Tamaguchi's biggest Mistake in SoV

drinksmuchcoffee wrote:What would have stopped Tremaine from sending a LAC or two screaming after each CL (or DD)?

A smarter move on Tamaguchi's part would have been to have one of his light units go dark immediately after coming out of hyper.

Tamagutchi doesn't have clairvoyance. When he hypered into Wloclawek, he was the only fish in the pond, as far as he knew. So there was no point to go dark with one light unit - after all, why should he?

I'm not sure, if he could go dark with one of his units the moment he detected Tremaines Hyper-footprint (assumimg he had thought of that maneuver before he arrived in the first place). If I remember that correctly, the sensors on board the ships hypering out don't work perfectly during the first seconds after that event (something to do with recalibration to the new environment or so) - so maybe that would be an option - but on the other hand: he had a full squadron of BCs plus screen against a force with one CA as its strongest unit - there the nearly genetic Solarian Arrogance comes into play.

Eagleeye wrote:

drinksmuchcoffee wrote:What would have stopped Tremaine from sending a LAC or two screaming after each CL (or DD)?

A smarter move on Tamaguchi's part would have been to have one of his light units go dark immediately after coming out of hyper.

Tamagutchi doesn't have clairvoyance. When he hypered into Wloclawek, he was the only fish in the pond, as far as he knew. So there was no point to go dark with one light unit - after all, why should he?

I'm not sure, if he could go dark with one of his units the moment he detected Tremaines Hyper-footprint (assumimg he had thought of that maneuver before he arrived in the first place). If I remember that correctly, the sensors on board the ships hypering out don't work perfectly during the first seconds after that event (something to do with recalibration to the new environment or so) - so maybe that would be an option - but on the other hand: he had a full squadron of BCs plus screen against a force with one CA as its strongest unit - there the nearly genetic Solarian Arrogance comes into play.

Dropping a sensor picket at the hyperlimit is something seen more in Manty and Havenite formations- because they have been burned so many times. It does make you wonder when a SL commander will say "hey, I've got an idea" and start enforcing a sensor picket just so some data might make it home. Especially since at this point, hard sensor data is more important than the survival of any individual mobile command.

Hello,

could somebody please mention the number of the chapter?

Got it at the other thread:

Eagleeye wrote:

phillies wrote:There appears to have been a minor computer glitch here. The first item in the thread, by "Cthia", quotes a prior comment, by "Sov". That prior quote must me from some other thread. Where?

No glitch. SoV equals to "Shadow of Victory", and Cthia quoted a part of chapter 70, that you find on pages 662 and 663 in the hardcover-edition, to make his point.

Hans wrote:Hello,

could somebody please mention the number of the chapter?

Got it at the other thread: [...]

The fight between Tremaine and Tamaguchi goes from Chapter 70 to 72, pages 655 to 700 of the HC-edition of SoV.

I think it should be mentioned in passing that this represents a milestone for the SLN. It was the first time the SLN ran from an opposing force in centuries.

Tamaguchi was intimidated. The Manties arrived fashionably late.

Eagleeye wrote:

drinksmuchcoffee wrote:What would have stopped Tremaine from sending a LAC or two screaming after each CL (or DD)?

A smarter move on Tamaguchi's part would have been to have one of his light units go dark immediately after coming out of hyper.

Tamagutchi doesn't have clairvoyance. When he hypered into Wloclawek, he was the only fish in the pond, as far as he knew. So there was no point to go dark with one light unit - after all, why should he?

I'm not sure, if he could go dark with one of his units the moment he detected Tremaines Hyper-footprint (assumimg he had thought of that maneuver before he arrived in the first place). If I remember that correctly, the sensors on board the ships hypering out don't work perfectly during the first seconds after that event (something to do with recalibration to the new environment or so) - so maybe that would be an option - but on the other hand: he had a full squadron of BCs plus screen against a force with one CA as its strongest unit - there the nearly genetic Solarian Arrogance comes into play.

The fact that task force commanders are not clairvoyant is precisely why anybody with brains would leave a picket outside the hyper limit when entering a system where you don't know what opposition, if any, you would be facing.

I am surprised that it wouldn't be SOP.

drinksmuchcoffee wrote:The fact that task force commanders are not clairvoyant is precisely why anybody with brains would leave a picket outside the hyper limit when entering a system where you don't know what opposition, if any, you would be facing.

I am surprised that it wouldn't be SOP.

He did follow Solly SOP. Arrognace is the SOP for BF.

They have been the 800 pound gorilla of the galaxy for centuries. Nobody, until Byng ran into (very briefly) Mike Henke, even dared to do anything except drop their wedges and crap themselves when the Solaran Navy came over the limit for centuries.

The very thought that dropping a destroyer in a back stop position would be beyond them. How many centuries has it been since the BF has actually had to fight much less been in a fight where such a maneuver would be necessary?

cthia wrote:It was the first time the SLN ran from an opposing force in centuries.

Not quite. Lacoon II was full of SLN retreats and defeats.

Weird Harold wrote:

cthia wrote:It was the first time the SLN ran from an opposing force in centuries.

Not quite. Lacoon II was full of SLN retreats and defeats.

Yeah, but how many of them would Tamaguichi have had time to her about in enough detail to do any good. IIRC he still didn't have hard data from Crandall's little oopsie at Spindle.

jdtinIA wrote:

cthia wrote:It was the first time the SLN ran from an opposing force in centuries.

Weird Harold wrote:Not quite. Lacoon II was full of SLN retreats and defeats.

Yeah, but how many of them would Tamaguichi have had time to her about in enough detail to do any good. IIRC he still didn't have hard data from Crandall's little oopsie at Spindle.

Whether Tamaguchi knew about them or not is irrelevant. He wasn't the first to run, and he won't be the last.

The fact that others ran before him might save him at an inquiry where all of the incidents might be known is questionable. The SLN just might make an example of everyone with sense enough to run when they know they're outclassed (and the MAlign is probably going to steer them to that action if they don't come up with it on their own.)