The 'Turons of Tellsburg' - Jonathan Davis' Fiery Trial

Hello Mr. Davis. First, thanks for taking the time to respond here. I imagine many people in your position wouldn’t bother and it says a lot about you that you did.

I’m one of the people who have complained both here and on Audible. My overal complaint still exists but it’s nice to know you did try to get the pronunciation correct, as far as you knew. As a narrator overall, you’ve got a pleasent voice to listen to. I would have no problem listen to any other works narrated by you. Unfortunately the pronunciation in this book just made it a slog to get through and overall made the story much less enjoyable, for me.

It’s nice to know you had a list of words and their pronunciation. It’s disconcerting to know so very many of them were inconsistent with the previous books. I’m curious to know where the list came from. If it’s from Mr. Weber then maybe I’m hearing how things are supposed to be pronounced for the first time. If it’s from the producer then I’m wondering how he/she made the list.

I’m surprised that there isn’t a review process where someone listens to a chapter of the new book and a chapter of the previous book to verify things like this for consistency. I understand listening to every previous book as the narrator isn’t viable. But I would think someone, somewhere should listen to an hour or so of a previous book and the new one, long before the new one is finished.

Anyway, thank you again for taking the time to post here.

Dear Mr. Davis - I am very pleased to hear from you regarding my concerns with the pronunciations and the process involved with continuing a popular series.

I find it fascinating that you actually asked numerous times about the correct pronunciation of TERRAN. The Firey Trials pronunciation you used has been mentioned in many reviews on the Audible site as you know and I am astounded to learn you brought it up more than a couple of times. I wonder how those with whom you conferred could not know TERRAN - TERRAIN - TERRAFORMING - TERRITORY. Is it too obvious?

I am very glad you answered my question concerning ARROGANCE OR IGNORANCE. I am pleased to learn it was neither of those.

As I have mentioned, you are one of my favorite narrators. I mentioned SNOW CRASH but the Destiny's Crucible Series which I compare favorably with SAFEHOLD, and The WINDUP GIRL are also favored listens. Due to those favorites, it pains me to be so negative about FIREY TRIALS - but I am deeply affected by the Safehold Series and for the reasons mentioned the pronunciations are critical to my full enjoyment of the series.

I admire your work and wish I were not so pained by the Firey Trials narration. Please forgive me for that.

Barry Bozeman - Knoxville, TN.

Dear Mr. Davis,

Thank you for offering to take questions concerning the process. I would love to know how you do it.

Do you actually read from the published text? OR Do you sit in front of a large KINDLE type screen with the text projected?
Do you preview the chapter you are to read prior to each session? How long does a session last?
How many recording sessions are required for a 30 plus hour book?
Is an editor on hand to catch potential mistakes? Or does someone review each day's recording and approve or point out potential errors?

You might not have the time or inclination to listen to the series but isn't there an editor from McMillan who is intimately involved with the series to supervise the production?
Doesn't Mr. Weber approve the final product?

I guess I understand the demands on your time and I would never expect a professional narrator to mimic a previous reader, but I am one of those people so enthralled by Safehold, I listen to the series almost constantly prior to the release of a new addition. As a confirmed multi-tasker, I have my DOT or TAP or Fire table playing back Safehold in every room as I go about my day. I used to use music but that has been replaced by audiobooks I got hooked on while driving 65K miles a year as a professional audio sales director who demonstrated speakers and gear all across the USA.

I suffer from tinnitus so I cannot sleep without something in the background and as a result, my Amazon Fire statistics from Nov and Dec 2018 show 600 hours of listening in the last week of NOV and 3 weeks of Dec. all of those hours were Safehold - I may be the most innundated Safeholian audio addict on the planet. I can quote chapter and verse filling in words before they are spoken. In the case of Wyman and Culp, I can tell who is speaking without an identifier i.e. Merlin said: "one tries".

