Genetic superhumans as sleeper agents

So, where are the "my daddy is bigger and badder than your daddy alignment kiddo jails" They must be jammed packed full. There are always at least 2 or so per 100 who engage in this BS to "inflate" their ego when life is not going their way in an argument on the playground, and 1 in 10 who do so when it is not going their way in societal gatherings. Just because you are genetically predisposed to being able to memorize/learn quickly does not mean you have been forced to learn and even "dumb" kids know far more about certain subjects than "smart" kids do.

There is effectively only one way possible for the alignment to truly stay hidden. Keep everyone who knows, in one secluded spot and only let a few very stable people loose to work their "brilliance". Otherwise, the conspiracy would never hold 5 seconds. This raising their family who knows "amidst everyone else" is complete HOGWASH. In other words, the entire MALIGN generations conspiracy is complete HOGWASH under the light of reality, but lets just forget about it. It is not a rational argument. Like the "Illuminati" HOGWASH tin foil kooks.

Vince wrote:

SharkHunter wrote:Lack of defectors.... just a thought, which sort of coincides with other wiser folks postings on inside the onion vs. out, etc. Given the nature of the beast -- and the fact that many of the folks "almost in the know" have drug capsules that terminate them if they're so much as asked the wrong question.

My other question is "defecting from what?" any prior defectors are likely from "Manpower" and not in the Onion. Meanwhile those 25,000 or so are subscribing to a master plan that somewhat maes sense to them, and they're the folks in charge of a whole planet. Even some of the tip top folks don't seem to have ALL of the master plan; Jack McBryde didn't know about Darius, for example. Bardasano et. al are way up the food chain, and didn't know until after Monica that there was even a second agenda in play whose sole purpose was to smash the Solarian League with the Manticoran hammer.

Thoughts?

While Jack McBryde wasn't briefed in on Darius, Isabel Bardasano knew the full agenda for Monica. It was Aldona Anisimovna that was kept in the dark.

I think you're agreeing with me what I was focusing on -- Anisimovna was out wreaking havoc as a "Manpower super agent" (adrenaline junkie / danger addict there), but doesn't have the whole picture. McBryde? security head of a mainresearch facility -- doesn't have the whole picture. Obviously the RF worlds don't, nor even their leaders ==>who buy into the "we're better than y'all" argument but likely have no idea that the Detweiler's effectively have an arsenal "star system" up their sleeve. So far the only folks who seem to have the whole picture are the Detweilers and at least one or two of the MAlign navy commanders we've heard about. The MAlign Navy is also only recently "an item", meaning that the circle of folks who could defect is very small.

The only reason Simoes was so dangerous as a defector is that as a physicist he can help prove the science, as a techie, he's enough like Shannon Foraker that folks know how to deal with him, AND McBryde game him enough information on the other nastiness that the MAlign (not Manpower) was up to [that is inimical and therefore of extreme interest to Manticore, etc.] to fit the Honorverse circumstances that RFC has so carefully set up. Plus plot wise, the only reason Simoes was able to defect was because of the unlikely combination of McBryde, Zilwicki, and Cachat. Otherwise he goes off to a Mesan work gulag for a couple decades. Hard to defect from prison.

Relax wrote:So, where are the "my daddy is bigger and badder than your daddy alignment kiddo jails" They must be jammed packed full. There are always at least 2 or so per 100 who engage in this BS to "inflate" their ego when life is not going their way in an argument on the playground, and 1 in 10 who do so when it is not going their way in societal gatherings. Just because you are genetically predisposed to being able to memorize/learn quickly does not mean you have been forced to learn and even "dumb" kids know far more about certain subjects than "smart" kids do.

There is effectively only one way possible for the alignment to truly stay hidden. Keep everyone who knows, in one secluded spot and only let a few very stable people loose to work their "brilliance". Otherwise, the conspiracy would never hold 5 seconds. This raising their family who knows "amidst everyone else" is complete HOGWASH. In other words, the entire MALIGN generations conspiracy is complete HOGWASH under the light of reality, but lets just forget about it. It is not a rational argument. Like the "Illuminati" HOGWASH tin foil kooks.

