SLN Future

cthia wrote:In fact, the entire discussion reminds me of Fearless showing up On Basilisk Station, and finally started doing the job that arm of the navy was supposed to do. That entire exchange between Arnaud? and Tremaine? was one of the most tender moments in the series.

Paraphrasing "Tell me about this CO of yours again. And slow down this time. He actually intends for you to help us? To detach one of your pinnaces, and assign me an officer? I do seem to remember seeing something of that nature in the manual. I'm just not sure I'm ready for a COMPETENT officer on Basilisk Station."

"Yes, sir, SHE does."

Entities don't always do, or continue to do, the jobs they were created to do.

"You're what?" Captain Reynaud demanded, and Lieutenant Andreas Venizelos wrinkled his brow in puzzlement.

"I said I'm your customs and security officer, Captain. I'm sure Captain Harrington's dispatch will explain everything."

Reynaud accepted the message chip almost numbly, and Venizelos's puzzlement deepened. He couldn't understand why the ACS man looked so confused. It wasn't as if Venizelos were using any big words.

"Let me get this straight," Reynaud said after a moment. "Your Captain Harrington actually expects you and your people to be quartered here at Control? He means to leave you here to support our operations?"

"Yes, Sir, she does." The darkly handsome lieutenant stressed the pronoun's gender, and Reynaud nodded, but he still looked so dumbfounded Venizelos was moved to continue. "Why do you seem so surprised, Sir?"

"Surprised?" Reynaud shook himself, then smiled oddly. "Yes, I suppose 'surprised' is a pretty good word, Lieutenant. Let me just put it this way. I've been chief controller in Basilisk for almost twenty months. Before that, I was senior assistant controller for damn near two years, and in all that time, you're the first—what did you call it? security and customs officer?—anyone's bothered to assign me. In fact, you may be the first one any station commander's ever bothered to assign to Control."

"I'm what?" Venizelos blurted, then flushed as he realized how exactly his tone matched Reynaud's original emphasis. The two of them stared at one another, and then the ACS captain began to grin.

"Now that I think about it," he said, "I believe I did read something in my original orders about the Navy being responsible for inspections and station security. Of course, it's been so long I can't be certain." He glanced at the habitat services tech standing at his shoulder. "Jayne, do me a favor and find the Lieutenant's people some quarters and get them checked out on the basic emergency procedures, would you? I've got some station regs to plow through to find out what the hell we're supposed to do with them."

"Sure thing, Mike." The tech gestured to Ensign Wolversham, Venizelos's second in command, and Reynaud turned back to Venizelos, still grinning.

"In the meantime, Lieutenant, perhaps you'd care to join me in my data search?" Venizelos nodded, and Reynaud's grin grew broader. "And perhaps you'd care to tell me a little something about your CO, as well. But take it slow, please. I'm not as young as I used to be, and I don't know if I'm ready for the concept of a competent senior officer on Basilisk Station!"

Andreas Venizelos grinned back, and for the first time in weeks, it felt completely natural

ThinksMarkedly wrote:At the time of the Falklands War, the Argentinean Navy had a carrier (the General Belgrano), one of only two in the Southern Hemisphere. But it didn't leave port because they were afraid that RN subs would sink it. I can imagine all sorts of Shell systems with a hundred-year-old SD or DN that they keep but won't risk in a real fight.

Jonathan_S wrote:The General Belgrano was the ex-USN WW-II era Brooklyn-class light cruiser that was sunk by a RN sub. The Argentinian Navy's carrier was an ex-RN WWII-era Colossus-class light fleet carrier the Veinticinco de Mayo.

And she didn't ride out that entire war in port. Even after being out to provide support for the initial invasion, once the British fleet arrives she was part of a northern force maneuvering to attack while General Belgrano was part of a southern force attempting to do the same. S-2 trackers launched from the Veinticinco de Mayo did detect the British force, but the available wind wasn't high enough for the old carrier to launch its heavily loaded A-4Q Skyhawk attack planes for a strike against them.

It was only after HMS Conqueror torpedoed and sunk the General Belgrano that the carrier was pulled back to port. HMS Splendid had been hunting for her, but never found the carrier. Her A-4Q Skyhawks then operated against the British from a land base from the rest of the war.

ThinksMarkedly wrote:But the conclusion is the same: once real fighting starts, plenty of systems will hold back their ships so they aren't damaged or destroyed. And that's assuming they're in fighting trim in the first place: it's easy to imagine that many Shell systems are keeping DNs and even SDs for the prestige, but are actually worse than the SLN in training and doctrine. After all, who would they learn doctrine from anyway?

tlb wrote:

cthia wrote:You want me to believe that what OFS became, or was from the onset is what its true civilian masters intended. It's true masters were not the corrupt good ole boy network which was the Mandarins, in theory. Just as the Minister of the Interior was meant to be the overseer of OFS. The various entities became corrupt because the Mandarins were allowed to hold their seats indefinitely.

Right or wrong, I view OFS as the civilian arm responsible for FF, to help prevent what happened in our own country.

Its true masters WERE the Mandarins. It is a characteristic of bureaucracies that they persist; the problem in the Solarian League was that there was no elected control over them, because their funding was normally independent of the Assembly.

Frontier Fleet was the military arm of OFS under the control of the Minister of the Interior. Neither OFS nor FF could have become corrupt, if the Ministry had not become so first.

Why do you think that it is important to "to help prevent what happened in our own country"? The article you quoted seemed like a very good thing to me and I would want that attitude encouraged.

Theemile wrote:Actually, the military arm of the OFS was the Gendarmie. Frontier Fleet was the SLN force assigned to police the Frontiers, and seconded to the regional Governor for their use in police keeping and paroling neighboring polities. AS such, the Frontier Fleet wasassigned by the regional governors to provide assistance to the OFS in their territories.

Yes, it is a technicality, but an important one - the FF was not OFS, even if it was forced to do it's bidding. Because of this, the FF hierarchy had a different mindset than OFS did - even if they could not do anything about it.

tlb wrote:Please refresh my memory, what fighting is about to start? I can imagine systems holding back their SDF ships to defend their own planet; but not just so they do not get damaged. If the system governments are smart, then they are sending officers to the training classes of major powers and are engaged in war-gaming with friendly powers. The absolute worst thing that they could do is have a few big ships for prestige only and not have their people trained as best as can be done to use those ships. I cannot believe core worlds with SDF ships would not have them train with the SLN, at a minimum.