For instance, your voicing for the Emerald Oil rig engineer is very similar to the Scottish voice Wyman used for Narmann

I cannot imagine taking on the Firey Trials job without having heard the rest of the series - but that's just me. I guess I can understand your lack of awareness due to never having heard the previous books in the series. For me, that lack of continuity is detrimental to the series.

This is not an indictment of your ability as a narrator. You are great at it. And that makes it all the more painful that you were brought in to replace your friend Oliver without his acquired feel for the characters I love so well.

Sorry but as Cayleb says: "Here I stand I can do no other" because I love these characters and literally pray I survive to hear the end of the series.

Aurabass-

Wow, that's a lot of questions. Ok, let's see...

1) I use a tablet, but many narrators choose to read from the hardcopy. The session moves smoother with a tablet.

2) Most of us read the story prior to the session, some read on the fly, lending a more natural read.

3) Sessions are usually a 7 hour work day. A book of this magnitude took a month to complete. Most projects take about a week.

4)There is usually a director and an engineer to catch errors; I also am quite vigilant in self correcting myself. Than there is a QC person and an editor for post production. In this case, there was a pronunciation glossary, and we followed it. We were not aware that Safehold names were being mispronounced.

5) There is a very quick turnaround in audiobook production, from the time of casting to production to post. If there are notes from the author ( or a company like Lucasfilm) we usually hear from them, and correct during a pickup session.

6) If a narrator/actor is replacing someone, they do their best to represent the essence of the character, and focus on the story. For instance, Michael Gambon replacing Richard Harris as Dumbledore in the Harry Potter series. Or Daniel Craig as James Bond. Or Marisa Tomei as Aunt May. Quite different interpretations from previous incarnations. An actor will need the freedom to follow their own instincts, and narration is not mimicry. In the end, some listeners will enjoy the choices made and some will not.

Again, regarding the pronunciation of Safeholdian vocabulary, I am confident that it will be corrected for future Safehold titles, regardless of who the narrator will be.

Cheers!

Dear Jonathan, (hope my use of your first name does not offend)

I truly appreciate your taking time to tell how you work to produce the audible versions. Your answers were much as I suspected and I thank you for confirming my suspicions.

I am dismayed that you spent a month on this without the assistance of at least one dedicated Safehold listener. You are too good at this to have been left to suffer these slings and arrows due to poor support from the publisher; support that couldn't even tell how TERRAN or Tellisburg are pronounced in continuity with the previous narrations.

With an editing producer, engineer, QC person, and director on hand, there are 4 people besides yourself involved with the work. What surprises me most is it appears none of them were familiar with the series. Not one had taken the time to listen to any of the previous audible narrations?

This isn't some new series from an unknown author. This is book 10 in a very popular NYT best-selling series by a popular author with this and the Honorverse Series. Thousands of books have been sold to an avid fan base, yet no one at McMillian or the hard copy publisher finds it imperative to have at least one person on hand who is intimately familiar with Wyman's or Culp's highly acclaimed work? This Series is 13 years old with 265 hours of previously recorded examples of pronunciations and characters.

The publishers must know how terrible the reviews of Kevin T. Collins narration MT&T were? It is a public review site.

I think that more than anything leaves me stunned and baffled. Someone is making a good deal of money off of the series and the people who pay for Audible versions. 109 MILLION audiobooks were sold in 2018 up 22% from the previous year with revenues up 32% according to available statistical data for the industry.

Weber's Safehold series on the Audible site has received over 15,000 ratings from readers who took the time to review the various Safehold books.

Collins narration of MIDST TOIL AND TRIBULATION is panned by every one of 40 reviewers save 2. That's 95% of the listener's who took the time to write a review for Audible, many who described Collins work as "terrible, horrible, & the worst" with primary emphasis on pronunciations..

