Honor: Pimp My Ride

cthia wrote:Indeed, and that's a very good point. I considered it as well, but then, Honor may consider it her duty if she can smooth out speedbumps all over the Galaxy's ghettos. But you're certainly correct that the MA may be able to get to her if she were to take on that role. However, as I posted earlier, as a civilian, Honor will be much more vulnerable to assassinations anyway. She could be ambushed aboard the Tankersley while simply traveling to Grayson.

Perhaps. We don't know the capabilities of the new threats. At any rate, it would ring true only if the Cruiser can SEE "any ship that they meet." The introduction could very well be "Hello. Goodbye." Shouldn't an SD be more survivable?

I thought she was too important for it as well when she showed up in the Haven system practicing diplomacy for the Queen, but, well...she could have been assassinated by rogue elements then.

ThinksMarkedly wrote:

cthia wrote:Indeed, and that's a very good point. I considered it as well, but then, Honor may consider it her duty if she can smooth out speedbumps all over the Galaxy's ghettos. But you're certainly correct that the MA may be able to get to her if she were to take on that role. However, as I posted earlier, as a civilian, Honor will be much more vulnerable to assassinations anyway. She could be ambushed aboard the Tankersley while simply traveling to Grayson.

Ambushes in hyper are rare, outside of well known grav wave entry or exit points. Especially for unscheduled trips done with private ships: if you don't know when the ship is leaving, you can't be ready for it. And you can't get word ahead that it's leaving either, as the Tankersley is faster than any civilian ship out there. Unless you have streak drive ships in the MBS just waiting around...

In real space, we're talking about the two systems with the biggest concentration of military force in the Galaxy. There are likely to be cruisers and destroyers patrolling the hyper limit on the least time course between those two systems, plus a large steady flow of ships. Lurking around the expected emergence loci is likely to get you discovered.

Plus, the Tankersley may practice regular randomisation.

If you're talking about the Queen sending her as her ambassador to another system, there may be enough leaks in the protocol and negotiations to announce when she's supposed to arrive. But she wouldn't be travelling on the Tankersley for this.

Perhaps. We don't know the capabilities of the new threats. At any rate, it would ring true only if the Cruiser can SEE "any ship that they meet." The introduction could very well be "Hello. Goodbye." Shouldn't an SD be more survivable?

Against an LD at knife-fighting range? No. You'd need something BB-sized to be a threat to an RMN BC but not an RMN SD. There's very little that falls in that range.

For everything outside of energy range, the BC is more manoeuvrable and thus more survivable.

I thought she was too important for it as well when she showed up in the Haven system practicing diplomacy for the Queen, but, well...she could have been assassinated by rogue elements then.

She was, but that's what the rest of Eighth Fleet was there for, outside the hyperlimit. It was on Pritchart and the RoH to ensure her safety, lest Eighth Fleet full of Apollo missiles start firing on Capital Fleet from extreme range.

What didn't add up for me was Eighth Fleet being there for 2 months. The rest of RHN could just be waiting in hyper and ready to translate and fire. I suppose we weren't told, but over three quarters of Eighth kept randomly translating out and back in half a light hour outside the hyperlimit.

cthia wrote:Any ship the MA ambushes will be completely unprepared for being cold-cocked. You think an SD would be more vulnerable to that kind of attack?

I wasn't exactly thinking about ambushes in hyper. The MA doesn't need to do that when they can get close enough to take your food off your plate. LOL

I know. I know. You don't think so. Just make sure you remember what station broke the news to you first W-CTHIA. LOL

ThinksMarkedly wrote:

cthia wrote:Any ship the MA ambushes will be completely unprepared for being cold-cocked. You think an SD would be more vulnerable to that kind of attack?

I wasn't exactly thinking about ambushes in hyper. The MA doesn't need to do that when they can get close enough to take your food off your plate. LOL

I know. I know. You don't think so. Just make sure you remember what station broke the news to you first W-CTHIA. LOL

Even if we take your argument that the MAlign forces can get close enough, then an SD is hardly more survivable than a BC. With 20% more acceleration than an Invictus, a Nike class could get our of range of anything it can't outrun but is far cheaper. And the Agammemnon, like the HMS Duke of Cromarty, class adds another 2%.

