Tech they ought to have.

kzt wrote:

Jonathan_S wrote:10) Haven't seen any combat robots/drones - though that might be an Army thing; like grav tanks. (I'm not thinking humanoid, but armed recon drones, mobile gun emplacements you can order out to your flanks, or even mechano-donkeys)

There was one, I think, used when they hit the space station to free the people the idiot governor had locked up. But I think it pretty much just blew itself up.

Yup, you're right, and it gavce a good description of other robots used.

Shadow of Freedom, Ch 16 wrote:He really would have preferred a Bravo Charlie—one of the Royal Manticoran Marine Corps’ armored, counter-grav-equipped, robotic breaching charges. Of course, that would have constituted a pretty severe case of overkill against a mere civilian-grade blast door. And even though MacFarlane’s DNI-1 damage control remote hadn’t been designed for the task, it had attached its beehive shaped charge with neatness and precision under cover of the flashbangs and smoke grenades. It didn’t have the armored protection of a Bravo Charlie, but it was designed to operate in an environment which would very quickly have incinerated or demolished a standard robotic unit.

I think they also used it slightly later, which means it survived applying the bee-hive charge they used on this particular occasion. Although the description remote, would suggest that most of them are still programmed/operated much like the Predator drones.

Somtaaw wrote:

kzt wrote:There was one, I think, used when they hit the space station to free the people the idiot governor had locked up. But I think it pretty much just blew itself up.

Yup, you're right, and it gavce a good description of other robots used.

Shadow of Freedom, Ch 16 wrote:He really would have preferred a Bravo Charlie—one of the Royal Manticoran Marine Corps’ armored, counter-grav-equipped, robotic breaching charges. Of course, that would have constituted a pretty severe case of overkill against a mere civilian-grade blast door. And even though MacFarlane’s DNI-1 damage control remote hadn’t been designed for the task, it had attached its beehive shaped charge with neatness and precision under cover of the flashbangs and smoke grenades. It didn’t have the armored protection of a Bravo Charlie, but it was designed to operate in an environment which would very quickly have incinerated or demolished a standard robotic unit.

I think they also used it slightly later, which means it survived applying the bee-hive charge they used on this particular occasion. Although the description remote, would suggest that most of them are still programmed/operated much like the Predator drones.

Clearly I'd forgotten about that - thanks for the correction kzt and Somtaaw.

you also seem to be interpreting 'grav ski' awefully narrowly. not to mention completely missing mentions of other 'missing' items like translator systems and voice-controlled comm switching.

Jonathan_S wrote:Clearly I'd forgotten about that - thanks for the correction kzt and Somtaaw.

Jonathan_S wrote:

GabrialSagan wrote:Disclaimer: I recognize that RFC set out with certain intentions with the Honorverse novels and certain technologies would get in the way of the story he is trying to tell. But with that being said...

I have always found it interesting that for all the amazing wonders of technology in the Honorverse that there are still certain pieces of technology that humanity does not have 2000 years in the future. Mind-Machine interfaces and cybernetic computer implants are completely absent. The ability to copy a human mind into a synthetic substrate and immerse a human consciousness into a virtual landscape completely eludes humans even after mastering counter-gravity and FTL travel. Never is there any mention of android servants or anti-matter being used as either a weapon or an energy source.

Again I am not criticizing as I imagine many of these technologies would make it difficult for Mr. Weber to tell the story he wants to tell. But it does make one wonder. What tech would you think humanity would have 2000 years from now that seems to be absent from Manticore, Old Terra, and the other worlds humanity has settled?

Jumping back to this original idea, some common Sci-Fi concepts that the Honorverse is missing (some of which have already been mentioned) - some of these absences are more noticeable than others. (And none of them detract from my enjoyment of the series)

1) Anything about brain machine interface (I'm thinking not so much of the download your brain use you mentioned, but neural linkage for sensor input or command output (bypassing the relatively slow human optical system and muscle response system)

2) Routine bionic upgrades. Yes we get things like Honor's replacement arm, and cybernetic eye. And we're told there are some cultures that go more heavily into optional cybernetic upgrades. But you don't have people routinely getting bone strength reenforcements, or musculature upgrade.

From what I understand when you read between the lines is that most people find it a bit unnatural to voluntarily exchange body parts with cybernetic ditto unless there is a medical need.

Jonathan_S wrote:3) No combat drugs to improve reaction times, etc.

Well, RFC has mostly written about naval combat. There is very little in the novels about ground battles and what possible "combat drugs" they would use.

Jonathan_S wrote:4) Nanotech - they have some very limited stuff for medical, and some 'vat' style nanotech for growing warship armor. But they don't appear to have routine nanoscale manufacturing for complex items. A ship's workshops don't seem to be able to nano-grow arbitrary spare part from raw elements -- ships still need to carry specific spares (see the atmospheric handler thing that was being flow over to Prince Adrian, on the pinnace Honor caught a ride on, just before her capture..

5) Expert systems verging on AI, or true AI. As others noted, very powerful computers, but not so bright.

There is a lot going on behind the scenes regarding this, see Pearls of Weber - Artificial Intelligence and Nanotechnology.

Jonathan_S wrote:5a) No voice commanded computers - not even the equivilent of Siri or Alexa for entertainment.