LINK https://www.audible.com/pd/Midst-Toil-and-Tribulation-Audiobook/B009EUA1LK?ref=a_series_c5_lProduct_1_6&pf_rd_p=284b47b1-a5db-4711-9667-612f2ac7458e&pf_rd_r=CWAM7P918ZMY9W90CQMF&LINK

Is the industry truly so clueless? This is a 2.5 Billion dollar entertainment industry and McMillan and/or Weber are not concerned enough to insist on having at minimum one person during the recording process who is intimately familiar with the series narration and the opinions of many listeners? I contend you were poorly used by an audible publisher who has to do better.

I VOLUNTEER - as a Tennessean *the Volunteer State - I will provide my service for free to help the next narrator with CONTINUITY of pronunciation and characterizations. I am a qualified recording engineer having produced albums and as a dealer for professional audio recording equipment and I personally care enough about this series to Volunteer my time to assist any narrator.

AN OPEN PLEA TO DAVID WEBER REGARDING "then they kissed" the 3 words that evidently got Oliver Wyman barred from Safehold.

Now knowing that Wyman was not alone during the recording process for his Safehold narrations, I am shocked he would be held responsible to the degree that his previous acclaimed narration has now been ended.

There was a production director, editor, QC person, and engineer involved in the recording process. There is production and post-production where errors are supposed to be rectified.

We have no way to know how or why "then they kissed" got onto the final published Audible version of "AT THE SIGN OF TRIUMPH" but it seems clear there were 4 or 5 people in a position to catch the mistake and Wyman was not the final editor.

Why Wyman, who obviously has a great affinity for the series and whose talent has amplified and embellished Weber's excellent work is the fall guy for this mistake while the staff of recording process people are ignored is a mystery.

It seems it was a greater "crime" for Wyman's three inadvertent words than the mispronunciations of names of key characters and places by narrators like Collins.

Wyman has received high praise from a vast number of Safehold reviewers. It is clear the majority of Safehold Audiobook reviewers love Wyman's work and have serious issues with others.
This dedicated Safehold addict was never negatively affected by 'then they kissed'.

I beg Mr. Weber to reconsider. Wyman has been nothing but an asset to this series while his replacements (save Culp) have drawn considerable criticism. Please reconsider Mr. Weber. Oliver Wyman is a true asset to your Safehold Series.

A whole month for a Weber door-stopper. *Que Sulu voice* Oh myyyyyy.

Definitely gives insight to the whole recording process.

That means most narrators usually do 2-4 books a month depending. That's one heck of a job then.

That would also explain why bigger series, such as this one, would have a round-table of different narrators too. Depending on their availability and scheduling.

PS: Loved your take on Nahrmahn. He's a fun imp of a man. Reminds me of Mister Mxyzptlk of superman fame. In terms of endless deviousness.

One good thing for me coming out of all of this: I sent a tweet to Oliver Wyman @MrKawfy with a link to this thread on the forum and Oliver gifted me this very informative reply I don't think he would mind my passing it along :

Oliver Wyman Replying to @bassbird
Wow. First off, thank you so much for your kind words about my work. I haven't read through all of the posts, but I will when I have a moment, and I am certainly going to respond (I probably should have addressed the ad-lib fiasco sooner. That was my bad)... ... but I would like to say that I am sorry about the recording mishap, and as you surmised, while it was cheeky of me to have done it for my own entertainment in the first place, it was ultimately the responsibility of the post-production team to edit it out.
I bear no ill will to anyone though. And, as I'm sure you know, Jonathan Davis is an extraordinarily talented narrator. The Safehold series might be some of the most difficult books in the world to narrate because of the names and the endless cast of characters....
I screwed up a LOT in the first book. I didn't know how to pronounce naval terms back then. And I still can't believe that no one gave me flak about putting Cary Grant in there too. XD
Replying to @MrKawfy @bassbird

JDavisNarrator wrote:Hello everyone,
This is Jonathan Davis, the narrator of Through Fiery Trials.
As in many industries, it is always difficult to replace someone, in this case an admired narrator of a very popular series. I have been on both ends of the spectrum before. Though this may be the final time I accept the offer, no matter how popular the series may be! Oliver Wyman is a friend of mine, and I am a big fan of his work; we started out in this medium around the same time and are both veterans of our industry. I hope I can clarify the process of recording an audiobook, and if any of you have any questions, I will do my best to answer them.

