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Filareta's missles -- why??

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Re: Filareta's missles -- why??
Post by JohnRoth   » Sun Sep 24, 2017 1:15 am

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Loren Pechtel wrote:
pappilon wrote:First Manticore, then the Solaran League,then Haven,then, finally, Beowulf. The point of giving Filareta those missiles was to, hopefully winnow some of the remaining RMN fleet, making it easier for Haven to finish them off. That was the stated plan. Who knew that Pritchard would pull a Harrington and show up at Trevor's Star waving a flag of truce? Albrecht and clone/child whichever certainly didn't. Which, of course scuttled that 100 year plan.


The only reason to bring the Havenites to the battle was to convince him of the total helplessness of the situation. They already had extreme overkill, they didn't need the Havenite forces to win.


Who else is Victor Cachet going to report to other than Tourville?
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Re: Filareta's missles -- why??
Post by pappilon   » Sun Sep 24, 2017 5:31 am

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Loren Pechtel wrote:
pappilon wrote:First Manticore, then the Solaran League,then Haven,then, finally, Beowulf. The point of giving Filareta those missiles was to, hopefully winnow some of the remaining RMN fleet, making it easier for Haven to finish them off. That was the stated plan. Who knew that Pritchard would pull a Harrington and show up at Trevor's Star waving a flag of truce? Albrecht and clone/child whichever certainly didn't. Which, of course scuttled that 100 year plan.


The only reason to bring the Havenites to the battle was to convince him of the total helplessness of the situation. They already had extreme overkill, they didn't need the Havenite forces to win.


Yes, that is true. However, not my point. The reason AD rushed Oyster Bay was first battle of Manticore. With all but 3rd fleet destroyed, he sent in his stealth ships to destroy Manty production platforms & new construction. Then Filareta was supposed to go in and, yes get kicked in the arse by Harrington, but not before he took out some of her ships and costing her the little missile reserve she had, thus encouraging Pritchard and Theismann to take a second bite at Manticore, crushing it once and for all. Aided by the agent they have buried at the top of government.
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The imagination has to be trained into foresight and empathy.
Ursula K. LeGuinn

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Re: Filareta's missles -- why??
Post by George J. Smith   » Sun Sep 24, 2017 11:24 am

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pappilon wrote:Yes, that is true. However, not my point. The reason AD rushed Oyster Bay was first battle of Manticore. With all but 3rd fleet destroyed, he sent in his stealth ships to destroy Manty production platforms & new construction. Then Filareta was supposed to go in and, yes get kicked in the arse by Harrington, but not before he took out some of her ships and costing her the little missile reserve she had, thus encouraging Pritchard and Theismann to take a second bite at Manticore, crushing it once and for all. Aided by the agent they have buried at the top of government.



Don't forget that AD & co discussed what the new Manticoran missile systems would mean after 8th fleet obliterated the Havenite fleet at Lovat, ISTR that they also talked about moving up the implementation of Houdini.
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Re: Filareta's missles -- why??
Post by kzt   » Sun Sep 24, 2017 2:35 pm

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pappilon wrote:Yes, that is true. However, not my point. The reason AD rushed Oyster Bay was first battle of Manticore. With all but 3rd fleet destroyed, he sent in his stealth ships to destroy Manty production platforms & new construction. Then Filareta was supposed to go in and, yes get kicked in the arse by Harrington, but not before he took out some of her ships and costing her the little missile reserve she had, thus encouraging Pritchard and Theismann to take a second bite at Manticore, crushing it once and for all. Aided by the agent they have buried at the top of government.

Look at the number of missile pods that the RMN discloses at 2 BoM. They had a huge stockpile of missiles.
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Re: Filareta's missles -- why??
Post by runsforcelery   » Sun Sep 24, 2017 3:51 pm

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kzt wrote:
pappilon wrote:Yes, that is true. However, not my point. The reason AD rushed Oyster Bay was first battle of Manticore. With all but 3rd fleet destroyed, he sent in his stealth ships to destroy Manty production platforms & new construction. Then Filareta was supposed to go in and, yes get kicked in the arse by Harrington, but not before he took out some of her ships and costing her the little missile reserve she had, thus encouraging Pritchard and Theismann to take a second bite at Manticore, crushing it once and for all. Aided by the agent they have buried at the top of government.

Look at the number of missile pods that the RMN discloses at 2 BoM. They had a huge stockpile of missiles.



True, but quite a few of those pods had "Made in Nouveau Paris™" labels on them. For some reason, Honor didn't feel real compelled to tell Filareta that. Can't imagine why not. :lol:

It's true that the Alignment had significantly underestimated the numbers of missiles and pods already available to the Star Empire, and they didn't have what you might call full or accurate information on just how capable Apollo actually was. In other words, they underestimated its lethality, at least to some extent, and expected it to be available in smaller numbers. With no expectation that the Republic would stand up beside Manticore (rather than shooting it in the back as soon as the smoke of Filareta's destruction had cleared), it actually wasn't irrational of them to expect that Eleventh Fleet would inflict at least some damage on Home Fleet and significantly erode the number of all-up Mark 23s which would be available against a Beatrice II.


"Oh, bother!" said Pooh, as Piglet came back from the dead.
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Re: Filareta's missles -- why??
Post by kzt   » Sun Sep 24, 2017 4:03 pm

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runsforcelery wrote:True, but quite a few of those pods had "Made in Nouveau Paris™" labels on them. For some reason, Honor didn't feel real compelled to tell Filareta that. Can't imagine why not. :lol:


Oh. Got to admit that didn't occur to me.
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Re: Filareta's missles -- why??
Post by pappilon   » Mon Sep 25, 2017 3:37 am

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kzt wrote:
runsforcelery wrote:True, but quite a few of those pods had "Made in Nouveau Paris™" labels on them. For some reason, Honor didn't feel real compelled to tell Filareta that. Can't imagine why not. :lol:


Oh. Got to admit that didn't occur to me.


also have to remember to shift perspective. As reader we are 3rd person omniscient. we know what all the sides know. One has to shift that to see and analyze from the first person participant (semi-omniscient) perspective.
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The imagination has to be trained into foresight and empathy.
Ursula K. LeGuinn

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