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Question about Dempsey's

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Re: Question about Dempsey's
Post by Weird Harold   » Mon Sep 26, 2016 8:41 am

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Somtaaw wrote:Well also mentioned in Field of Dishonor was that Captain McKeon picked up the "cover charge" to visit Honor prior to her leaving to be invested as Steadholder Harrington.


That was at Cosmo's, not Dempsey's:

Field of Dishonor
Chapter Four wrote:
Soft music from real, live musicians drifted through the dim, intimately lit restaurant on the delicious smells of a hundred worlds' cuisine. Cosmo's, the most exclusive night spot in the city of Landing, boasted that no one had ever ordered a dish its kitchen couldn't supply. That was no small claim, given the stupendous volume of shipping (and the passengers who went with it) which passed through the central terminus of the Manticore Wormhole Junction, but Honor could believe it.

She'd been to Cosmo's exactly once before, when her mother had settled for that after Honor refused the Academy graduation gift she'd initially had in mind. Honor had been too goggle-eyed with curiosity to pay much attention to the food then; this time around she was not only older but here in the role of hostess, and she'd discovered that the chefs' handiwork was even better than Cosmo's owners claimed.
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Answers! I got lots of answers!

(Now if I could just find the right questions.)
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Re: Question about Dempsey's
Post by Somtaaw   » Mon Sep 26, 2016 8:48 am

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Foraker oops here. Could have sworn they'd run into her at Dempseys.
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Re: Question about Dempsey's
Post by Theemile   » Mon Sep 26, 2016 11:33 am

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Weird Harold wrote:
Somtaaw wrote:Well also mentioned in Field of Dishonor was that Captain McKeon picked up the "cover charge" to visit Honor prior to her leaving to be invested as Steadholder Harrington.


That was at Cosmo's, not Dempsey's:

Field of Dishonor
Chapter Four wrote:
Soft music from real, live musicians drifted through the dim, intimately lit restaurant on the delicious smells of a hundred worlds' cuisine. Cosmo's, the most exclusive night spot in the city of Landing, boasted that no one had ever ordered a dish its kitchen couldn't supply. That was no small claim, given the stupendous volume of shipping (and the passengers who went with it) which passed through the central terminus of the Manticore Wormhole Junction, but Honor could believe it.

She'd been to Cosmo's exactly once before, when her mother had settled for that after Honor refused the Academy graduation gift she'd initially had in mind. Honor had been too goggle-eyed with curiosity to pay much attention to the food then; this time around she was not only older but here in the role of hostess, and she'd discovered that the chefs' handiwork was even better than Cosmo's owners claimed.


And Specifically, as mentioned above, Cosmos was in Landing, not one of the 3 big stations.

When Tankersley meets Somersville - Dempsey's
When Honor meets Somersville - Dempsey's
When Honor's former crew talk about dealing with Somersville - Dempsey's
When LAC crews are spinning up in secret - Dempsey's is where they play cards.
Even in the latest book, we are told about two different groups who died during the Yawata Strike - and both were dining at ... Dempsey's
******
RFC said "refitting a Beowulfan SD to Manticoran standards would be just as difficult as refitting a standard SLN SD to those standards. In other words, it would be cheaper and faster to build new ships."
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Re: Question about Dempsey's
Post by saber964   » Mon Sep 26, 2016 3:07 pm

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The shootout in FoR was later in the book and took place at an Italian restaurant named Regianos. There have been other references to Dempsey's in several books IIRC one of Helen's friends was going to Dempsey's with his parents. Also IIRC in the scene were Ramirez and Hibson were discussing Summervale, they were doing it with Gunny Babcock. IMO Dempsey's is a high-end restaurant but not exclusively so. It's probably like the difference between Mickey Dees and Red Robin. FYI Red Robin is a gourmet burger restaurant meals start at about USD 12-15 and go from there.
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Re: Question about Dempsey's
Post by Browne   » Mon Sep 26, 2016 7:19 pm

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I have pictured Dempsey's as a Chili's or Applebee's type of place.
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Re: Question about Dempsey's
Post by Fox2!   » Tue Sep 27, 2016 12:23 am

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Theemile wrote:
Fox2! wrote:
Blackbird appears to have had a Dempsey's. And other places such as Birdies'. Which was probably as much of a restaurant as Hooters.


Which brings another question. Do you really see Grayson's main shipyard and Fleetbase having an establishment like Birdies? Anyplace else, sure... but Grayson?


Someplace in Obligated Service, or the other story with the same characters, there is a more acceptable "name" for the establishment, and only those "in the know" refer to it as Birdies'. It may be one of those places with respectable dining in the front, beer, poker and strippers in the back.
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Re: Question about Dempsey's
Post by Fox2!   » Tue Sep 27, 2016 12:35 am

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Fox2! wrote:
Theemile wrote:
Which brings another question. Do you really see Grayson's main shipyard and Fleetbase having an establishment like Birdies? Anyplace else, sure... but Grayson?