First, regarding the pronunciation of names and places in the Safehold universe, it is regrettable that there were mispronunciations. Before we began production, I inquired about being true to Mr Weber's work, and to Ollie's narration, and I was provided with an extensive vocabulary/pronunciation list.
Unfortunatedly, the compilation was incorrect, including the word Terran, which I questioned numerous times during the recording sessions. In the end, I followed my director's advice, and the word list provided. PIKA, Tellesburg, Nimue: I pronounced them as phonetically written on the word list. On my behalf, I apologize for the errors. It was not "arrogance" or "ignorance". If I am chose to continue as narrator of this series, I am certain it will be corrected, hopefully with direct input from Mr. Weber.

As far as listening to previous audiobooks, I was provided with a few character samples of Ollie's renditions of major characters, and I was given leeway to proceed with my own choices,my own interpretations. No, forgive me, but I did not listen to a 34 hour audiobook to perfect every single character impression. My focus is always on the story first,and telling the story, not mimicry of a previous narrator.

I hope this is helpful, and as I stated before, I will answer questions, if anyone has any.

Best wishes,
Jonathan

Jonathan --- I wish someone had reached out to me about it. (In case the name doesn't tell you, I'm David. )

To be honest, I don't listen to audible books. It isn't the way that I imbibe my stories or the way I process information and I don't have the sort of time chunks I can invest in listening.

I have no idea why Mr. Wyman made the addition to the last book that he did, and no one ever gave me an explanation when I first inquired about it. That's why I insisted that he not do future books. If at any time you or anyone else involved in one of these projects have any questions, however, please contact me directly! I thought I had made that clear in my previous correspondence (which apparently wasn't passed on to you; not blaming you for it), and that's the main reason I didn't worry about this when they told me you would be taking over. I listened to snippets from some of your previous work, liked what I heard, and signed off on the change. It never occurred to me that they might give you direction that took you this far off the beaten path! I still haven't received my author's copies of the dead tree book or the audio book --- there was a mixup at Tor --- and I was trying to hold off on commenting until I'd had a chance to listen for myself. Since you've been brave enough --- and honest enough --- to venture into the lions' den on this one, though, I thought I should probably go ahead and add my own explanation of the process at this point.

Thanks for talking to the folks!

Dear Runsforcelery,

As a Treecat lover, I would be happy to provide celery without the need for running.

Knowing that you never listen to the Audible versions of your work explains a lot. As one who can only enjoy your work via Audible, I must tell you I think you have been missing something quite special.

Oliver Wyman had a knack for bringing your characters to life in a very special way. His 5 narrated books in the series are iconic and the difference in the reviews from listeners between his narrations and those of Collins (and now Davis) is dramatic.

Jonathan is an excellent narrator as you discovered when listening to those samples, but being a great narrator is not just about an excellent voice.

Continuity is very important for me and, according to the reviews, many of the listeners. Wyman established his way of bringing your characters to life in a way that connected with a vast majority of listeners. Once again this comes from reading the Audible version reviews.

As Jonathan and Oliver say, there are 5 people who oversee the recording process and the narrators are not the editors or final approvers of the work.

I beg you - I mean BEG YOU - to reconsider your decision concerning Oliver Wyman. He has become the voice of Safehold - a clear beneficial addition to your great epic work through 5 of the 10 books. I hope you might find the time to listen to him.

I have listened to the full series 9 times - except Firey Trials only twice and the earlier first 5 12, 11, and 10 times each. I think that makes me an expert on the audible versions of a series I truly love and admire.

Barry Bozeman