Pavel Young's and Lord Burdette's options

tlb wrote:

cthia wrote:I never understood why Alison didn't have her own practice by then, as her colleague Dr. Iliescu had.

ZVar wrote:Alison being royalty was obviously ret-con'd into later books. The reason she didn't have a practice is simply the author didn't flesh out Alison until it was needed.

I do not agree, Allison seems to be trying to live outside of her families influence and that may include refusing financial support. Beowulf does not have royalty, but her family there is certainly prominent. Even the early books comment that her marriage was not just out of love, but also a reaction against the norms on Beowulf (but I cannot find an example of that right now).

cthia wrote:You responded in kind elsewhere in response to my same notion. But that is the reason she should have built her own business. She has the name, the know-how and the reputation. Who wouldn't bankroll her if she needed it.

I was disagreeing with ZVar's notion that Allison's family connections were retconned into the story. As to whether she should been self employed, you will have to discuss that with RFC.

Garth2 wrote:As for the hit at Cosmo, the police suspected it was Young but could not prove it (at that time)

To be honest the one plot hole (if it real is) was the governments response to the "wild allegations", they should have respond with a default statement rather than being silent e.g. "Lord Young, like any citizen can take these allegations to court. Where they will be investigated and if Mrs Harrington is <blah, blah> - I'll leave it to you work out why he hasn't"

This post reeks of the same strategy that I suggested Burdette could use. Tie everything up in court and possibly expose a loose thread in the enemy camp.

I'll get to Burdette later, but if Young would have been willing to take a chill pill and grind at Honor, a court battle could have caused her problems.

Heck, a lot of the things the government - or members of the navy - did for her was criminal. The assault on Summervale's chalet was criminal. Certain people in the navy conspiring against him during his refit was questionable at the very least, criminal at best. Yadda yadda yadda.

cthia wrote: if Young would have been willing to take a chill pill and grind at Honor, a court battle could have caused her problems.

Heck, a lot of the things the government - or members of the navy - did for her was criminal. The assault on Summervale's chalet was criminal. Certain people in the navy conspiring against him during his refit was questionable at the very least, criminal at best. Yadda yadda yadda.

There was nothing illegal about approving a request for replacement that Young had made.

Yes, the assault on Summervale was criminal; but with Summervale dead there was nothing to proceed on and nothing that reflected on Honor. However the confession by Summervale could be used if Young tried to take Honor to court for slander. The implications of that would have ruined Young politically.

Fox2! wrote:You are correct, Young probably wouldn't know who Jacques was, unless the last names tipped him off. And I expect he would need a staffer. perhaps Georgia, to tell him who Jacques was, and the threat he represented. A hit on Young might even be legitimate BSC business, given all the sleezy things he's involved in.

One important detail: Georgia would do her absolute best not to attract the BSC's attention. She probably did keep tabs on known members, but we have no clue whether Jacques's actual profession was a known fact. If she had known, she might have tried to stop Pavel... though of course that was not possible either.

Fox2! wrote:My name is Jacques Benton-Ramirez y Chou. You killed my sister. Prepare to die.

You are correct, Young probably wouldn't know who Jacques was, unless the last names tipped him off. And I expect he would need a staffer. perhaps Georgia, to tell him who Jacques was, and the threat he represented. A hit on Young might even be legitimate BSC business, given all the sleezy things he's involved in.

You are also correct in saying that the chances of YOUng surviving retribution from both Alfred and Honor (and later, the Harrington Steaderholder's Own, who just happen to have diplomatic immunity) is small. Someplace in the yottachance range.

chia wrote:Like W E! Interesting point Fox2! It reminds us that Honor had other options too.

It would have been both personal and professional for the Steadholder's Own. First, the assault on their Steadholder. Second, the injury that one of them (Jamie Chandless? ) suffered in the attack. Can someone die a coward's death two or more times? Imagine if they ever learned about the rape attempt. Graysons are very protective of their womenfolk.

cthia wrote:

Garth2 wrote:As for the hit at Cosmo, the police suspected it was Young but could not prove it (at that time)

To be honest the one plot hole (if it real is) was the governments response to the "wild allegations", they should have respond with a default statement rather than being silent e.g. "Lord Young, like any citizen can take these allegations to court. Where they will be investigated and if Mrs Harrington is <blah, blah> - I'll leave it to you work out why he hasn't"

This post reeks of the same strategy that I suggested Burdette could use. Tie everything up in court and possibly expose a loose thread in the enemy camp.

I'll get to Burdette later, but if Young would have been willing to take a chill pill and grind at Honor, a court battle could have caused her problems.

Heck, a lot of the things the government - or members of the navy - did for her was criminal. The assault on Summervale's chalet was criminal. Certain people in the navy conspiring against him during his refit was questionable at the very least, criminal at best. Yadda yadda yadda.

Actually, as point out in text, Pavel taking Honor to court at this point in time would be the WORST thing he could do hence why it would be the best thing for the Government (or at least Allen Summervale, Duke Cromarty) not only would it a tie Young up in knots and burn political capital he didn't have but once the court ruled in Honor favour (she just plays the tape, how it came into her possession wouldn't be a factor (as Pavel himself mentions)) the scandal might force out of the House of Lords or at very least wreck the power of the blackmail files (after all who would believe him after the court case)

In addition, it would also remove Allen cousin as someone else would eliminate him (as he himself alludes to).

Plus allow for Honor to enter the House of Lords without the problems that happened from the way she did it

refit
How was the Navy refit "criminal", a Captain requested a refit and it was granted by the relevant authority as per the chain of command?

