Hope & Aspirations for the Finale

It would be nice if RFC would take the training wheels off of the GSN in storyline and serve up a feast of them defending their own planet for a change, without benefit of the RMN in another Battle of Yeltsin. It happened off-screen during OB iinm, but off-screen may as well be classified material to a reader.

And if it happens, please allow Abigail to be home visting at the time so I can Guess who's coming to dinner?!

I hope that final Royal heir of the loomis system could be saved. Once it is known there will be no more league ships coming to their aid, their diminished security forces might not be able to keep the peace. Especially if their economy is broken due to the tramstellar being cut off from the region.

I am wondering if those league naval personnel that notice the movements of the alignment will have greater impact than we know. Their investigations might uncover the blackmail files of the murdered admiral. The records could undermine alignment efforts and assets.

Lots of people say the alignment will make a move on beowolf when the league does. The enhanced missile and sensory system could catch the bad guys in the act.

The bad guys realise maya is going to rebel, so likely encourage rebellion, so to ensure multiple league assets in the region to boost the conflict. The more maya, erewhon and friends are weakened, easier for torch to be taken. They might be part of the alliance, but they don't have the full tech available. So the league overwhelming numbers could finally achieve a victory.

SYED wrote:I hope that final Royal heir of the loomis system could be saved. Once it is known there will be no more league ships coming to their aid, their diminished security forces might not be able to keep the peace. Especially if their economy is broken due to the tramstellar being cut off from the region.

I am wondering if those league naval personnel that notice the movements of the alignment will have greater impact than we know. Their investigations might uncover the blackmail files of the murdered admiral. The records could undermine alignment efforts and assets.

Lots of people say the alignment will make a move on beowolf when the league does. The enhanced missile and sensory system could catch the bad guys in the act.

The bad guys realise maya is going to rebel, so likely encourage rebellion, so to ensure multiple league assets in the region to boost the conflict. The more maya, erewhon and friends are weakened, easier for torch to be taken. They might be part of the alliance, but they don't have the full tech available. So the league overwhelming numbers could finally achieve a victory.

The attack on Torch is something I didn't (and don't) understand. The MAlign's long range plan requires that most of the galaxy forgets genetic slavery so the way is clear for their uplift efforts. At the moment, Torch is in alignment with that goal: they want to see Manpower completely obliterated.

Also, I'm not sure that the attack was an MAlign sponsored event. It was organized and carried out by Manpower. Granted, the MAlign would like to see the wormhole terminus secured, but given that they want to see Manpower obliterated, they've got to have other plans to insure that - like the defenses that RFC has said are being built at The Twins to destroy any other attempts to explore it.

As far as a MAlign component to the hypothesized attack on Beowulf goes, remember that Rufino C. has said that the time for killing people in job lots is over. Benjamin or Colin could overrule him on that, but we don't actually know that the Detweiller clones have survived. RFC neatly left that up in the air. It's within the bounds of possibility that the last of the Detweillers died when Albrecht pushed that button.

The assumption, I think, is that with the planet a billiard ball and the wormhole a ship-eater, everyone will lose interest in the system. In fact, IIRC that point is made on-screen by Alignment characters. In addition to that, this is a society that will take a _very_ long time before it looks other than askance at anything smacking of Detweilerism [whether they think of it that way or not], and quite a while before it stops asking just who's pulling the strings of anyone promoting it. That could prove awkward in the mid to long term.

In any case, the involvement of the Alignment in the operation is proven: at least two of the most senior Mesan liaison officers are identified as Mesan _Alignment_ Navy. That sets aside the question of whether they would have, at this point, allowed Cataphracts into the hands of anyone not under the Alignment's direct control.

JohnRoth wrote:
The attack on Torch is something I didn't (and don't) understand. The MAlign's long range plan requires that most of the galaxy forgets genetic slavery so the way is clear for their uplift efforts. At the moment, Torch is in alignment with that goal: they want to see Manpower completely obliterated.

Also, I'm not sure that the attack was an MAlign sponsored event. It was organized and carried out by Manpower. Granted, the MAlign would like to see the wormhole terminus secured, but given that they want to see Manpower obliterated, they've got to have other plans to insure that - like the defenses that RFC has said are being built at The Twins to destroy any other attempts to explore it.

As far as a MAlign component to the hypothesized attack on Beowulf goes, remember that Rufino C. has said that the time for killing people in job lots is over. Benjamin or Colin could overrule him on that, but we don't actually know that the Detweiller clones have survived. RFC neatly left that up in the air. It's within the bounds of possibility that the last of the Detweillers died when Albrecht pushed that button.

JohnRoth wrote:The attack on Torch is something I didn't (and don't) understand. The MAlign's long range plan requires that most of the galaxy forgets genetic slavery so the way is clear for their uplift efforts. At the moment, Torch is in alignment with that goal: they want to see Manpower completely obliterated.

Think about it like this. The fall of Manpower is full of theatrics, and any connoisseur of theatrics knows that a wounded dragon needs to have one last swing before it dies; in this case, Torch is an obvious targets for ex-Manpower forces to hit in retaliation for whatever happened on Mesa.
This also makes it very clear to everyone that the Mesan forces are disintegrating and can be picked off at will by any government willing to score a few goodwill points.

The attack on Torch by the former PRH SS ships had at least three objectives.

