I apologize for the lengthy time between replying to this can-o-worms. Blame it on the business of my family life . . . second. And the interesting and poignant counterarguments made by Vince, tlb and others first. I needed time to absorb it all, so that I could reply appropriately. Vince asked me to keep in mind the ultimate outcome and to not miss the forest for the trees. I should at least give him that because he labored so hard in his response, which obviously solicited much thought from him. I owe him that. At the same time I must remain true to myself. Having said that . . .
First order of business. Some of you are making the exact same error and stepping in the exact same trap every time I argue a stance, making it about me, again. It ain't about me. I'm simply the messenger who happens to constantly get himself into controversial trouble because he dares to peek under the skin where angels fear to tread. In a manner, I suppose I could be charged with being a Peeping Tom. However, TBH, in this particular case, I do feel a bit of kinship with what surely would be the stance of the Opposition on Grayson should the truth ever be set free. But in no way does that convict me.
Secondly, what everyone is missing is that we are talking about Grayson. You are all trying to heap secular mindsets and secular attitudes upon the mindsets of a religious people. When in Rome you must act like the Romans. You must think like the Romans. Grayson isn't like their fanatical counterparts, Masada, no. But they are devoutly religious. If you try to analyze how Grayson will react to what I have presented, you must allow for what beats loudly in their hearts and courses through their veins, which is their faith, and what that vesture of faith will mean to the reaction of Graysons to this can-o-worms -- which will undoubtedly be determined by their system of beliefs. Indeed, should be determined by their system of beliefs.
Benjamin's Restoration, though wanting to move Grayson forward as a society, isn't about abandoning their faith. Even if Benjamin wanted to abandon the basis of life on Grayson - which is deeply rooted in faith - he would fail miserably, regardless of how much the many followers of Harrington love her. Again, Grayson owes Harrington and the Star Kingdom a huge debt of gratitude, but they do not owe either of them their soul. Selling their soul to the devil is the charge Mueller and Company levies against Benjamin. Abandoning their belief system would validate that claim. Graysons won't abandon their faith, not even for the love and gratitude they harbor for Harrington. The proof of that is the reality of how close Benjamin's Restoration came to tumbling down when it appeared that it was Harrington's greed of cutting corners to maximize her profits which resulted in the death of children. The buzzards were surely circling carcass for certain. Having said all of that . . .
I cannot believe all of you can't see the distinction in the mindsets of the two dueling systems. They are separately based on . . .
- The skills of man. Secular attitudes.
- The judgment of God. Nonsecular attitudes. The skills of man.
God does not inseparably factor into Manticoran dueling.
For instance . . .
tlb wrote:You are confusing this with a sporting contest where there are rules about fairness: such as forbidding steroids. Trial by Combat acts under the presumption that God will aid the righteous and strike down the other.
Regardless of what your Christian beliefs may be, that is a secular response, born of infidels.
On Grayson there are rules about fairness! Fairness is innate, inherent. Inseparable. Fairness is part and parcel to their beliefs. Their morals. Their scruples. Their values. It is indivisible as a part of their faith. At the heart of Grayson's faith is Grayson's God. There is nothing unfair about the tenets of God, in any faith! Interjecting unfairness upon the duels on Grayson is enough to bring the house down. To do so would spit on the very sanctity of what is just. To do so would embarrass the Graysons in the eyes of Tester. To do so would eliminate faith that God will judge. Abandoning fairness would signal a complete departure from faith and trust in God. At the very worst, it may cause many to question their religious beliefs. Proof positive of the importance and fear predicated on Star Trek's Prime Directive.
Vince has some very cogent points, but his main stumbling block is the exact same secular mistake . . .
Vince wrote:Burdette's sworn obligation was to the Constitution of Grayson, the Protector of Grayson and his Steading of Burdette, in that order.
Not exactly! There is something very crucial missing from your list. What is it? Only a true Christian who lives his life by faith as the Graysons will readily recognize the error in your logic. First and foremost is the Graysons' obligation to Tester! God should always come first!
"Render unto Caesar the things that are Caesar's, and unto God the things that are God's". [Matthew 22:21]
I'll trust that you can guess who gets first consideration when there's a conflict of interest. Or rather, who should get first consideration.
This entire notion sits center stage with the Kentucky clerk who refuses to issue a marriage license to gays.
Again. What does a Christian do when secular laws puts him on the wrong side of God? It is one real reason why so many people fight against our current government and its treatment of people seeking asylum - regardless that it is actually written in the law that they may do so.
Vince wrote:If he couldn't in good conscience accept Benjamin's reforms, he should have resigned his steadholdership.
I disagree on the same grounds that was trotted out to me when I argued that Beowulf should have long last left the League. Several people were quick to point out that remaining a part of the League afforded Beowulf a better position in which to rage against the dying of the light. Same with Burdette. It would have been a failure to the Doctrine of his Test as a Steadholder. And a failure to his God given position and obligations as a Key to fulfill the destiny of his Test.
Vince wrote:Instead he decided to conspire to murder innocents as well as Honor, as well as committing treason along the way. He even was told by Mueller of all people that they had reached the limit of what they could do legally to oppose the Church and the Protector*. He and Mueller made the decision to step beyond legal means to illegal, treasonous means, after deciding the ends justified the means . . .
I've been meaning to reread those passages but haven't gotten the chance. I concede those points. But it doesn't change the squirming worms that could cause a Constitutional Crisis. It certainly could and most likely would affect Burdette's legacy. But the Protector and his Champion may still be skating on thin ice.
Everyone stop for a moment and consider this . . .
The galaxy at large is still a bit prejudiced against genies. Even in the Manticoran neck of the woods these exact same secrets are kept. Even QEIII guards the details of her genetic tampering. Grayson didn't even know that they are genies. That was a revelation that came from Allison Harrington.
BUT!
The main difference is Honor's specific abilities which makes the duel against Burdette not only unfair, but deceitful. But most importantly, unrighteous. The unfairness and deceit is "officiated" on a planet whose morals, scruples, values and teachings are inherently against it. It may be foolish to outsiders, just as dueling is foolish to me. It may be even more foolish to non Christians. However, expecting a certain status quo in virtue is not foolish to Graysons, or to any true Christian.
Do any of you understand that Honor is the only human with her ability? Does anyone realize how paranoid humanity would be if someone was to be accused of being able to read minds?
Reading Burdette's mind is exactly what Honor could do as far as detecting the crease. There is a mountain of difference that you can't sweep under the secular rug. Can Honor prove that she didn't use mind reading to defeat Burdette? A true Christian would not want to be a part of any deception and tainting of Tester's way. The danger of fornication with infidels could be highlighted and proved. I see danger lying low like a coiled snake in the grass.
****** *
Vince wrote:As far as Divine order is concerned, the source you cite is at best incorrectly citing Ephesians 6:5-8. The very first result in a Google search for Ephesians 6:5-8, does not sugarcoat the actual words that Paul, not Jesus, said.
I have not tested my theory Vince, but I believe the difference is manifested in the varying versions of the Bible.
