When you're a hammer: MAlign blind spots

Francesca's death - what actually happened to her- and the LRPB's involvement in placing children with families appeared to be something both known and in various levels understood inside the Onion and apparently the Alignment in general.
The placement is a socializing operation with bonding to nominal parents with the support it provides. It also seems that even in families like the McBrides, since they are Alph Lines, they expect "enhancements" to their children. So IF Jack, Zack and their sisters were body births of their mother, each was modified in various ways by the Alignment and done so with the knowlege and approval of the parents. This is all part of the Detweiler Plan and the willing participants who have been involved (and indoctrinated --yeah, loaded word) in the ongoing uplift have bought into it and have since they were old enough to be brought inside.
Herlander became fully attached to his Daughter. His wife, which she may have been attached, took the Alignment/pragmatic view and since she KNEW that this was partially an experiment to see if the problems of this particular "line of investigation" had been resolved and there was a good chance that Francesca was going begin to crash and be treated as a failed experiment--which she turned out to be- and was ok with that. If I want to be harsh, the wife ultimately took the position (in her own mind, not saying this to her husband) that this was a well liked pet but was no longer a viable experiment and was falling apart as a human with a mind and so was CULLED as you would so with such creatures.
Culled is a telling word. Filled with rational decisions based on set criteria and devoid of actual feelings when applied to humans. Francesca became damaged goods, was going to get much worse and like a lab rat that developed a medical problem outside the parameters of the experiment was to be destroyed to end the expense (and do an autopsy at a very close molecular level---to see exactly what went wrong) so just get on with it. Since I have a dislike for the Alignment, I would suspect that the "medical" people involved would consider this an necropsy just like they would to if a chicken in one of the egg and chicken parts factories developed a tumor and they wanted to see what might be done to keep the rest of the animals health.

Brigade XO wrote:Francesca's death - what actually happened to her- and the LRPB's involvement in placing children with families appeared to be something both known and in various levels understood inside the Onion and apparently the Alignment in general.
The placement is a socializing operation with bonding to nominal parents with the support it provides. It also seems that even in families like the McBrides, since they are Alph Lines, they expect "enhancements" to their children. So IF Jack, Zack and their sisters were body births of their mother, each was modified in various ways by the Alignment and done so with the knowlege and approval of the parents. This is all part of the Detweiler Plan and the willing participants who have been involved (and indoctrinated --yeah, loaded word) in the ongoing uplift have bought into it and have since they were old enough to be brought inside.
Herlander became fully attached to his Daughter. His wife, which she may have been attached, took the Alignment/pragmatic view and since she KNEW that this was partially an experiment to see if the problems of this particular "line of investigation" had been resolved and there was a good chance that Francesca was going begin to crash and be treated as a failed experiment--which she turned out to be- and was ok with that. If I want to be harsh, the wife ultimately took the position (in her own mind, not saying this to her husband) that this was a well liked pet but was no longer a viable experiment and was falling apart as a human with a mind and so was CULLED as you would so with such creatures.
Culled is a telling word. Filled with rational decisions based on set criteria and devoid of actual feelings when applied to humans. Francesca became damaged goods, was going to get much worse and like a lab rat that developed a medical problem outside the parameters of the experiment was to be destroyed to end the expense (and do an autopsy at a very close molecular level---to see exactly what went wrong) so just get on with it. Since I have a dislike for the Alignment, I would suspect that the "medical" people involved would consider this an necropsy just like they would to if a chicken in one of the egg and chicken parts factories developed a tumor and they wanted to see what might be done to keep the rest of the animals health.

You are exposing a lot of the human element. What a cold-hearted parent. The wife was a bitch. That should have caused a problem with Simoes as well. Like being married to Cordelia Ransom. I always thought the roles should have been reversed. The mother should have been the most devastated of the two. Did she develop a mother's bond, at all, with her kids?

Do mothers even develop their special bond if they don't actually carry a child in their womb for nine months?

cthia wrote:Do mothers even develop their special bond if they don't actually carry a child in their womb for nine months?

Clearly you have possibly never know Foster Parents. Yeah, they get just as attached. On the other hand, I am talking about Foster Parents I know (not from being raised by any) but accepting a child into your life because you want them- even if they are not your biological offspring- seems to put most of them right up there with the stereotype of Mother Bear defending their cubs. It's a human thing.
On the other hand, Herlander's wife is an Alignment scientist and fully brought up saturated in the ethics and morals and philosophy of the Detweiler Plan for uplift. Thy get their children from the LRPB and while much of that may just be the accepted Alignment ethics of receiving children-- even those not purported to be from their own genes as part of the nominal ongoing uplift but to nurture and raise promising candidates from the LRPB for the greater improvement of the Alpha Lines down the road-- I suspect there can be certain disconnects when one parent will ultimately view a child like Franchesca as a failed effort and better off Culled than being put into some sort of long term care facility for those that are disintegrating mental capabilities since clearly the Alignment is clearly willing to dispose of such unsuccessful trials rather than provide extended care for them.
The ONLY reason Herlander was tasked on McBride was to continue his research and development till he was incapable of any productive advanced work on his assigned project. They were going to cull him too eventually but with all that investment and the particular insight he had into that critical research, the Alignment wanted to squeeze anything possible out of him before cutting him off and "disposing" of him.
Such a wonderful philosophy. And we are then shown that even a believer such as Jack McBride finds himself compelled to examine his own feelings and the callous use of the seriously troubled and grieving ---and increasingly angry scientist- who will not look on his "daughter" as a failed experiment to be discarded as a bad turn in the line development when the resources would be much better spent on another in that line of experimentation. Dump the failure, see what you can learn from the corpse, and try something a little differnt on another try.