Someplace in Obligated Service, or the other story with the same characters, there is a more acceptable "name" for the establishment, and only those "in the know" refer to it as Birdies'. It may be one of those places with "respectable" dining in the front, beer, poker and strippers in the back.


From Obligated Service:

“Nonsense.” The dowager lady steadholder held up a hand. “Those two young women have passed on. It isn't right to sully the names of the dead.” She pinched her lips and gave lie to the fine words. “Any way, the last formal documents we have in their names call them artisans. It would be near impossible now to find evidence that they did or did not engage in the work willingly or of their own accord without their head-of-household's approval. The authorization to work outside the home, which I had checked, quite clearly states that they have positions as wait staff at an entirely different venue, The Gym, I believe.”
The second wife's crimson blush revealed that she somehow knew different. Claire wondered who had told her.
Claire shook her head, “It's the same venue, Madam Steadholder. It's much like bars called The Library situated outside colleges. The Blackbird Gymnasium. The customers call it Birdies among themselves and ‘The Gym' to their wives, I understand.
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Re: Question about Dempsey's
Post by WeirdlyWired   » Tue Sep 27, 2016 5:30 am

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Fox2! wrote:
Someplace in Obligated Service, or the other story with the same characters, there is a more acceptable "name" for the establishment, and only those "in the know" refer to it as Birdies'. It may be one of those places with respectable dining in the front, beer, poker and strippers in the back.



I pictured "Birdies" as kind of like Robin Hood's Pub and Restaurant if it is still in Hamilton Bermuda. Pub on the right, rather nice Italian restaurant on the left and a disco upstairs.

Here (PNW) we have the obligatory Denny's Shari's and Cracker Barrel, but Elmer's a cut above. But it wouldn't rise to The Tender Sirloin. which NO has Ruth's Chris' Steakhouse.
Helas,chou, Je m'en fache.
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Re: Question about Dempsey's
Post by cthia   » Tue Sep 27, 2016 7:15 am

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I've always envisioned the biggest difference between Cosmos and Dempseys to be the snub factor. The Cosmos Club in the Honorverse being a direct descendant of the Cosmos Club here on Earth. I have an Aunt and husband, and a sister who are members. I always wondered if RFC got his inspiration from the real life Cosmos.

http://www.cosmosclub.org/




There's another restaurant to be considered in the Honorverse, Regianos.

Dempsey's Bar was a restaurant chain owned by the Dempsey Cartel with restaurants throughout the Star Kingdom of Manticore. It was known for its service and the lengths it went to make its clientele comfortable. It was ranked alongside Cosmo's and Regiano's.

Regiano's was a restaurant in Brancusi Tower in Landing City on the planet Manticore.
It ranked somewhere between Dempsey's Bar and Cosmo's.

A group of killers suspected of being hired by Lord Pavel Young, Earl of North Hollow, attempted to kill Honor Harrington while she was eating there in 1905 PD. (HH4)

Son, your mother says I have to hang you. Personally I don't think this is a capital offense. But if I don't hang you, she's gonna hang me and frankly, I'm not the one in trouble. —cthia's father. Incident in ? Axiom of Common Sense
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Re: Question about Dempsey's
Post by Theemile   » Tue Sep 27, 2016 5:21 pm

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Fox2! wrote:
Theemile wrote:
Which brings another question. Do you really see Grayson's main shipyard and Fleetbase having an establishment like Birdies? Anyplace else, sure... but Grayson?


Someplace in Obligated Service, or the other story with the same characters, there is a more acceptable "name" for the establishment, and only those "in the know" refer to it as Birdies'. It may be one of those places with "respectable" dining in the front, beer, poker and strippers in the back.

From Obligated Service:

“Nonsense.” The dowager lady steadholder held up a hand. “Those two young women have passed on. It isn't right to sully the names of the dead.” She pinched her lips and gave lie to the fine words. “Any way, the last formal documents we have in their names call them artisans. It would be near impossible now to find evidence that they did or did not engage in the work willingly or of their own accord without their head-of-household's approval. The authorization to work outside the home, which I had checked, quite clearly states that they have positions as wait staff at an entirely different venue, The Gym, I believe.”
The second wife's crimson blush revealed that she somehow knew different. Claire wondered who had told her.
Claire shook her head, “It's the same venue, Madam Steadholder. It's much like bars called The Library situated outside colleges. The Blackbird Gymnasium. The customers call it Birdies among themselves and ‘The Gym' to their wives, I understand.


Yeah, I get it, but we're talking about Grayson, a planet with a navy who has chaplains as part of the command structure, and an "ingrained" sense of propriety towards women. It's existence at Grayson's primary shipyard just seems incongruous and implausible, irrespective of the subterfuge concealing it's existence.
******
RFC said "refitting a Beowulfan SD to Manticoran standards would be just as difficult as refitting a standard SLN SD to those standards. In other words, it would be cheaper and faster to build new ships."
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