OOPS

Continued from . . .

kzt wrote:Plasma capacitor powered. So as it cools down from 50,000,000K where does the heat go?

tlb wrote:I just started the reread of Ashes of Victory and in the drawings at the beginning there is an exploded view of the Ghost Rider MDM. There it says the capacitor is a superconducting coaxial design. So doesn't that mean that the stored medium is electricity, rather than plasma?

kzt wrote:No, David has been very clear that they are full of plasma. This seems to only matter when it is convenient...

tlb wrote:For the shoulder fired anti-vehicle missile, the operator must have really big shoulder pads then. I just do not see how that could work in a practical sense. Room temperature superconducting capacitors using electricity I can understand.

cthia wrote:Why? The system may only need enough plasma for a few shots. Then there are refill cartridges. The metal used for the bazooka can be super lightweight and strong. A high tech dampening system could reduce recoil.

tlb wrote:That was an oblique comment on the heat (not the recoil), if plasma is the source of energy for a shoulder fired missile with a wedge - see KZT's comment that I had as a lead. Do you believe that there are plasma refill cartridges? I thought that had been offered as a joke before.

Is it possible that smaller anti-vehicle missiles use a superconducting capacitor holding electricity; while big anti-ship missiles use the plasma capacitors? So the drawing in the book was from a transitional period?

My comment was also about heat, the recoil comment was simply dessert.

I saw kzt's comment before. He simply has the balls to ask the author something we all wrestle with. But at some point you have to consume SF "as is" and precede from there. That is how breakthroughs are made. It is a recipe Hemphill and Foraker live by, "I'm not asking IF something can be done, guys, but you are free to extrapolate how."

BUT! I sit BEHIND kzt in class. I want to know where the heat goes BEFORE it cools. I'd like to get my hands on the material that can CONTAIN that much heat.

The question of where the heat GOES as it cools is much easier in THIS "system" because there's no need for stealth while operating a bazooka. Well, you could prematurely give your position away on the battlefield. :shrug:

Here's where the heat goes in a plasma powered bazooka ...

Thermoelectric generator

A thermoelectric generator (TEG), also called a Seebeck generator, is a solid state device that converts heat flux (temperature differences) directly into electrical energy through a phenomenon called the Seebeck effect (a form of thermoelectric effect). Thermoelectric generators function like heat engines, but are less bulky and have no moving parts. However, TEGs are typically more expensive and less efficient.

Thermoelectric generators could be used in power plants to convert waste heat into additional electrical power and in automobiles as automotive thermoelectric generators (ATGs) to increase fuel efficiency. Radioisotope thermoelectric generators use radioisotopes to generate the required heat difference to power space probes.

And yes, I still see a system that uses some sort of refill/recharge system. Or plasma powered bazookas wouldn't be practical.

It MAY be as much of a headache as recharging your freon in your AC unit. LOL

Oh! And the refill cartridges could CONTAIN the heat like a high tech thermos.

Hey, I'm runnin' with the author here, you have to see him for any last minute changes in the design.

tlb wrote:Is it possible that smaller anti-vehicle missiles use a superconducting capacitor holding electricity; while big anti-ship missiles use the plasma capacitors? So the drawing in the book was from a transitional period?

cthia wrote:My comment was also about heat, the recoil comment was simply dessert.

I saw kzt's comment before. He simply has the balls to ask the author something we all wrestle with. But at some point you have to consume SF "as is" and precede from there. That is how breakthroughs are made. It is a recipe Hemphill and Foraker live by, "I'm not asking IF something can be done, guys, but you are free to extrapolate how."

I continue to think that there is a good possibility that both types of capacitors exist. Consider that a properly designed fission pile is unlikely to create plasma directly, since having its components melt is considered a bad thing. From Ashes of Victory, chapter 24:

Nice as the new LACs' fission plants were, they simply couldn't produce the power out of current generating capacity for everything that had to be done in the heat of combat . . . especially in a Shrike or Shrike-B, with its battlecruiser-sized graser mount. The bow-wall, like the graser itself, was actually fed from a massive superconductor capacitor, and one of the flight engineer's jobs was to see to it that any of his pile's output not being used for anything else was diverted into maintaining the charge on the capacitors.

So the missiles fired from the Shrike would also use a superconducting capacitor (same as shown in the drawing).

tlb wrote:I continue to think that there is a good possibility that both types of capacitors exist. Consider that a properly designed fission pile is unlikely to create plasma directly, since having its components melt is considered a bad thing. snip

You're no doubt correct. There's no reason both types cannot be in use. One is probably capable of much higher capacities and has the corresponding cost, the other may have a lower capacity but is much cheaper to use. In fact, the plasma capacitors can recharge the traditional type of capacitors in a backup UPS type of system - the "jump starter" capacitors.

In UH, it was mentioned that the LACs used to sucker punch the SLN CO at Ajay, used their reactors to recharge the plasma capacitors. It states the reactors didn't have the power budget to recharge the plasma capacitors during battle. So the LACs had to save their graser fire until they really needed them.

At any rate, I thought the plasma capacitors were recharged via a plasma source, not by a reactor. Of course, there could have been some sort of plasma byproduct as with plasma reactors.

Late edit: Changed Havenite CO to SLN CO

cthia wrote:In UH, it was mentioned that the LACs used to sucker punch the SLN CO at Ajay, used their reactors to recharge the plasma capacitors. It states the reactors didn't have the power budget to recharge the plasma capacitors during battle. So the LACs had to save their graser fire until they really needed them.

At any rate, I thought the plasma capacitors were recharged via a plasma source, not by a reactor. Of course, there could have been some sort of plasma byproduct as with plasma reactors.

Late edit: Changed Havenite CO to SLN CO

I do not think at a fission reactor produces plasma directly, so there are two possibilities as you say: the reactor produces electricity and that charged the superconducting capacitor or the power from the reactor drove some other device that produced plasma for a plasma capacitor.