Saram Bay

I took another look at the new maps, including the detailed one for Saram Bay. Then I looked at the larger, older, interactive maps of Safehold, including in particular the Gulf of Dohlar. Finally, I looked at the new Temple Lands map.

Here's what I find interesting:

1. It's pretty clear Saram Bay will play a significant role in ATST;
2. In terms of interdicting shipping between South Harchong and the main Harchong Empire, it makes some sense;
3. However, at least from looking at the old Safehold map and the new Saram Bay map, Saram Bay is not a port at the terminus of any significant roadway or waterway to Harchong, and certainly not for any such road or waterway to the Temple Lands or to points east;
4. Fairstock would (from the old Safehold map) seem to be a more likely target for the CE, given its better road and water access to the Temple Lands. Frankly, a couple of previously unnamed inlets slightly east of Hayzor(now Malantor and the Bay of Erech in the new Temple Lands map) would seem even better situated to be likely locations for thriving seaports, and thus perhaps more likely targets for the CE.;
5. The new Temple Lands map, though, indicates Saram may well be a great port for the export of goods from North Harchong, for shipment on the Gulf of Dohlar.

So, the question is, why Saram Bay, and not Malantor? Only the Shadow knows (that is, if the Shadow is RFC).

XofDallas wrote:I took another look at the new maps, including the detailed one for Saram Bay. Then I looked at the larger, older, interactive maps of Safehold, including in particular the Gulf of Dohlar. Finally, I looked at the new Temple Lands map.

Here's what I find interesting:

1. It's pretty clear Saram Bay will play a significant role in ATST;
2. In terms of interdicting shipping between South Harchong and the main Harchong Empire, it makes some sense;
3. However, at least from looking at the old Safehold map and the new Saram Bay map, Saram Bay is not a port at the terminus of any significant roadway or waterway to Harchong, and certainly not for any such road or waterway to the Temple Lands or to points east;
4. Fairstock would (from the old Safehold map) seem to be a more likely target for the CE, given its better road and water access to the Temple Lands. Frankly, a couple of previously unnamed inlets slightly east of Hayzor(now Malantor and the Bay of Erech in the new Temple Lands map) would seem even better situated to be likely locations for thriving seaports, and thus perhaps more likely targets for the CE.;
5. The new Temple Lands map, though, indicates Saram may well be a great port for the export of goods from North Harchong, for shipment on the Gulf of Dohlar.

So, the question is, why Saram Bay, and not Malantor? Only the Shadow knows (that is, if the Shadow is RFC).

Per HFQ:
(Emphasis is mine)
"Shayn Island lay smack in the middle of the entrance to Saram Bay in the Province of Steve, the primary western anchorage of the Royal Dohlaran Navy now that the Dohlarans had lost Claw Island."

I THINK that's where Admiral Rohasil (RDN) is hanging his hat lately...

WeberFan wrote:
Per HFQ:
(Emphasis is mine)
"Shayn Island lay smack in the middle of the entrance to Saram Bay in the Province of Steve, the primary western anchorage of the Royal Dohlaran Navy now that the Dohlarans had lost Claw Island."

I THINK that's where Admiral Rohasil (RDN) is hanging his hat lately...

Ahhh, thank you very much! You are quite correct.

Further to my last.

IIRC, Rhaigair has good defenses that are in the process of really getting the state of the art guns. Ten-inchers if memory serves.

Should be a good test for a King Haarhald methinks.

WeberFan wrote:Further to my last.

IIRC, Rhaigair has good defenses that are in the process of really getting the state of the art guns. Ten-inchers if memory serves.

Should be a good test for a King Haarhald methinks.

Steam right into the heart of the best defended port and lay waste to it while not getting very damaged. Talk about a moral breaker. It would be nice after destroying the harbor defenses to tow the dreadnought back out.

bigrunt wrote:

WeberFan wrote:Further to my last.

IIRC, Rhaigair has good defenses that are in the process of really getting the state of the art guns. Ten-inchers if memory serves.

Should be a good test for a King Haarhald methinks.

Steam right into the heart of the best defended port and lay waste to it while not getting very damaged. Talk about a moral breaker. It would be nice after destroying the harbor defenses to tow the dreadnought back out.

You are referring to the "borrowed" Rotweiller???

Don

-

WeberFan wrote:

XofDallas wrote:I took another look at the new maps, including the detailed one for Saram Bay. Then I looked at the larger, older, interactive maps of Safehold, including in particular the Gulf of Dohlar. Finally, I looked at the new Temple Lands map.

Here's what I find interesting:

1. It's pretty clear Saram Bay will play a significant role in ATST;
2. In terms of interdicting shipping between South Harchong and the main Harchong Empire, it makes some sense;
3. However, at least from looking at the old Safehold map and the new Saram Bay map, Saram Bay is not a port at the terminus of any significant roadway or waterway to Harchong, and certainly not for any such road or waterway to the Temple Lands or to points east;
4. Fairstock would (from the old Safehold map) seem to be a more likely target for the CE, given its better road and water access to the Temple Lands. Frankly, a couple of previously unnamed inlets slightly east of Hayzor(now Malantor and the Bay of Erech in the new Temple Lands map) would seem even better situated to be likely locations for thriving seaports, and thus perhaps more likely targets for the CE.;
5. The new Temple Lands map, though, indicates Saram may well be a great port for the export of goods from North Harchong, for shipment on the Gulf of Dohlar.