Oh, it's there - but like other things it's in the background, there is no need for it to be in your face when reading the novels. On a practical note, using voice commands for instructing computers in a combat situation is a tad cumbersome and a recipe for disaster.

Jonathan_S wrote:5b) No computer translator (yeah, a 'universal translator' that works for even unknown languages would be asking a bit much, but they don't even appear to have Google Translate 4.0; now with voice recognition and translation)

Translator tech exists in Honorverse that translates on the go. A practical example of this is actually used and talked about in SoV.

Jonathan_S wrote:6) No tachyon or FTL active sensors. Just the grav wall ripple passive sensors.

Tachyons are hypothetical particles that travels FTL and if they where proven and practical to use in Honorverse there would be no need for the current available gravitic FTL communication used.

Jonathan_S wrote:7) Nobody seems to have taken the obvious step of making a countergrav hoverboard for kids to play on

Not what we have seen so far..

Jonathan_S wrote:8) No laser pistols - a plasma carbine (which is IIRC heavier than a battle rifle) is the smallest energy weapon I can recall.

Probably because it's impractical when a flechette gun is so much more efficient.

Jonathan_S wrote:9) Can't remember them mentioning vat grown food (esp vat grown protein; something we're on the verge of today - if not yet economically)

We are already have vat grown foods today, one of them is called Quorn.

Relax wrote:

cthia wrote:
It is this paradigm that allowed Ralph "Guns" Cordones, IIRC, to detect an opening in the Peeps ECM defenses and get that nuke in on 'em. He didn't have time to pass it by the Old Lady first, remember?

Which is complete BS if you think about it from an engineering perspective and not Science fiction drivel.

Fighters, Helo's today do not have ECM. They have jamming and only jamming. Why? Because they reside in the real world. Sure, they call these systems big fancy names, but in reality it is one thing only: jamming.

I don't see it that way at all. In "looking at it through engineering eyes" it makes perfect sense and one can see clearly. (And yes, jamming is ECM. *scratching head*)

At any rate, I see Honorverse technology as reminiscent of any and all evolving technologies, e.g., such as here on Earth in the telephone industry. As the technology grew, so did the offerings and spin-off tech. First we had the call blocker, then the blocker unblocker. Then caller id. Then the caller id blocker, then the caller id blocker unblocker. On and on, which made my head spin.

So is the fate destined of ECM. As ECM evolves, defeats are developed. Then defeats of the defeats. Such is tech. In fact, it is already a reality. Look at the various forms of "jamming."

Necessity is the mother of invention.

Grav board.


Actually King Roger was killed grav skiing, pretty much the same thing, but designed for hills instead of an urban environment. It could be that the tech exists, just out of fashion in Manticore - for this reason.

The technology is used for things like floating lockers for middies (SoS). So it could even exist on Manticore, but we just don't have enough 12 year old pov characters to have seen it in action.

I have to say this went in a lot of directions I had not expected. In hindsight I should have asked people to discuss non-military tech, though Honorverse is a military sci-fi, the background is as important as anything else. Here is one I thought of, why is Emily Alexander not a cyborg? Sure she cannot regen, but neither can Honor and that does not stop her from having an awesome robot arm and eye that give her super strength and vision respectively, not to mention the pulser with a 30 round mag fit into her arm. Why could Emily Alexander not opt to get a much more extensive bionic chassis for herself?

GabrialSagan wrote:I have to say this went in a lot of directions I had not expected. In hindsight I should have asked people to discuss non-military tech, though Honorverse is a military sci-fi, the background is as important as anything else. Here is one I thought of, why is Emily Alexander not a cyborg? Sure she cannot regen, but neither can Honor and that does not stop her from having an awesome robot arm and eye that give her super strength and vision respectively, not to mention the pulser with a 30 round mag fit into her arm. Why could Emily Alexander not opt to get a much more extensive bionic chassis for herself?

Depending on the extent of the damage to her body she may not be able to survive the surgeries that your suggestion would require. Or a simpler reason is that she made the choice not to go that root.

She suffered neurologic damage in the accident. Simply out it wouldn't do any good to replace body parts with machines, she still wouldn't be able to control them.

Astelon wrote:She suffered neurologic damage in the accident. Simply out it wouldn't do any good to replace body parts with machines, she still wouldn't be able to control them.

Not exactly. She has limited control of movement. But some control. So theoretically she could learn to control machines — accepting capable software as a given. I could tackle that beast myself. She could discipline herself much as Honor had to do.

The limitation comes from, well fully absorb this...

Her accident had crippled her physically; the surgeons had managed to salvage enough of her motor control to give her almost full use of one hand and arm (the right) and almost normal speech, although the regulation of her involuntary muscles depended entirely upon her life support chair.

—Wiki quote, my bold.

She is completely and utterly dependent on that chair for life support. It keeps her heart beating. They are forever tethered together in a symbiotic relationship. To expect that that level of life support can be developed for every device/mechanism so that Emily could uninvasively interface with it, is expecting too much. Oh, I suspect the tech level in the Honorverse could scratch that itch. But I don't think Emily would find it... "tolerable." Just a tad bit too impersonal. A tad.