(Spoiler!) What's Next for the Honorverse?(Spoiler Warning!)

Thinking about Honerverse tech etc, as a generalization it's not about finding people to do the work but finding work for the people.

Weird Harold wrote:You're probably, mostly, correct. It doesn't take a large population to build a Navy, it just takes a large population to man the ships after they're built.

... because despite having no sexism, essentially no elderly, and essentially no long-term disabled (Emily notwithstanding), putting even 1% of the SKM's population under arms was an enormous strain on the economy.

Weird Harold wrote:

kzt wrote:There was probably less than a million people directly involved in producing ships, ship components and weapons. Out of 3.5 billion. So no, I'm unconvinced you need a huge population in the Honorverse to build a large lethal navy.

You're probably, mostly, correct. It doesn't take a large population to build a Navy, it just takes a large population to man the ships after they're built.

Not so much as you may think of. The Manticoran Armed Forces - Army, Marine Corps, Navy the respective support- and maintenance structure you need to fight a war - was no more than 50 Million or so, even in the days the havenite wars were at its peak. 50 Million out of 3 Billion inhabitants of the Old Star Kingdom equals to no more than 6 per 1000 inhabitants, and the Old Star Kingdom raised its population even through the wars, and before it adds San Martin to its territory, to 3.6 Billion through immigration, if I remember correctly.

The system Darius is situated in is surely able to support the lifes of 5 to 6 billion people (maybe even more), so - no. You're not really pressed because you can't find enough people to man your armed forces.

Weird Harold wrote:

kzt wrote:There was probably less than a million people directly involved in producing ships, ship components and weapons. Out of 3.5 billion. So no, I'm unconvinced you need a huge population in the Honorverse to build a large lethal navy.

You're probably, mostly, correct. It doesn't take a large population to build a Navy, it just takes a large population to man the ships after they're built.

Oh right.

The entire RMN was something under 30 million. Out of 3.5 billion, in an existential war. What percentage of the US, Germany and the USSR total population was in the military during WW2?

Let me give you a hint. Out of the 132 million people in the US in 1940 the US had about 1/2 of the people in uniform that Manticore did of 3.5 billion.

kzt wrote:The entire RMN was something under 30 million. Out of 3.5 billion, in an existential war. What percentage of the US, Germany and the USSR total population was in the military during WW2?

The point isn't the percentage of total population. The point is that you can build a ship with only a few people -- 100, 500, 1000, whatever; you need roughly ten times that many to man the ship.

Add the minor detail that your build crew can build multiple ships, but your ship's crew can only man one ship per crew.

However big the percentages of total population might be, (or not be as the case may be,) the numbers to man a Navy are going to be orders of magnitude larger than the numbers to build a Navy.

Weird Harold wrote:

kzt wrote:The entire RMN was something under 30 million. Out of 3.5 billion, in an existential war. What percentage of the US, Germany and the USSR total population was in the military during WW2?

The point isn't the percentage of total population. The point is that you can build a ship with only a few people -- 100, 500, 1000, whatever; you need roughly ten times that many to man the ship.

Add the minor detail that your build crew can build multiple ships, but your ship's crew can only man one ship per crew.

However big the percentages of total population might be, (or not be as the case may be,) the numbers to man a Navy are going to be orders of magnitude larger than the numbers to build a Navy.

Those folks are also genetically engineered and raised to man a navy. Training from birth has to be hands on and labor intensive. Those trainers are also specialized. Then you need all the support production to maintain the navy and the rest of their society. The demands the MAlign face to man a navy massive enough to swamp the Grand Alliance quickly out internal resources only is staggering. They need a massive population or they won't be able to support the activity required for their plans.

Well sure. It’s the difference between employing one tenth of the art history majors and 250% of the art history majors in the US. Or to put it another way, between 0.02% of the population and 0.9% of the population. Which if you apply it to the entire population of the US (babies to elderly) 0.9% is about the size of the entire DoD.

So no, I don’t buy that argument either.

kzt wrote:Well sure. It’s the difference between employing one tenth of the art history majors and 250% of the art history majors in the US. Or to put it another way, between 0.02% of the population and 0.9% of the population. Which if you apply it to the entire population of the US (babies to elderly) 0.9% is about the size of the entire DoD.

So no, I don’t buy that argument either.

We'll see. I think you are wrong, but it's wait and see.

kzt wrote:So no, I don’t buy that argument either.

Well sure you don't buy that argument; you're arguing an entirely different point and the mere fact that manning ships takes more people than building them is irrelevant to you.

The minor detail that there is textev that says the RMN had manning problems is just another inconvenience to you.

There is one simple way to increase the chance to find the MAlign (although it's going to be VERY tedious for some analysts).

Post ridiculous monetary rewards for verifiable information about the MAlign, the Detweilers and associates. Greed is a very powerful motivator for some people.