SPOILER- Thank you so very much RFC for AtSoT!-SPOILER

pbreed wrote:Realize that we the reader now have information (that there are videos in the temple) that the inner circle do not. Clinton did not communicate that he had seen Langhorn before....

But he DID see the footage before. One assumes that there are high tech centers within the Temple that can display what Clyntahn has see to others with access. Everyone that has policy making ability for the Inquisition will be from outside the Inquisition. They will likely be curious of such holy relics as that footage. Certainly Duchairn will be curious and I suspect the Inquisition Board will research deeply to familiarize themselves with their charge so that they will run into the footage collection.

That footage will get out if RFC plans to use it in the story.

I'd like to point out that we DON'T KNOW that the Inquisition's secret files include electronic media. All we know is that it contains imagery of the "Archangels" and their meeting room.

That imagery could easily have been preserved as still photographs in books. After all, the master copy of the Writ is printed on "indestructible paper".

On the flip side, we KNOW that certain offices in the Temple have wall monitors showing screen savers. But I seriously doubt any of the "angels" gave direct access of any kind of electronic files to any "mortals" when printed books would work just as well.

evilauthor wrote:I'd like to point out that we DON'T KNOW that the Inquisition's secret files include electronic media. All we know is that it contains imagery of the "Archangels" and their meeting room.

That imagery could easily have been preserved as still photographs in books. After all, the master copy of the Writ is printed on "indestructible paper".

On the flip side, we KNOW that certain offices in the Temple have wall monitors showing screen savers. But I seriously doubt any of the "angels" gave direct access of any kind of electronic files to any "mortals" when printed books would work just as well.

To reiterate

We ABSOLUTELY know they are electronic media of some sort (maybe like Paityr's Key) since Clyntahn thinks

"He'd seen images like it in the Temple, in the Inquisitions secret records..."

and "the Angel Langhorne said, and it was the Archangels's voice. He knew it was, because unlike Shan-Wei's, he'd heard it before."

And it doesn't have to be of the meeting room, in fact it obviously wasn't, since Clyntahn didn't know Shan-Wei's voice. At least one "file" was of Langhorne speaking, probably like some one said previously, giving a "pep" talk like Schueler did to the Wsylyn's.

Ayup

dobriennm wrote:

evilauthor wrote:I'd like to point out that we DON'T KNOW that the Inquisition's secret files include electronic media. All we know is that it contains imagery of the "Archangels" and their meeting room.

That imagery could easily have been preserved as still photographs in books. After all, the master copy of the Writ is printed on "indestructible paper".

On the flip side, we KNOW that certain offices in the Temple have wall monitors showing screen savers. But I seriously doubt any of the "angels" gave direct access of any kind of electronic files to any "mortals" when printed books would work just as well.

To reiterate

We ABSOLUTELY know they are electronic media of some sort (maybe like Paityr's Key) since Clyntahn thinks

"He'd seen images like it in the Temple, in the Inquisitions secret records..."

and "the Angel Langhorne said, and it was the Archangels's voice. He knew it was, because unlike Shan-Wei's, he'd heard it before."

And it doesn't have to be of the meeting room, in fact it obviously wasn't, since Clyntahn didn't know Shan-Wei's voice. At least one "file" was of Langhorne speaking, probably like some one said previously, giving a "pep" talk like Schueler did to the Wsylyn's.

PeterZ wrote:

pbreed wrote:Realize that we the reader now have information (that there are videos in the temple) that the inner circle do not. Clinton did not communicate that he had seen Langhorn before....

But he DID see the footage before. One assumes that there are high tech centers within the Temple that can display what Clyntahn has see to others with access. Everyone that has policy making ability for the Inquisition will be from outside the Inquisition. They will likely be curious of such holy relics as that footage. Certainly Duchairn will be curious and I suspect the Inquisition Board will research deeply to familiarize themselves with their charge so that they will run into the footage collection.

That footage will get out if RFC plans to use it in the story.

True, Clyntahn did see the footage before, but since these are secret Inquisition files and there has been a serious loss of senior Inquisition personnel (death = loss), it's possible that any of the new Inquisition leaders will not have the necessary access(logins, passwords, or whatever is required) plus not know where exactly to go to access them. The new management may not even know of their existence.

