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Potential Future or Current Ship Names

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Re: Potential Future or Current Ship Names
Post by dscott8   » Sat Jul 23, 2016 9:18 pm

dscott8
Commodore

Posts: 791
Joined: Thu Jul 15, 2010 6:17 am

Just scrolled through four pages to verify that no one had made the obvious suggestion:

Shippy McShipface.
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Re: Potential Future or Current Ship Names
Post by saber964   » Sat Jul 23, 2016 10:11 pm

saber964
Admiral

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Location: Spokane WA USA

Jonathan_S wrote:
saber964 wrote:Hawking died trying to defend an ad hoc convoy against overwhelming odds so that the civilian merchants could have a chance to escape. It was the same thing when Helen Zilwicki Sr died. IIRC Zilwicki had 2 CL's and 3 DD's vs 6 CA's.

I don't see it as quite the same because (as much as it would be a violation of their duty, and against the traditions of the RMN) Helen Zilwicki Sr had choices. It was physically possible for the escort to run away (not that pretty much any RMN officer would), and picked a battle plan that maximized the chance of laming the pursuers even though it exposed the escort command to greater risks (turn broadside in a grav wave; more weapons but more vulnerable and spread your fire to cripple as many sails as possible before you're inevitable overwhelmed). (And for all that there's no evidence that any of the escort ships involved landed themselves on the List of Honor)

Hawkwing, for all the undoubted bravery of her officers and crew, didn't really have choices (well, except to order the armed civilian passenger liner to run rather that fight). She was ambushed from stealth, deep within the missile range of a far superior unit, and really could only keep up a running fight as long as possible to lure the BC slightly further away from the rest of the convoy. But she couldn't successfully run anyway, and I can't imagine taking that fire without shooting back. So what major moral choice did she make in that fight?


(Still, I'm not the arbiter of what ships belong on the RMN's List, and it's certainly possible I'm reading too much into the few examples we've got. OTOH something had to have kept the list from ballooning to a vast size over the centuries - so it's unlikely every ship that faced unequal odds, or fought a losing battle in defense of a convoy, made it onto the list; even in peacetime much less during declared wars)


Sometime you really have no choice in the matter. Read up on some of the examples from WWII, I've already posted and add to those the Battle of Samar or the Battle of Sunda Strait or the exploits of the ABDA (Australian British Dutch American) forces in the months after Pearl Harbor.
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Re: Potential Future or Current Ship Names
Post by SharkHunter   » Sat Jul 23, 2016 10:38 pm

SharkHunter
Vice Admiral

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Location: Independence, Missouri

Re: Hawkwing and Wayarer...

I would argue that Hawkwing will end up on the list but that Wayfarer will not -- because we already know that Honor and her mates will sail into the teeth of death and lose their ship in defense of Manticore, Grayson, et. al. So it would be sort of gilding the lily for a second ship under her command to receive the same battle honor.

Hawkwing could have also ended the fight early, scuttled and abandoned because of severe damage, but kept fighting to FORCE the Peep battlecruiser to focus on them so that Artemis and the freighters could run. It's the same reason HMS Madrigal ought to be on the List, though Madrigal has been honored that way by the GNS, given that Nike won her original honors when Saganami turned to fight solo to let others escape.

In contrast, Wayfarer was much more evenly matched and had a reasonable chance of "the win" until the second hit to the cargo doors took out her long distance missile pod punch.

Otherwise my guess is that she'd have taken out the battlecruiser that had lock on the Q-ship and Artemis and might have escaped further detection due to particle densities, etc. as well.
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All my posts are YMMV, IMHO, and welcoming polite discussion, extension, and rebuttal. This is the HonorVerse, after all
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