*KEEL PLATE OWNER

There was a time, years ago, when I owned every book David Weber had ever written. There were none I liked more than the Honor Harrington series. I loved the way Weber reimagined the Haratio Hornblower in a space opera. One concept that stuck with me, even years later, was that of a keel plate owner—a member of a ship’s original crew. It was a point of considerable pride. The etymology is a little unclear (to me, at least—David Weber uses the term as if it exists in the real word, but all my research led straight back to him), but I suppose it comes from the fact that the keel was traditionally the first part of the ship to be built. (‘Plate’ is a reference to flat plate keels, which are used by most ocean-going vessels).

Any community can have keel plate owners, people who know all the history because they were there from the beginning. A blog’s keel plate owners are its loyal first readers; its early, hesitant commenters; those who can trace a line from the present to the past.

I read a lot of blogs. I’ve read the full archives of blogs I particularly liked. But I was hesitant about starting one. Or rather, starting another—I had one years ago, to which I posted three times (the third post was to announce a “temporary” hiatus).

What if I didn’t have anything to say?

What if I didn’t have time to say it?

And most importantly: What would I call it?

Naming things is a fraught task for programmers. We’re obsessed with getting names exactly right. I once spent half a day in utter confusion because a colleague (May he never read this blog!) called something a state machine that was really a message filter. I’ve had long, bitter arguments about trivialities like whether it was better to say a test was enabled, started, or begun.

I was stumped. I couldn’t think of a name that I’d want to stamp all over my online presence. (What about my first blog’s name, you ask? Its only redeeming quality was that it had four Rs in it.)

I considered keel, which is both a substring of my own name and a nautical term. But keel is an ugly word, and doesn’t sit well next to blog, an even uglier one. It’s also a non-sequitur. (I see the blog, but where’s the keel?)

In that same vein, I considered keelhauled, which means to execute someone by dragging them along the underside of a boat. The prognosis is either drowning or being shredded by barnacles, depending on how fast the keelhauling goes. My brother pointed out that was hardly an ideal association for my online brand.

I eventually settled on R Keelan’s Blog, which is thoroughly boring, but also unobjectionable.

Thinking about keels did, however, give me the subject for this post. So post in the comments below, even if it’s years later and you’re working your way through the archives, and you can be a keel plate owner too.

cthia wrote:what was that trick the Sollies used to get more range out of its missile? They strapped a CM drive node at the very top? Did that effectively make their ship board missile dual drive or the CM dual drive? LOL Which fuels a question. Are CMs dual drive? I think RMN CMs are dual drive because of their standoff range. If not, can they be? BTW, I never even considered that CMs are also launched offbore, until UH. Dunno why or how I missed that fact.

cthia wrote:And, where did Weber get the notion of Keel Plate Owner anyway?

Dauntless wrote:The idea is fun but unlike the discussions about how to improve the Roland or Avalon, which are nearing dead horse status, until RFC gives us more info then an Invictus class SD(P) is the deadliest ship in space.

we simply don't have enough info about the LDs or what will prove useful from the SLN R&D to even begin to speculate about improvements.

tlb wrote:

cthia wrote:Again, I'm interested in how a ship of the wall may change its tactics IF IT HAD to operate as a singleton. Who better to demonstrate those tactics than Honor, and what better time to do so than against a slower opponent while still enjoying the advantage in missile range.

cthia wrote:If it would always be a massacre in Honor's favor, then what the hell are we arguing about; let's be about it and put Honor's Heine in an SD(P) - replete with design elements donated from all of the GA's navies, to protect her Heine AT ALL COSTS as the premise of the thread suggests.

The military evaluates its tactics by wargaming them, as you have seen in many examples in the books. They know that a proper evaluation can not come if the opposition force is significantly inferior to the side being tested. That was one of the many problems that the SLN faced, for decades (if not centuries) the Op force was not as good as the side being judged. That is not the RMN way; when Michelle wanted to see what Michael Oversteegen could do, she gave Apollo to the Op force.

So the authorities at Manticore are not going to brainstorm tactics by putting Honor in an SD and sending her forth. She is far too valuable to be treated that way. If you really think that this is something RFC would do, then we will just have to wait and see; but to me it sounds like fanfic.

Galactic Sapper wrote:More likely after a few years they'll draft her as the semi-permanent opfor commander for the Crusher.

cthia wrote:
Thinking about Keel Plate Owners. Are there any original members on the site still active? Original, meaning, became members within the first year or so of the site's maiden voyage? Is Duckk a Keel Plate Owner?

And, where did Weber get the notion of Keel Plate Owner anyway?