If The Cat Dies First

I can't find any information about what happens when the cat outlives it's human partner and if there are any after affects on the human.

Does nothing happen or has it just never come up?

I feel like something debilitating should happen.

Like, the cats death causes the human partner to lose their ability to feel empathy/remorse/guilt?

MC1560 wrote:I can't find any information about what happens when the cat outlives it's human partner and if there are any after affects on the human.

Does nothing happen or has it just never come up?

I feel like something debilitating should happen.

Like, the cats death causes the human partner to lose their ability to feel empathy/remorse/guilt?

As far as I can recall the only time the effect of the 'cat's death on their human was discussed it was when the POWs were trying to prevent Statesec from killing Nimitz -- and the book at least strongly implied they were lying about the harmful effect that would have on Honor. (But whether there would have been any less lethal effects on her, beyond the normal effects of grief, weren't discussed - an possibly weren't known by her crew)

We do know when their human dies the 'cats generally give up their will to live and simply let themselves die (A few special cases to the contrary - Monroe and Samantha). But we've never seen a bonded 'cat die before their human so we don't have any firsthand example of how it affects the human.

Before prolong, it was the general rule that the human died first and the cat would die of depression, except in unusual instances. I do not believe that we have been given an example of the cat dying first. According to House of Steel: it is also the case that among mated treecats, when one dies then the other will likely die also, unless there are kittens.

I would expect the human would go into deep depression, just like the cat in the opposite case; but it is not clear whether that is necessarily fatal. However I do not believe either partner loses abilities as the result of the others death. Instead it is more likely that the partners have their emotional senses strengthened, which is why the resulting depression is so deep.

tlb wrote:Before prolong, it was the general rule that the human died first and the cat would die of depression, except in unusual instances. I do not believe that we have been given an example of the cat dying first. According to House of Steel: it is also the case that among mated treecats, when one dies then the other will likely die also, unless there are kittens.

I would expect the human would go into deep depression, just like the cat in the opposite case; but it is not clear whether that is necessarily fatal. However I do not believe either partner loses abilities as the result of the others death. Instead it is more likely that the partners have their emotional senses strengthened, which is why the resulting depression is so deep.

In the three (I believe) cases we have text ev for where a 'Cat survived the death of their Two-legs, it was because of a second bond being formed: Samantha, Monroe, and the 'Cat in the short story "The Stray". whose name I have forgotten. Samantha stayed alive because of her kittens, until she bonded with Hamish.

Interesting question.

First, disclaimer. My following two cents isn't meant to downplay or take any bonded pair's dependence on one another, and, or, connection, for granted. Having said that, this question should be directed at Ariel and Nimitz, and their mate.

In the case of Beth or Honor, both of them would be greatly affected emotionally. If Ariel had died during critical points of the war, the Queen may have made some bad decisions. Depending on the time, she may not have been at the right place emotionally to even consider an Alliance with Haven. OTOH, though it might not have fared well for the government in the long run, If Ariel had been killed by the Peeps during High Ridge's tenure, Beth might have caused a constitutional crisis.

If Nimitz had been killed at the hands of Pavel Young during that poisoning, Honor would have completely went off the rails. There would have been nothing to discuss, and no one would have been able to bring her back from the brink of temporary insanity. You think it was bad for Honor emotionally when Young had Paul killed? Pfft!

If Nimitz had died at the hands of Ransom, Honor may not have recovered in time to ever escape either Hell.

In Honor's case, Nimitz is a control rod keeping that flawed reactor in check. Perhaps the main control rod. Reactors have to have their control rods inserted and removed slowly. Not all at once, or completely.

I'll posit that Ariel is also integral to keeping Beth's temper in check. Consider what happens when you suddenly remove the radiator cap on an overheated engine.

As far as Honor is concerned, it's interesting if you consider the human element of "love on the rebound." If Nimitz had died at the right time, Honor would have needed some human companionship to fill a void. A void Honor has been missing since she met Nimitz. Honor didn't have many friends. Nimitz was it for a long time in her life. At any rate, Hamish may have benefited earlier. I'm not saying he's the type of scum who takes advantage of a woman "on the rebound" or in her moment of weakness. But that his love for her, and her moment of weakness, could have conspired to overwhelm the both of them.

If Nimitz had been killed prior to Honor's visit to see the Mandarins, there would be NO Sol System.

cthia wrote:In Honor's case, Nimitz is a control rod keeping that flawed reactor in check. Perhaps the main control rod. Reactors have to have their control rods inserted and removed slowly. Not all at once, or completely.

In Field of Dishonor there is no sign that Nimitz had any ability to keep Honor's feelings in check after the death of Paul Tankersley. She only begins to recover when she learns that Paul's death was not a random act, but a murder for hire.