The only way to keep something secret is to restrict access, so it probably can't be displayed anywhere and needs a secret, restricted protocol to access them in a select, probably one location.

And we already have a hint that the Inquisition has lost some of it's access to the technology in the Temple. Duchairn mused at one point about the rumors/legends? that the Inquisition could hear everything in the Temple, but he thought that obviously wasn't true because there would have been more vicars taken to the Punishment. And obviously some of the things Duchairn and Maigwair said in private weren't overheard by Clyntahn's or his minions.

So it's likely that access to the secret files was controlled/restricted and the loss of senior Inquisition personnel may mean loss of access to those files. Or if someone has access to them in the future, it's liable to be a secret organization within the New Kinder/Gentler Inquisition dedicated to the restoration of the Oder Meaner Inquisition.

And as someone else pointed out, the files are probably Langhorne (or someone) giving directions/pep talk for leaders in the Inquisition.

Okay, I stand corrected on the video part.

But as for the "meeting room", I was talking about the room where Shan-Wei was talking to the rest of Langhorne's council. I don't know what that room is called, so "meeting room" seems like the best fit.

evilauthor wrote:.... the Inquisition's secret files include electronic media. All we know is that it contains imagery of the "Archangels" and their meeting room.

evilauthor wrote:Okay, I stand corrected on the video part.

But as for the "meeting room", I was talking about the room where Shan-Wei was talking to the rest of Langhorne's council. I don't know what that room is called, so "meeting room" seems like the best fit.

I'm not necessarily sure that the Inquisition's imagery includes the room. After all, Clyntahn didn't mentally say he recognized the room, he recognized many of the faces of the Archangels as well as the voice of Langhorne. He also recognized these kind of images. The room mentioned in ATSoF is from Merlin and Nimue's "file footage" which probably came from stuff Kau-yung left with Owl in Nimue's Cave.

These files are probably part of the "certain ... institutional and physical checks to maintain that mindset"[anti-technology mindset] that Bedard was referencing in her spiel to Shan-Wei.

Somehow, when I imagine Archangels, I don't see them having a business meeting around a table discussing the latest crop figures or that the latrines are backed up in the east wing. That's not very inspirational or divine, seeing them act like, well, ordinary human beings.

The images Clyntahn probably saw were , as others said, pep talks from Langhorne, at least. I suspect there were others, maybe with a more detailed explanation of forbidden technology or things to watch out for. It doesn't sound like they included instructions to bring back the Archangels or fire the Rakurii, since Clyntahn only talked about the Archangels saving the Church, not anything about summoning them directly.

And getting back to why I brought up the entire topic, I'm really just lamenting the missed opportunity on the part of the Inner Circle to learn a little more about what's under the Temple. While satisfying (revenge wise) to see Clyntahn broken before his death, I care about these fictional characters enough that I would like to see them have some potentially vital information. In particular, I worry about a "fifth column" within the New Inquisition which does know about these files and can use the information in them later.

Howdy Dobriennm,

Kudos for making some excellent points, particularly the last one, which might be something our very talented story teller might just do.

Personally I think Nynian and Merlin would have insisted on securing the inquisition's records and publishing them to corroborate the circle's evidence, to refute claims that Clyntahn was scapegoated which Duchairn will also favor, nor would the the temple's miraculous fire suppression system permit attempts to start fires in the temple, and though there might be holy incinerators, I don't think those few left in the temple, since all of Duchairn and Magwair's supporters had already left, could spare much time or effort to destroy those records when they were to few to stop the mob from entering the temple.

then given how deep the tunnel may be and how late it may have been built it may be far enough below the temple's sensors to enable some probes to enter the temple to check things out.

If I were Nahrmahn and OWL, as I've suggested before, I might design new probes with obsolete technology that federation sensors wouldn't consider a threat, and test them on another deserted island, although simulating them in VR would speed the process up.

Suppose late 21st century tech might be considered too old to threaten the temple, yet reorganized to take advantages of federation tech blind spots be able to crawl or worm their way close enough to sneak into various places like the tunnel, exhaust vents, or under the plaza of martyrs, etc even if it takes a 5day, to fill in what's in the basements.