One was to eliminate it as a factor in the assault on Mesa and, at the same time, on the Alignment by taking it's small but dangerous navy off the board. That would include eliminating the pool of "former" Ballroom operatives and their current primary base of logistics

Second was to make it possible for Mesa or some other power- probably a Transtellar or perhaps one of the RF to take over the system. If they smashed it down the ecology, that would still leave the system's other resources. Even if Manpower/Mesa wasn't going to attempt to recover Torch itself as a source of biological material development and export (massive amounts of pharmaceutical material being sold) it would just be the system. Which brings the third reason- and possibly most import"

Keeping anybody outside the Alignment and RF from doing anything more about that really odd wormhole. At least to keep others from observing it being used by the Alignment as an entry point from the hidden wormhole network.

Even if what we were getting in the run-up to the attack pointed to "revenge" as a motive for Manpower over the loss of the planet, it's rich biosphear for explot and the slave revolt- (proving it could be done on a sucessfull, planet wide basis) they wanted (those who knew about it) to further muddy the interest in the wormhole.

cthia wrote:Ok, here is your chance to possibly direct the course of the final book. *giggle*

As a reader, what do you think should be incorporated into the final book, as a minimum. Exactly how far do you think the timeline should be advanced, as a minimum. What characters should be dealt with. This is your chance to vote.

What tech would you like to see introduced, or even think should be introduced. Such as being able to detect the Spider drives.

In the off chance that Mr. Weber may peruse this thread and throw us a few bones and heed his readers, then cast your vote. Who knows, we might get lucky.

I'd like the next book to wrap it up.

I would like to see the attack on Beowulf, a counter-attack on all the SLN fleet bases, the start of the breakup of the League, and Darius located with the book ending with the major battle off Darius with the Manties, the Havenites, the Andermanis, and anyone else throwing against the Detweiler-class Mega-SDs. I expect, as per any Honor hell-ride, to be many ships exploding on both sides and a lot of excitement.

Maybe even the Andermanis (or Beowulf) launching a Eridani-violating kinetic strike against the planet, w/o the RMN or Havenites knowledge.

And no, I don't think taking on Deterweiler-class ships will be easy. Think about WW-I with ASW, and evolve it to the Honorverse.

-- Bob G

I doubt they would risk exploring the torch bridge if they even suspect the other end is in enemy hands. Trying to cross a hostile terminii is a major undertaking. It is more likely they somehow capture an enemy ship that contain coordinates or other navigational data.

There is the ship that was aiding operation Janus near the talbot quadrant. We suspect that caption Abernathy might be hanging around the maya sector, ready for the coming operation. There is also the beowolf situation. The alignment has been nfluencing other major military operations, there must be a presence there as well.

We know that they evacuated as much as they could from Mesa. While it is possible they left something to lead to Darius, they were very thorough with nukes. I wonder if all the ships that left have actually reached their destination.

SYED wrote:I doubt they would risk exploring the torch bridge if they even suspect the other end is in enemy hands. Trying to cross a hostile terminii is a major undertaking. It is more likely they somehow capture an enemy ship that contain coordinates or other navigational data.

There is the ship that was aiding operation Janus near the talbot quadrant. We suspect that caption Abernathy might be hanging around the maya sector, ready for the coming operation. There is also the beowolf situation. The alignment has been nfluencing other major military operations, there must be a presence there as well.

We know that they evacuated as much as they could from Mesa. While it is possible they left something to lead to Darius, they were very thorough with nukes. I wonder if all the ships that left have actually reached their destination.

All very good questions. There is also the investigation on Old Earth being conducted by the Gendarme and others.

As far as the Torch wormhole, though, I suspect that there's stuff to learn by observing it. It's anomalous in a lot of ways. That might be part of why the MAlign is interested in keeping observers away from it.

Dauntless wrote:it is what he had planned originally.

hopefully that has changed. I love her too much to see her die. RFC has killed off so many great characters, I still haven't forgiven him for killing everyone on troubdour's flag bridge, McKeown had been with her so long that i had thought he would dodge the cures.

Honor has had so little peace over the last 2 decades since the peeps tried to take Basilisk, that a quiet retirement, to enjoy what she has spent all those year protecting would be nice.

I feel your pain.

The thing with McKeon is that he walked the difficult gauntlet of internal conflict before he was born the man he was meant to be. Only to have it end so abruptly afterwards. From every reader's standpoint, we were all primed for an interesting relationship between him and Honor. All we can do is wonder 'what if?'


It would also be a crying shame, a federal offense, unpoetic justice and an authorial faux pas if anyone but the Salamander got to teach any of Honor's offspring but Honor. What a shame for the kids if they lost her before they got to know her and inherit her knowledge. To pick her brain clean. Especially since it would be quite difficult to walk in her shoes and live up to the expectations of being Sally Mander II. Or would that be the Salamander Reborn?

Why? Because it would be humanly impossible for anyone in the RMN to abstain from projecting those expectations on a child of Honor's. Especially if she graduates from Sag Isle.

"We expect big things from you honey. Huge."

I wonder who would take Katherine under their wing if Honor was gone on to Valhalla?


Or Raoul, who would be tasked with walking in the shadow of his mother and father?

I constantly wonder, if the series last that long as a spinoff, which one would follow in their mother's footsteps and join the navy? Or both? And if both, who'll more closely mimic the abilities of Honor?

Which is more apt to be a chip off the Old Lady?


...


, then Honor making an appearance much further down the road, as the cavalry, in a system where one of her babies have gotten themselves in a pickle. Yes!

If Joe Buckley can constantly escape the guillotine then so can the Salamander.