Battle of Sigma Draconis predictions/speculations

Theemile wrote:

quite possibly a cat wrote:<snip>



At the end of the day, does the SLN even care about an EE violation? After all, what is the punishment? Oh, right - the SL sends the SLN BF to beat on your capital to make a point.

And, since you are the SLN BF....

Yeah, but an EE Edict violation still looks bad. Plus the SDFs that out class the SLN could still send their fleets to beat on the SLN capital. Or Sol could send people to the Mandarin's houses. The EEE is the only thing the Sollies agree on anyway.

Some SDFs have better ships on a ship to ship level - they don't have fleets and fleets of ships that are 10% or more better than the the SLN ships.

The SLN has never been scared of the SDFs because the Beowulf SDF with just 36 wallers is an extremely large SDF. Manticore with 300 Walers was the #3 navy in the universe in 1905, The Andermani, with ~200-250 wallers was #4. The other ~21 members of the "I have a squadron or more of wallers club" (or top 1% navies) are smaller than that.

Yes it will look bad, but no one else has the doctrine of the Edict than the SL - it's not a universal law, it's the biggest bully drawing a line on the school yard. And if any of the members have an issue - they don't have the firepower to do anything about it.

quite possibly a cat wrote:

Theemile wrote:

At the end of the day, does the SLN even care about an EE violation? After all, what is the punishment? Oh, right - the SL sends the SLN BF to beat on your capital to make a point.

And, since you are the SLN BF....

Yeah, but an EE Edict violation still looks bad. Plus the SDFs that out class the SLN could still send their fleets to beat on the SLN capital. Or Sol could send people to the Mandarin's houses. The EEE is the only thing the Sollies agree on anyway.

Theemile wrote:Some SDFs have better ships on a ship to ship level - they don't have fleets and fleets of ships that are 10% or more better than the the SLN ships.

The SLN has never been scared of the SDFs because the Beowulf SDF with just 36 wallers is an extremely large SDF. Manticore with 300 Walers was the #3 navy in the universe in 1905, The Andermani, with ~200-250 wallers was #4. The other ~21 members of the "I have a squadron or more of wallers club" (or top 1% navies) are smaller than that.

Yes it will look bad, but no one else has the doctrine of the Edict than the SL - it's not a universal law, it's the biggest bully drawing a line on the school yard. And if any of the members have an issue - they don't have the firepower to do anything about it.

(I've switched the top two quote attributions to what I believe were the original authors.)

The Eridani Edict may have always been a Solarian League fiat—with the SLN "gorilla" ready to enforce it—up to now. But, it seems to me, in the last few books various Manticore officers—and in CoG a certain Havenite agent—have stated that they and their respective governments would enforce the terms of the Edict on anyone who violated it.

I don't know if Manticore—and/or Haven—governments have announced this as their official policy. But I assume that at some point their ambassadors to the SL have at least hinted at it in their discussions with the Mandarins, not that those "geniuses" would have taken such statements from backwards Neo-barbs seriously.

glott wrote:The Eridani Edict may have always been a Solarian League fiat—with the SLN "gorilla" ready to enforce it—up to now. But, it seems to me, in the last few books various Manticore officers and in CoG a certain Havenite agent—have stated that they and their respective governments would enforce the terms of the Edict on anyone who violated it.

IIIRC, Weber has stated that the RMN's response to someone cueballing a world would be to retaliate in kind. The EE Edict does NOT involve such an act. The EE Edict involves disbanding the government and military, combined with some executions.

More to the point, unless the EEE is very poorly written you can't just hand off a weapon of mass destruction to a terrorist and then claim innocence when said terrorist nukes a park full of children. Now I suppose it IS theoretically possible that the government/military of Manticore and Haven disband themselves, but I think that is extremely unlikely.

Strictly speaking, enforcement of the EE Edict wouldn't come into play here, since it would be an internal strike.

quite possibly a cat wrote:

glott wrote:The Eridani Edict may have always been a Solarian League fiat—with the SLN "gorilla" ready to enforce it—up to now. But, it seems to me, in the last few books various Manticore officers and in CoG a certain Havenite agent—have stated that they and their respective governments would enforce the terms of the Edict on anyone who violated it.

IIIRC, Weber has stated that the RMN's response to someone cueballing a world would be to retaliate in kind. The EE Edict does NOT involve such an act. The EE Edict involves disbanding the government and military, combined with some executions.

More to the point, unless the EEE is very poorly written you can't just hand off a weapon of mass destruction to a terrorist and then claim innocence when said terrorist nukes a park full of children. Now I suppose it IS theoretically possible that the government/military of Manticore and Haven disband themselves, but I think that is extremely unlikely.

Strictly speaking, enforcement of the EE Edict wouldn't come into play here, since it would be an internal strike.

We might know that, but they have not let it known in universe, so any BF commander isn't thinking that, because the EE to date is not any one else's policy.

I kind of remember the post by RFC. However does anybody have the exact wording? I am trying to remember if he specifically said the 10 million civilian casualties in Beowulf would be due to Solarian action. Because the Mesan Alignment are not exactly big fans of Beowulf. And it would be kind of like RFC to make us think the 10 million deaths in Beowulf are the result of SLN action when they are actually the result of the MA.

Henry Brown wrote:I kind of remember the post by RFC. However does anybody have the exact wording? I am trying to remember if he specifically said the 10 million civilian casualties in Beowulf would be due to Solarian action. Because the Mesan Alignment are not exactly big fans of Beowulf. And it would be kind of like RFC to make us think the 10 million deaths in Beowulf are the result of SLN action when they are actually the result of the MA.

I believe that the 10 million casualties are connected with the MA, not the League. IIRC, that info came from a podcast several years ago...back far enough that I don't remember it well enough to reference it

Don

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