are "removed" from service (Axelrod will vanish them) and a cadre of Axelrod administrators and ground troops they control will in possession of the majority of the military and police services.
Don't forget the mercenary ships both hanging around the inhabited planets. It doesn't have to be the same people who took down the system, it can be a new of Axelrods partners to get the actual mercenaries out of the play- heck, the mercenaries could all have accidents and be gone.

Cue Jim Croce's "You don't Mess Around with Jim"

Find out where it's at
And it's not hustlin' people strange to you

If you had to hire someone to take down a multi-planet system with a semi-modern navy because you don't have that kind of firepower, what do you think these people you hired can do to your corporate HQ if you motivate them?

kzt wrote:Cue Jim Croce's "You don't Mess Around with Jim"

Find out where it's at
And it's not hustlin' people strange to you

If you had to hire someone to take down a multi-planet system with a semi-modern navy because you don't have that kind of firepower, what do you think these people you hired can do to your corporate HQ if you motivate them?

Axelrod, for all the name is splashed though the books, wasn't sharing it's name with the mercenaries. We only see the name in Lynn's thoughts or in bits of shaping of backstory/explanations.
On the other hand, Axelrod did Not succeed in the attack on Manticore, the mercy were never hanging around as hired muscle int the Manticore system as threats on a subject population or guards against some other star-nation showing up to dispute the story .....AFTER.....the wormhole had been fully mapped and transited. By that time it would have been a much more subdued Manticorian population with most of it's resistance bled out of it by Alexrod's determined efforts to eradicate anyone who would cause problems or buck the new system.

Even subcontracting out the merc fleet they actually used for the conquest out on "other" ventures doesn't mean that they go out of their way to kill those people off. Just get them off and busy while more stable (controllable and probably photo-Alignment navy) military ships come in to take up the routine patrolling and protection of the system. Sure, Axlerod would be very happy that actual witnesses to what was done would be lost in other profit making operations but that's just cost of doing business and the mercenary business is dangerous. The New people who are around when someone like Haven or even Beowulf take notice and come looking, will trim the new protectors of the system have become the new Manticore SDF, all nice and legal with not a wiff of former mercenary activity. Nothing to see here, what are you in the market for from our range of productes

Brigade XO wrote:<snip>. The New people who are around when someone like Haven or even Beowulf take notice and come looking, will trim the new protectors of the system have become the new Manticore SDF, all nice and legal with not a wiff of former mercenary activity. Nothing to see here, what are you in the market for from our range of productes

After all, Manticore's bought an "insta fleet" twice in the past, the first 4 Frigates were bought and staffed by Manticore Colony Limited on Earth, then the fleet used against the Brotherhood was bought/hired by the same offices. Neither were staffed by Manticore colony natives, but mercs hired for the duration (with citizenship bonuses). So why not a third go round when the overaged fleet 2 gets trashed?

The harder the mission seems the more it will cost. In cash. In advance. I suspect that this will cost about what building the same fleet will cost due to the estimated munitions, damage, lost vessels, payments to next of kin and the profit margin.

So it's a LOT of cash.

Do they have the money to buy a fleet in an off-world bank? Does anyone outside the system have the authority to negotiate this contract and get the bank to release the money? Can the 'new government' get the bank to give them the money instead?

Brigade XO wrote:Axelrod, for all the name is splashed though the books, wasn't sharing it's name with the mercenaries. We only see the name in Lynn's thoughts or in bits of shaping of backstory/explanations.

While true, it didn't completely work. Cutler Gensonne did find out who was paying him, after all. Which was one of the reasons that Llyn organised for the ambush in the Danak System, so he could get the Volsungs eliminated... No, wait, Llyn organised that before Gensonne told him he knew about Axelrod, though that did settle his fate.

kzt wrote:The harder the mission seems the more it will cost. In cash. In advance. I suspect that this will cost about what building the same fleet will cost due to the estimated munitions, damage, lost vessels, payments to next of kin and the profit margin.

So it's a LOT of cash.

Do they have the money to buy a fleet in an off-world bank? Does anyone outside the system have the authority to negotiate this contract and get the bank to release the money? Can the 'new government' get the bank to give them the money instead?

