US Presidential Candidates

PeterZ wrote:

gcomeau wrote:Yell "Fire" in a crowded theater and then let us know if what you're allowed to say is subject to your government too.

If anyone was hurt, the yeller would be liable. Likely there are also ordinances that would chastise the miscreant severely.

That would be just rephrasing the statement " what you are allowed to say is subject to your government" in different words. What do you think happens in those other countries? Mind control fields that stop them from saying the words in the first place.... or liabilities and penalties after they say them? Just like you just laid out as what happens here in the US.

I have the right to yell fire in a crowded theater. I don't have the right to endanger people or cause through my willful or negligent actions.

Which is exactly what the citizens of those other countries have. They simply have different lists of WHAT will endanger people... and frankly, probably more reasonable lists if preventing the endangering of people is really the goal.

PeterZ wrote:
If anyone was hurt, the yeller would be liable. Likely there are also ordinances that would chastise the miscreant severely.

I have the right to yell fire in a crowded theater. I don't have the right to endanger people or cause through my willful or negligent actions.

I don´t remember the exact legal term for it, but NO YOU DONT. Just about all nations legal systems have laws about that kind of thing.
You may not be convicted of it, because they prefer someone to yell fire incorrectly rather than the opposite.

I prefer my liberty and you prefer your government granted freedoms/privileges.

You just don´t get it do you... The difference you keep ranting about? Doesn´t exist. Your continued inability to perceive a blatant fact is disconcerting.

But perfectly in line with "normal" for USA i guess.

When the leftists define 'hate speech' to mean 'anything they don't agree with', and then use that as an excuse to initiate physical violence, they are hypocrites. They are stealing our freedom in the name of freedom.

See the numerous videos of people being physically attacked just for wearing Trump hats or carrying Trump signs.

See the confirmed cases of instigators sent to violently disrupt Trump events.

See the Soros-paid rent-a-riots in numerous cities under the "black lives matter" banner - which is itself based on a lie.
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A politician's worst nightmare: that somebody, somewhere has got a nickel they haven't taxed.

Don't disagree. I will however contend that being offended is not being put in danger. When the definition of allowable speech is subject to government action, then permissible speech may be limited beyond the need to prevent harm.

A key difference is that individuals in the US have standing and can take the government to court to stop government action that infringes on our First Amendment rights. Abroad the laws have to be changed and that requires far more people.

gcomeau wrote:

PeterZ wrote:
If anyone was hurt, the yeller would be liable. Likely there are also ordinances that would chastise the miscreant severely.

That would be just rephrasing the statement " what you are allowed to say is subject to your government" in different words. What do you think happens in those other countries? Mind control fields that stop them from saying the words in the first place.... or liabilities and penalties after they say them? Just like you just laid out as what happens here in the US.

I have the right to yell fire in a crowded theater. I don't have the right to endanger people or cause through my willful or negligent actions.

Which is exactly what the citizens of those other countries have. They simply have different lists of WHAT will endanger people... and frankly, probably more reasonable lists if preventing the endangering of people is really the goal.

gcomeau wrote:First, yep, read them.

Second, you admit she had detailed policy positions. So debate over, one candidate addressed policy contrary to your claim neither of them did.

You not *liking* those policies doesn't make them not exist.

Uh, you stop right there...
No they are not detailed policy positions. Why?
Hocus pocus is not a policy.

Make-a-wish policy, by both candidates by the way, where gifts fall from heaven like mana(expansion of SS, Medicare without raising the age of access to benefits by 5 years where the population is not expanding 100% every 40 years as it was when the system was setup) further increasing the debts is not policy. They are blatant lies. Blatant; like the horse meat for human consumption is not policy. They are lies.

On top of the fact that the PRESIDENT has zero, zilch, da nada to do with domestic POLICY. None. Congress has that right. Do you even know how the USA government works? Appears not. Yippee, he can veto a bill. Otherwise, nothing.

The ONLY issues you vote for regarding a President are Foreign policy, appointments for judges, and department heads(not that I think they make any difference). And in this respect HRC and those around her proved themselves corrupt.

A stupid pig, I get to kick out of the white house next election. A corrupt pig smears their crap all over the place infecting, breeding more corruption.

2 worst candidates in my lifetime. I can't wait to vote his piggy ass out in 4 years.