Chalet
I agree the "assault" on the chalet was criminal (as we have "inside knowledge") but I bet all the official records clearly demonstrate that it was a legitimate mistake specially as those "guests" wouldn't want to make a fuss

ThinksMarkedly wrote:

Fox2! wrote:You are correct, Young probably wouldn't know who Jacques was, unless the last names tipped him off. And I expect he would need a staffer. perhaps Georgia, to tell him who Jacques was, and the threat he represented. A hit on Young might even be legitimate BSC business, given all the sleezy things he's involved in.

One important detail: Georgia would do her absolute best not to attract the BSC's attention. She probably did keep tabs on known members, but we have no clue whether Jacques's actual profession was a known fact. If she had known, she might have tried to stop Pavel... though of course that was not possible either.

There is also the minor detail, that we now know that Ballroom was looking for her and therefore probably the BSC had her on file "as a person of interest"

Given that Alison didn't go by her full name in Manticore, its possible that no one would link the two.

Garth 2 wrote:

ThinksMarkedly wrote:
One important detail: Georgia would do her absolute best not to attract the BSC's attention. She probably did keep tabs on known members, but we have no clue whether Jacques's actual profession was a known fact. If she had known, she might have tried to stop Pavel... though of course that was not possible either.

There is also the minor detail, that we now know that Ballroom was looking for her and therefore probably the BSC had her on file "as a person of interest"

Given that Alison didn't go by her full name in Manticore, its possible that no one would link the two.

Since Alison was probably "Harrington" before she graduated and moved to Manticore (or Sphinx), her MD diploma and licenses all say "Harrington", not "Benton-Ramirez y Chou".

ThinksMarkedly wrote:

Fox2! wrote:You are correct, Young probably wouldn't know who Jacques was, unless the last names tipped him off. And I expect he would need a staffer. perhaps Georgia, to tell him who Jacques was, and the threat he represented. A hit on Young might even be legitimate BSC business, given all the sleezy things he's involved in.

One important detail: Georgia would do her absolute best not to attract the BSC's attention. She probably did keep tabs on known members, but we have no clue whether Jacques's actual profession was a known fact. If she had known, she might have tried to stop Pavel... though of course that was not possible either.

Georgia was (at least semi-) actively working against Young. She approved the hiring of the new chauffeur, knowing that he was working for Honor's lawyer. She might not have told Pavel about Jacques, even if she knew, and if she considered him an active, or an easily activated, threat.

cthia wrote:

Garth2 wrote:As for the hit at Cosmo, the police suspected it was Young but could not prove it (at that time)

To be honest the one plot hole (if it real is) was the governments response to the "wild allegations", they should have respond with a default statement rather than being silent e.g. "Lord Young, like any citizen can take these allegations to court. Where they will be investigated and if Mrs Harrington is <blah, blah> - I'll leave it to you work out why he hasn't"

This post reeks of the same strategy that I suggested Burdette could use. Tie everything up in court and possibly expose a loose thread in the enemy camp.

I'll get to Burdette later, but if Young would have been willing to take a chill pill and grind at Honor, a court battle could have caused her problems.

Heck, a lot of the things the government - or members of the navy - did for her was criminal. The assault on Summervale's chalet was criminal. Certain people in the navy conspiring against him during his refit was questionable at the very least, criminal at best. Yadda yadda yadda.

Garth2 wrote:Actually, as point out in text, Pavel taking Honor to court at this point in time would be the WORST thing he could do hence why it would be the best thing for the Government (or at least Allen Summervale, Duke Cromarty) not only would it a tie Young up in knots and burn political capital he didn't have but once the court ruled in Honor favour (she just plays the tape, how it came into her possession wouldn't be a factor (as Pavel himself mentions)) the scandal might force out of the House of Lords or at very least wreck the power of the blackmail files (after all who would believe him after the court case)

In addition, it would also remove Allen cousin as someone else would eliminate him (as he himself alludes to).

Plus allow for Honor to enter the House of Lords without the problems that happened from the way she did it

refit
How was the Navy refit "criminal", a Captain requested a refit and it was granted by the relevant authority as per the chain of command?

Chalet
I agree the "assault" on the chalet was criminal (as we have "inside knowledge") but I bet all the official records clearly demonstrate that it was a legitimate mistake specially as those "guests" wouldn't want to make a fuss

What "tapes" are we talking about here? Did I miss another memo?

The refit was criminal under the surface if Young's legal team can prove how it was used to hinder the duty of a Captain and an officer of the Queen's navy. The good ol' boy network might have weaknesses that can be exploited by the NH Files. A high powered legal team has ways to get at the truth. Plus, we can not underestimate Young receiving anonymous help from Honor's many enemies. Heck, the MAlign would love to assist Young behind the scenes in this matter.

My point is Young could embarrass the government at the expense of the war effort. Honor would suffer if the choice is her or the war effort. Nobody witnessed the rape attempt. He can claim Honor became angry when he spurned her advances. He could claim Honor had plans to sleep her way to the top. Unlikely to hold water, until he adds "She is a heavy worlder. What normal gravity idiot would be stupid enough to try and rape a heavy worlder?" At any rate, it would come down to his word against hers. That was an impossible proposition even in Honor's eyes. Who would believe a lowly baseborn Commoner over a Lord?

By law, Young only has to sow a seed of reasonable doubt.

Interesting post Garth2. BTW, is it a fact Young wouldn't have been able to afford a high powered legal team? I wouldn't think that Young was exactly pinching pennies.