The 4 frigates were probably cheap, comparatively. Their purpose was to prevent any claim-jumpers, who would not be expected to have the military means to go against any prepared defences. The worst case would be a pirate or warlord who had acquired a surplus warship or bolted on some rail gun or box missile launcher to a yacht, hence 4 warships.

The battlecruisers that Star Kingdom bought to fight the Free Brotherhood would have been more expensive. Those were, albeit somewhat old, top of the line ships that could be had at the time. Buying one of them is a considerable investment; buying 9 of them indicates commitment, which is not completely explained. Why did they need 9 battlecruisers to defend against the Brotherhood? They did set out to eliminate the threat once and for all, especially after the effects in the Ramon system came to light, but it doesn't strike me that they neeeded battlecruisers for this.

And yet the Free Brotherhood was not a military power. Well-armed, yes, but not a military power. So I agree that buying another insta-fleet to fight the well-funded mercenaries or, worse, star nation that Axelrod could buy would be very expensive.

But what choice did they have? For the earlier occasions, Manticore had no native ship-building capabilities. By this time, they had most of it, though not for all components (impellers, in particular), so it would be still expensive to buy those from a third party; they might as well buy a whole, second-hand ship. What we will probably see, though, is that by the time the wormhole is (officially) discovered, that will have changed a lot and Manticore will be building modern battlecruisers and battleships.

ThinksMarkedly wrote:

kzt wrote:The harder the mission seems the more it will cost. In cash. In advance. I suspect that this will cost about what building the same fleet will cost due to the estimated munitions, damage, lost vessels, payments to next of kin and the profit margin.

So it's a LOT of cash.

Do they have the money to buy a fleet in an off-world bank? Does anyone outside the system have the authority to negotiate this contract and get the bank to release the money? Can the 'new government' get the bank to give them the money instead?

The 4 frigates were probably cheap, comparatively. Their purpose was to prevent any claim-jumpers, who would not be expected to have the military means to go against any prepared defences. The worst case would be a pirate or warlord who had acquired a surplus warship or bolted on some rail gun or box missile launcher to a yacht, hence 4 warships.

The battlecruisers that Star Kingdom bought to fight the Free Brotherhood would have been more expensive. Those were, albeit somewhat old, top of the line ships that could be had at the time. Buying one of them is a considerable investment; buying 9 of them indicates commitment, which is not completely explained. Why did they need 9 battlecruisers to defend against the Brotherhood? They did set out to eliminate the threat once and for all, especially after the effects in the Ramon system came to light, but it doesn't strike me that they neeeded battlecruisers for this.

And yet the Free Brotherhood was not a military power. Well-armed, yes, but not a military power. So I agree that buying another insta-fleet to fight the well-funded mercenaries or, worse, star nation that Axelrod could buy would be very expensive.

But what choice did they have? For the earlier occasions, Manticore had no native ship-building capabilities. By this time, they had most of it, though not for all components (impellers, in particular), so it would be still expensive to buy those from a third party; they might as well buy a whole, second-hand ship. What we will probably see, though, is that by the time the wormhole is (officially) discovered, that will have changed a lot and Manticore will be building modern battlecruisers and battleships.

Again, the full story about the Free Brotherhood would be an interesting short story. It panicked a young Manticore enough to purchase a potent fleet, and hire 15,000 professionals to man it (and allow those 15,000 people into their small culture.)

If Alexrod was successful with the taking of Manticore, anybody who had questions about the size and composition of the latest iteration of the Manticore SDF would be answers from the existing ruling government of Manticore....if they even bothered to answer..... but what was an outside power to do? Send an Commission to monitor the change?...really? Under who's authority? Haven as itself? They would have been the probable 1st of the more-or-less local Star Nations to discover Haven had changed management. Beowulf? --so much further away and probably not until the Wormhole was transited and a deal struck (with Axelrod driving it) so there wouldn't be any need (nor want) of Beowulf calling on anything in the League to handle it's own local business.

How long is the transit from Beowulf to Manticore via hyperspace? Where was the traffic from even Beowulf to the Haven Quadrant routed though. Would ANY of it come though Manticore without the wormhole?

Too may questions were are not likely to answer.

Brigade XO wrote:How long is the transit from Beowulf to Manticore via hyperspace?

At that time, given that even warships can only climb as high as the Beta bands? About 6 months each way.