So, the question is, why Saram Bay, and not Malantor? Only the Shadow knows (that is, if the Shadow is RFC).

Per HFQ:
(Emphasis is mine)
"Shayn Island lay smack in the middle of the entrance to Saram Bay in the Province of Steve, the primary western anchorage of the Royal Dohlaran Navy now that the Dohlarans had lost Claw Island."

I THINK that's where Admiral Rohasil (RDN) is hanging his hat lately...

In addition to being the western anchorage of the RDN, Saram Bay looks to me to be the most defensible option from the landward side. That would make it a good place to base a threat to the underbelly of the Temple Lands and/or North Harchong. Take out the RDN force and start moving in-land forces to advance North and force a re-distribution of the MHOG.

bigrunt wrote:
Steam right into the heart of the best defended port and lay waste to it while not getting very damaged. Talk about a moral breaker. It would be nice after destroying the harbor defenses to tow the dreadnought back out.

Which is in Gorath Bay being examined by Lieutenant Clever Clogs, unfortunately.

Hi Weird Harold,

If as some have suggested [not me, they need to fully retrain] the newly incorporated Corisande Forces are being quickly sent east, then using Saram Bay as a launch point to raid North Harchong could infuriate the empire enough to bring a halt and redeployment to the second wave of the MH.

Magazine rifle equipped dragoons, or light horse infantry for you Aussies, with proper mortar and artillery support, could cut quite a swath across poorly defended parts of the empire [courtesy of seijin intel] to some other exit point.

Vastly more important than whipping the poor troops left behind and running off the local aristocracy and any inquisitors they can catch, ie destroying the power and credibility of the traditional authorities, would be the encouragement and protection of all the serfs willing to leave, to be free with their own land on Greentree, Westbreak Island or some other nearby island.

Now that the EoC can charter hundreds of galleons to transport hundreds of thousands of ex-serfs, moving a 1/4-1/2 million over a month or so, to start with, would shock the aristocracy to its very core, challenging all their assumptions.

Meanwhile OWL's broadsheets would ensure even the serfs all across North Harchong would know what happened and what will happen in the future so they can start to hope, then prepare for the opportunity when it comes.

Granted those too far inland are beyond the EoC's capabilities in this war, but there are a lot around the coast, and if anything would bring the HE to the peace table in this war, its a direct threat to their traditional society and culture such 'rescues represent, even before they realize when South Harchong is going.


Your wise comments will be appreciated.

L

Weird Harold wrote:

WeberFan wrote:*quote="XofDallas"*I took another look at the new maps, including the detailed one for Saram Bay. Then I looked at the larger, older, interactive maps of Safehold, including in particular the Gulf of Dohlar. Finally, I looked at the new Temple Lands map.

Here's what I find interesting:

1. It's pretty clear Saram Bay will play a significant role in ATST;
2. In terms of interdicting shipping between South Harchong and the main Harchong Empire, it makes some sense;
3. However, at least from looking at the old Safehold map and the new Saram Bay map, Saram Bay is not a port at the terminus of any significant roadway or waterway to Harchong, and certainly not for any such road or waterway to the Temple Lands or to points east;
4. Fairstock would (from the old Safehold map) seem to be a more likely target for the CE, given its better road and water access to the Temple Lands. Frankly, a couple of previously unnamed inlets slightly east of Hayzor(now Malantor and the Bay of Erech in the new Temple Lands map) would seem even better situated to be likely locations for thriving seaports, and thus perhaps more likely targets for the CE.;
5. The new Temple Lands map, though, indicates Saram may well be a great port for the export of goods from North Harchong, for shipment on the Gulf of Dohlar.

So, the question is, why Saram Bay, and not Malantor? Only the Shadow knows (that is, if the Shadow is RFC).*quote*

Per HFQ:
(Emphasis is mine)
"Shayn Island lay smack in the middle of the entrance to Saram Bay in the Province of Steve, the primary western anchorage of the Royal Dohlaran Navy now that the Dohlarans had lost Claw Island."

I THINK that's where Admiral Rohasil (RDN) is hanging his hat lately...

In addition to being the western anchorage of the RDN, Saram Bay looks to me to be the most defensible option from the landward side. That would make it a good place to base a threat to the underbelly of the Temple Lands and/or North Harchong. Take out the RDN force and start moving in-land forces to advance North and force a re-distribution of the MHOG.

lyonheart wrote:
Vastly more important than whipping the poor troops left behind and running off the local aristocracy and any inquisitors they can catch, ie destroying the power and credibility of the traditional authorities, would be the encouragement and protection of all the serfs willing to leave, to be free with their own land on Greentree, Westbreak Island or some other nearby island.

Now that the EoC can charter hundreds of galleons to transport hundreds of thousands of ex-serfs, moving a 1/4-1/2 million over a month or so, to start with, would shock the aristocracy to its very core, challenging all their assumptions.

Seems pretty random to me.

Where are the troops coming from?

Just because Charis may have 'endless' money, doesn't mean they have the number of vessels needed available. Where are all these vessels with nothing of higher priority they can be used for coming from? What will be the economic impact of diverting them from whatever they are currently being used for?

Who owns Greentree or Westbreak and what is their reaction to such an influx going to be? What is the terrain, climate and soil fertility like and how many people live there already?

Are those islands generally even 'consecrated'?

Where is the materiel, food and transport going to come from to support all these people during their first year or so, building homes, starting farms etc.?