Since Duchairn has ruled the CoC and CoS aren't heretical, their pilgrims ought to be able to visit the temple, which might include Cayleb and Sharleyan, possibly soon after Clyntahn's execution.

Then what to do about the MHoGatA, 2 million trained soldiers who can't go home [yet].

Duchairn is going to need an army, Siddarmark might let them homestead some of the abandoned western lands, while South Harchong might also need an army, the bidding war ought to raise their morale just for starters.

Financially, with the war over, Duchairn will probably devalue the temple mark and with contact restored to Howard etc, be able to start paying off the CoGA's debt's with perhaps 20 year bonds while also trying to pay for the SoS and AoG's damage to the republic, thanks to ~20% [reducing the tithe to the Holy Writ's is probably one of Duchairn's many priorities] of the earnings of almost 800 million people, figuring a quarter earning at least a mark a day for $60 Billion, the CoGA getting ~$12B without having to support a vast war.

No time now for more right now, but the next 20 years will be very interesting times indeed.

L

dobriennm wrote:

evilauthor wrote:.... the Inquisition's secret files include electronic media. All we know is that it contains imagery of the "Archangels" and their meeting room.

evilauthor wrote:Okay, I stand corrected on the video part.

But as for the "meeting room", I was talking about the room where Shan-Wei was talking to the rest of Langhorne's council. I don't know what that room is called, so "meeting room" seems like the best fit.

I'm not necessarily sure that the Inquisition's imagery includes the room. After all, Clyntahn didn't mentally say he recognized the room, he recognized many of the faces of the Archangels as well as the voice of Langhorne. He also recognized these kind of images. The room mentioned in ATSoF is from Merlin and Nimue's "file footage" which probably came from stuff Kau-yung left with Owl in Nimue's Cave.

These files are probably part of the "certain ... institutional and physical checks to maintain that mindset"[anti-technology mindset] that Bedard was referencing in her spiel to Shan-Wei.

Somehow, when I imagine Archangels, I don't see them having a business meeting around a table discussing the latest crop figures or that the latrines are backed up in the east wing. That's not very inspirational or divine, seeing them act like, well, ordinary human beings.

The images Clyntahn probably saw were , as others said, pep talks from Langhorne, at least. I suspect there were others, maybe with a more detailed explanation of forbidden technology or things to watch out for. It doesn't sound like they included instructions to bring back the Archangels or fire the Rakurii, since Clyntahn only talked about the Archangels saving the Church, not anything about summoning them directly.

And getting back to why I brought up the entire topic, I'm really just lamenting the missed opportunity on the part of the Inner Circle to learn a little more about what's under the Temple. While satisfying (revenge wise) to see Clyntahn broken before his death, I care about these fictional characters enough that I would like to see them have some potentially vital information. In particular, I worry about a "fifth column" within the New Inquisition which does know about these files and can use the information in them later.

dobriennm wrote:I'm not necessarily sure that the Inquisition's imagery includes the room. After all, Clyntahn didn't mentally say he recognized the room,

Uh, I'm pretty sure Clyntahn DID mentally say that he recognized the room.

Ah, here we go. Page 733 in the Kindle Fire version.

the image of a breezy room appeared before him, no more than two feet tall, but perfectly detailed. He'd seen images like it in the Temple, in the Inquisition's secret records, and he heard someone whimpering with his voice as he recognized many of the faces in that room.

You'll note that the way the text is laid out, he recognized THE ROOM first and then the faces. It's clearly the room as there's a definite change in subject matter when his attention goes from room to people in the room.

Lyonheart,

I think you are right. Green Tree Island will become a haven for escaped slaves as South Harchong grows more liberal and the MH conquers Desnair. I don't think Stonahr will want the MH anywhere on Haven. Can't say that Thirsk or Ahlvarez would like that any more than Stonahr. The most likely location is down south. So many birds may be hit with that large stone.

That argues Green Tree Island will continue to receive immigrants from South Harchong but not diplomatic recognition. That and the need for coaling stations suggests that the EoC will indeed extend its protection. What form that protection takes will be interesting to see.

Now, what other geopolitical themes will develop in the next two decades?

The floor is open....