Haven Victorious

thanatos wrote:

cthia wrote:I can't help but feel Beth is secretly worried deep down inside about the lasting stability of the restored Republic. What will happen to it after the changing of the guard? After Pritchard is replaced with a fair election, how is the course of the current government maintained with so many Saint-Just style of sympathizers waiting in the wings? Trust me, I've personally been a part of much more surprising elections.

How is Beth to know that the leopard isn't really a chameleon waiting to change its colors again? With so much shared tech it could prove fatally difficult for the Star Empire this time around trying to recover from a blow like that. And even more difficult for Beth and her power base to bounce back from being so wrong.

I believe this point is addresses in the Epilogue of Uncompromising Honor. Elizabeth is well aware of the dangers, especially since Prichart can only remain in power for 3 5-year terms I believe, which is the reflection of pre-prolong thinking. Which is why the two of them have agreed on deepening the cultural ties between Manticore and Haven by granting automatic citizenship for anyone who moves in either direction. It's how Manticore and Beowulf ended up such close nations, with citizens on both sides getting married and having such deep political ties despite Beowulf's membership in the SL. So the new arrangement goes even further than that, making it very difficult for Havenites to view Manticorans (or it's alliance members) as enemies and getting the sort of political toehold among the population (the way the Legislaturalists and the CPS did to divert attention away from their failings).

runsforcelery wrote: It's possible that regular officers might have managed to secure control of some of the sub fleets, but it's unlikely without someone like Shannon Foraker planting an "Oopsie' in the covering StateSec superdreadnoughts' core programming.

roseandheather wrote:Hello all, I hate exams, I have not had time to catch up on this (rapidly multiplying) thread, could someone please fill me in as to the salient points of the discussion before my head explodes?

(Hi, Your Celeryness. I see you posting in here. Remember me? )

From what I have been able to see in my rapid race through these posts, I have this to say:

1. Elizabeth is not telepathic and had no way of knowing why Theisman shot Saint-Just. Her conclusions were entirely understandable, even while they were also wrong.

2. I love Tom Theisman unabashedly.

3. I love Eloise Pritchart unabashedly.

4. I love Elizabeth dearly but dear GOD did she need a whack or three with a Character Development Stick where Haven is concerned.

5. I'd have been suspicious of Tom's motives too in her position.

6. ::cries forever because Haven-related Emotions::

ericth wrote:I do believe that RFC let something slip..

He's been coy about the exact nature of Shannon's Oopsie at the end of AoV, whether or not the Navy ships fired or the State Sec ships just blew up. But then there is this upthread:

runsforcelery wrote: It's possible that regular officers might have managed to secure control of some of the sub fleets, but it's unlikely without someone like Shannon Foraker planting an "Oopsie' in the covering StateSec superdreadnoughts' core programming.

roseandheather wrote:Hello all, I hate exams, I have not had time to catch up on this (rapidly multiplying) thread, could someone please fill me in as to the salient points of the discussion before my head explodes?

(Hi, Your Celeryness. I see you posting in here. Remember me? )

From what I have been able to see in my rapid race through these posts, I have this to say:

1. Elizabeth is not telepathic and had no way of knowing why Theisman shot Saint-Just. Her conclusions were entirely understandable, even while they were also wrong.

2. I love Tom Theisman unabashedly.

3. I love Eloise Pritchart unabashedly.

4. I love Elizabeth dearly but dear GOD did she need a whack or three with a Character Development Stick where Haven is concerned.

5. I'd have been suspicious of Tom's motives too in her position.

6. ::cries forever because Haven-related Emotions::

TFLYTSNBN wrote:Haven assasinated her father, her prime minister, tried to assasinate her niece. Why should she not hate Haven?

TFLYTSNBN wrote:

roseandheather wrote:Hello all, I hate exams, I have not had time to catch up on this (rapidly multiplying) thread, could someone please fill me in as to the salient points of the discussion before my head explodes?

(Hi, Your Celeryness. I see you posting in here. Remember me? )

From what I have been able to see in my rapid race through these posts, I have this to say:

1. Elizabeth is not telepathic and had no way of knowing why Theisman shot Saint-Just. Her conclusions were entirely understandable, even while they were also wrong.

2. I love Tom Theisman unabashedly.

3. I love Eloise Pritchart unabashedly.

4. I love Elizabeth dearly but dear GOD did she need a whack or three with a Character Development Stick where Haven is concerned.

5. I'd have been suspicious of Tom's motives too in her position.

6. ::cries forever because Haven-related Emotions::

Haven assasinated her father, her prime minister, tried to assasinate her niece. Why should she not hate Haven?

cthia wrote:Not to mention what was done to Honor and Nimitz and the downright unspeakable crimes against nature committed on Blackbird* that probably almost cost Honor her sanity and her career. Plus, they were abusing POWs until Honor gave them a lesson in compassion.

*Guilty by association.

cthia wrote:

ericth wrote:I do believe that RFC let something slip..

He's been coy about the exact nature of Shannon's Oopsie at the end of AoV, whether or not the Navy ships fired or the State Sec ships just blew up. But then there is this upthread:

runsforcelery wrote: It's possible that regular officers might have managed to secure control of some of the sub fleets, but it's unlikely without someone like Shannon Foraker planting an "Oopsie' in the covering StateSec superdreadnoughts' core programming.

Well now I'm curious, because I thought it was always clear that she initiated some sort of self-destruct mechanism.