Tenshinai wrote:You just don´t get it do you... The difference you keep ranting about? Doesn´t exist. Your continued inability to perceive a blatant fact is disconcerting.

But perfectly in line with "normal" for USA i guess.

No, Tenshai, you do not "get it".

Physical harm does NOT EQUAL emotional offense.

"Sticks and stones may break my bones, but words do not hurt me." Even most 8 year old children know different. Yet we have adults saying otherwise... Even those on this forum...

Let me guess you ran whining to the school yard teacher at recess when you got called a name that hurt your feelings... That is how pathetic immature snowflake children act who think the world revolves around them. Adults, and decent children who were reared right, tell the slandering jack ass to take their BULL crap and shove it back where the sun don't shine. As it just makes the slanderer in question, look like a pile of dogcrap a car drove over and yes, please do enjoy their dog poop smeared life. That is what responsible people tell them.

Totally wrong, and immaturely insulting in the way it was phrased.
Ask any front line welfare worker and they will tell you tale after tale of people self harming, taking up drugs, and all such things up to and often including suicide, because of verbal and on line abuse.
All very well for we "been there done that" adults to tell people to take a spoonful of cement and harden up. When people are ostracised because of their race, sexual orientation, nationality, religion or even their weight they often get depressed and do crazy things. Being reared right doesn't always help, and so what? Do kids who didn't have good parenting deserve to suffer?

A side comment for PeterZ. We have inherent free speech just as those in the US do, there is no suggestion that our government tells us what is permitted to say. Clause 18C of one act does limit hate speech in a very defined way, and can be challenged in court. If anything that proves that we have total freedom, as otherwise would they have to even consider this minor restriction?
Years ago at the time of the last Iraqi war, I was in London talking to a friend there about how you could Google friends and such. To illustrate I Googled my name. Much to my surprise up came a front page article on our national newspaper, along with a graphic cartoon. This illustrated my letter to the editor declaring that our then PM was a Bush suppository. If you can get away with publically declaring that your beloved leader is up another country's leader's anus, I suggest you have free speech.

Relax wrote:

Tenshinai wrote:You just don´t get it do you... The difference you keep ranting about? Doesn´t exist. Your continued inability to perceive a blatant fact is disconcerting.

But perfectly in line with "normal" for USA i guess.

No, Tenshai, you do not "get it".

Physical harm does NOT EQUAL emotional offense.

"Sticks and stones may break my bones, but words do not hurt me." Even most 8 year old children know different. Yet we have adults saying otherwise... Even those on this forum...

Let me guess you ran whining to the school yard teacher at recess when you got called a name that hurt your feelings... That is how pathetic immature snowflake children act who think the world revolves around them. Adults, and decent children who were reared right, tell the slandering jack ass to take their BULL crap and shove it back where the sun don't shine. As it just makes the slanderer in question, look like a pile of dogcrap a car drove over and yes, please do enjoy their dog poop smeared life. That is what responsible people tell them.

here

Seems like Australia is as hypocritical as the US after all. Hate speech protection only goes one way.

Daryl wrote:Totally wrong, and immaturely insulting in the way it was phrased.
Ask any front line welfare worker and they will tell you tale after tale of people self harming, taking up drugs, and all such things up to and often including suicide, because of verbal and on line abuse.

You cannot be held responsible for someone ELSE's moronic actions.

Grow up precious snowflake. The world is not "fair". Telling children that the world is supposed to be fair and if they personally do not see it as fair, then they get to call the cops, does not help them any. Just helps them hide from reality. Grow up precious snowflake.

You do not oppress everyone for a select few snowflakes. That is fascism.

Relax wrote:No, Tenshai, you do not "get it".

Physical harm does NOT EQUAL emotional offense.

"Sticks and stones may break my bones, but words do not hurt me." Even most 8 year old children know different. Yet we have adults saying otherwise... Even those on this forum...

Let me guess you ran whining to the school yard teacher at recess when you got called a name that hurt your feelings... That is how pathetic immature snowflake children act who think the world revolves around them. Adults, and decent children who were reared right, tell the slandering jack ass to take their BULL crap and shove it back where the sun don't shine. As it just makes the slanderer in question, look like a pile of dogcrap a car drove over and yes, please do enjoy their dog poop smeared life. That is what responsible people tell them.

So take your BULL crap and shove it where the sun don't shine.


And you still can´t even spell my netname, seriously, you blind as well as stupid?