Similarly there is no sign that Nimitz acted as a check on Honor's actions in the Sol System, particularly when it was believed that Samantha had also died; since treecats believe that enemies should not be allowed to live. Whether the situation would be worse for the Solarians if Nimitz were dead, is a matter of conjecture; but if Honor did not hold them to be responsible, then I see no reason to expect a change in the outcome.

tlb wrote:

cthia wrote:In Honor's case, Nimitz is a control rod keeping that flawed reactor in check. Perhaps the main control rod. Reactors have to have their control rods inserted and removed slowly. Not all at once, or completely.

In Field of Dishonor there is no sign that Nimitz had any ability to keep Honor's feelings in check after the death of Paul Tankersley. She only begins to recover when she learns that Paul's death was not a random act, but a murder for hire.

Similarly there is no sign that Nimitz acted as a check on Honor's actions in the Sol System, particularly when it was believed that Samantha had also died; since treecats believe that enemies should not be allowed to live. Whether the situation would be worse for the Solarians if Nimitz were dead, is a matter of conjecture; but if Honor did not hold them to be responsible, then I see no reason to expect a change in the outcome.

Good points. And I considered them all. There is also the time, the Faithful I think, conspired to make Skydomes look negligent in the cost of lives. However, and it is conjecture on my part as well, I think textev had long since made it clear that a Cat's soothing therapy is always at play. I always thought RFC was cloning the purr of a normal Cat's influence on humans. But, you are correct that there is a lack of specific text. And I must also admit that oftentimes it seems as if the Two-Leg is influencing the Cat, since the metronome beat of a Cat's tail is always in tune with the rabid breathing of a human's anger. Plus the flattened ears, hiss etc. It is kind of difficult to know who is influencing whom during those moments. Could be that a Cat says, <Finally, let's kick some butt the People way!> Shrug

But, at any rate, I'm willing to bank on a Cat being an overall positive moral influence, which translates to, the incidences you mentioned above could have been, would have been, a lot worse. IMO.

If Nimitz had died at Ransom's orders, it would likely have been after Honor had been killed. When the order to take him out and killhim was given, Honor 1st launched Nimitz at Ransom and then started for her herself. it was only that Nimitz was intercepted and severely hurt that Honor was not able to close on Ransom- which probably would have been when they both died as Nimitz ripping Ransom apart enough to kill her would have ended in enough shooting to kill both himself and Honor. Whichever one would have managed to kill Ransom, both would have kept on killing SS until both were dead or incapasitated. That was your 15 seconds of madness, you know your going to die so kill or do as much damage as possible. Given who Ransom was, it is unlikely the guards would have not killed both once she was dead. The rest of the RMN people there probably would have died or at least been seriously injuired- and probably not survived long after that.

Have we been told about any Treecat burial rituals? Being such an intelligent species, I would be surprised if they didn't have any.

cthia wrote:Have we been told about any Treecat burial rituals? Being such an intelligent species, I would be surprised if they didn't have any.

Closest I could find was in Treecat Wars:

When Jessica returned with the shovel and started digging a hole over where the grave would neither be obvious nor interfere with her mother’s test area, Valiant loped over and started digging with her.
“I guess he agrees,” Anders said. “Unless he just thinks you’re getting ready to plant another garden bed and he’s eager to help.”
“No, it’s not that,” Jessica replied. “I think he knows why I’m doing this. I can’t explain how, since it’s just a feeling, but I think I’m right. He’s helping and he’s eager we get this taken care of. I wonder if he was so worried because he thought we were just going to leave the body to rot out in the open.”
Anders finished with his images and came over to help with the digging. They didn’t need as large a hole as they would have for a human body, but the ground had been baked hard enough that even with the modified vibro blade cutting edge on the shovel, it was hard work.
Valiant wandered off once both humans were at work and returned as they were finishing up. He’d filled one of his larger carrying nets with the reddish autumn leaves from the picketwood trees. When the humans stepped back, he dropped most of these in to line the grave.
“Well, I guess he approves,” Jessica said. “If we lift the body on one of the shovels, we can disinfect the blade afterwards. Better than using our hands. We didn’t see any bugs, but there might be some.”
“I’ll do it,” Anders said. “You stay in tune with Valiant and make sure I’m not doing anything wrong.”
But the stout treecat didn’t do anything in the way of protest. Instead, he sprinkled the last of his picketwood leaves over the corpse, then began digging the dirt back into the grave. The two humans helped him.

So while not a "ritual" in a wake or funeral sort of way it does look like they do bury their dead. Of course we also don't know what sort of telempathic level was going on....