This is the Alignment....this is what they do.

cthia wrote:Do mothers even develop their special bond if they don't actually carry a child in their womb for nine months?

Given the number of "mothers" who have clearly failed to develop such a bond with their actual biological children, someone not doing so with an adopted child doesn't seem particularly hard to believe to me. Sure most do, but there are always exceptions to any behavior that we perceive as normal.

zyffyr wrote:

cthia wrote:Do mothers even develop their special bond if they don't actually carry a child in their womb for nine months?

Given the number of "mothers" who have clearly failed to develop such a bond with their actual biological children, someone not doing so with an adopted child doesn't seem particularly hard to believe to me. Sure most do, but there are always exceptions to any behavior that we perceive as normal.

I certainly agree. It is the same with many orphanages, group homes, and even foster parents. Some foster parents are simply glorified baby sitters collecting a government check for incentive. I wonder if Herlander's family was receiving some sort of incentive. But yes, with human nature it could go either way. I know a family who fell in love so deeply with an exchange student that it hurt them just as deeply when she left.

But the MA are heartless and ruthless. And they genengineer the empathy and humanity right out of DNA. But, in the HV, there are not many breast fed babies who were allowed to grow in the womb for nine months. I think Honor was, which is little wonder she is the example for the galaxy. I was a breast fed baby too. I still am. That's a hard habit to break. LOL

Will someone remind me again why the lifespan of the MA's slave line is, iinm, less than ours? I think it was given, but I can't seem to recall it. Do forgive my faulty wiring. It appears that everywhere you look into the Alignment's affairs, there is disgust. Why would they not want their very important worker bees to live longer? They will accrue lots of experience and become much more efficient. Is the reason why, something like it being an unfortunate side-effect of their line? And if so, considering their prowess in genetics, do they need Allison to solve the problem?

And do they regenerate?

cthia wrote:Will someone remind me again why the lifespan of the MA's slave line is, iinm, less than ours?

Planned obsolescence. You make more money if your customer buys periodically, not just once.

Plus it's been established that the genetic lines have so many faults that their biology is unstable. For slaves, that doesn't matter (it's a benefit, see above).

Why would they not want their very important worker bees to live longer? They will accrue lots of experience and become much more efficient. Is the reason why, something like it being an unfortunate side-effect of their line? And if so, considering their prowess in genetics, do they need Allison to solve the problem?

And do they regenerate?

Because they're not THAT important. They are replaceable cogs and there are plenty of those where they came from.

ThinksMarkedly wrote:

cthia wrote:Will someone remind me again why the lifespan of the MA's slave line is, iinm, less than ours?

Planned obsolescence. You make more money if your customer buys periodically, not just once.

Plus it's been established that the genetic lines have so many faults that their biology is unstable. For slaves, that doesn't matter (it's a benefit, see above).

Why would they not want their very important worker bees to live longer? They will accrue lots of experience and become much more efficient. Is the reason why, something like it being an unfortunate side-effect of their line? And if so, considering their prowess in genetics, do they need Allison to solve the problem?

And do they regenerate?

Because they're not THAT important. They are replaceable cogs and there are plenty of those where they came from.

Holy crankshaft Batman! Does anyone else have a problem with the inhumanity of it all? Planned obsolescence is fine for products, but when you characterize people as product you cross the line into megalomania. There is no way the galaxy at large will accept this. Not only is it slavery. It is customized slavery. The galaxy will piss its pants at the sheer shock of it all. Just think if the South could have done that to its slaves.

"We've made them hard working, and we made sure they won't become a problem because they won't live long enough. And if there comes a point you no longer want or need them, don't worry. We've built-in a self-destruct."

The GA-LAXY will excrete missiles when it hears about this.

The Alignment has a long track record of custom-building humans for their needs. Like Albrect's and his clones security people. Clone sibs designed as hyper fast Chuck Norris bodyguards. The conversation about the typical fussy "accountant" type slave or clone line.
It's not that the individuals who make up various genetic slave or seccie lines can't live long, it's mostly that they are not given prolong. Yes there are other problems but those have tended to be that they wear out/age out or die from work related problems.

Then there are people like Jack McBrides's boss who -along with her entire "line" was being reconsidered for culling because she was somewhat unstable. Useful, even brilliant where it came to what she was being used for but identified as someone who was likely to slip over into a dangerous liability. She was very successful at her job but clearly not quite what they needed because of the instability of earlier version. This is like breeding wolves as guard dogs....at what point do they stop being controllable (or in the case of humans, drift then explode into psychopaths) and "working within design parameters" and you have to kill every example and go back to trying something a little different?

We are offered many examples of genetic slaves who are rescued/confiscated from slavers by RMN ships and go on to lead more or less normal lives. They can use Prolong if given it early enough and have children. It's mostly that the Alignment and many of the customers of Mesa etc who use genetic slaves see them as consumable but self replicating products if you want them to be so. They are often portrayed as being seen as sort of intelligent animals who are potentially dangerous if not strictly controlled but otherwise looked down on and a commodity.

And then there must be, or at least must have been, some generic slaves with enhanced lifespans. We know the Alpha lines had gotten their baseline lifespan somewhat above human normal, even befor prolong was invented (and that that life extension stacks with prolong)
We also know that they test out each genetic mod in a slave labor me before risking its incorporation into any of the MAlign proper lines.

So there must have been slave lines that got the life extension genetic mods trialed and perfected within them before those were ever spliced into even a Gamma line.

It seems unlikely that the MAlign would go to the effort to cull those back out (if for no.other reason than they’d want slave lines where they could check new mods for incompatibility with those life extension mods)