Maybe they're selecting for some other traits than just "intelligence?"

The kids aren't let into the secret until they're late teens and they've passed a number of tests, most of which are probably not something they're aware of. And the ones who can't keep their mouths shut probably meet unfortunate accidents.

Good grief man, apply basic family dynamics if you do not like my "my daddy is better than yours" point. What child does not know essentially everything that is going on in their parents lives. What family does not have giant blow ups and spats where all the skeletons come out, get crushed, or new ones are created?

Relax wrote:Good grief man, apply basic family dynamics if you do not like my "my daddy is better than yours" point. What child does not know essentially everything that is going on in their parents lives. What family does not have giant blow ups and spats where all the skeletons come out, get crushed, or new ones are created?

Families that know that if they let certain secrets out, they're likely to wind up in the river wearing concrete overshoes. I am not joking - one of my relatives married into the Chicago Mafia. My mother ran off a Teamsters attempt to take over her union. The FBI showed up to ask her about things. Do I know what that was about? No. I had no clue about most of it until Mother was safely dead and my sister started mentioning a couple of incidents. Now that I know about some of it, I've got some suspicions about a few incidents, but those things are so far in the past that nobody should care.

Relax wrote:Good grief man, apply basic family dynamics if you do not like my "my daddy is better than yours" point. What child does not know essentially everything that is going on in their parents lives. What family does not have giant blow ups and spats where all the skeletons come out, get crushed, or new ones are created?

There recently was an article on the kids of the Soviet NOC agents the the FBI picked up a few years ago in NYC.
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2016/ ... alex-foley

kzt wrote:

Relax wrote:Good grief man, apply basic family dynamics if you do not like my "my daddy is better than yours" point. What child does not know essentially everything that is going on in their parents lives. What family does not have giant blow ups and spats where all the skeletons come out, get crushed, or new ones are created?

There recently was an article on the kids of the Soviet NOC agents the the FBI picked up a few years ago in NYC.
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2016/ ... alex-foley

What that actually shows is the total primacy of the culture they grew up in rather than the culture of thier parents this also is supported by the fact that research shows that by far the most important actors on childrens outcomes and behavious are thier peers. It is one of the reasons schools make so little difference in childrens behaviour. Peers are suggetsted to be even more important than parents which is one of the main theses of the Psychologist Judith Rich Harris's book "The Nurture assumption"

This is one of the main reasons that I find the whole intergenerational conspiricy so difficult to take. Those groups who successfully propogate inside a larger culture are either self isolating (amish etc) and/or isolated by the larger culture (Jews in estern europe)

See, to join a group, be it a religous group, rebellion to overthrow a government, or a country club, a person has to have a reason to do so. Such a reason is not genetics... It is not because your parents are in such and such group.

Yes, you can hold people at gunpoint, but that always ends badly and does nothing but create double agents. No one likes being told what to do. Let alone at gunpoint.

The MALIGN has no reason for drawing in new members. Everyone already thinks they are the top of the food chain. There is no reason to reach for the top if one does not get the trappings(mostly adulation and power of others) if it is hidden. The MALIGN ability to create and sustain itself flies direction counter to basic human nature. Other than this massive foundational foopah, the series is excellent...

Relax wrote:See, to join a group, be it a religous group, rebellion to overthrow a government, or a country club, a person has to have a reason to do so. Such a reason is not genetics... It is not because your parents are in such and such group.

Yes, you can hold people at gunpoint, but that always ends badly and does nothing but create double agents. No one likes being told what to do. Let alone at gunpoint.

The MALIGN has no reason for drawing in new members. Everyone already thinks they are the top of the food chain. There is no reason to reach for the top if one does not get the trappings(mostly adulation and power of others) if it is hidden. The MALIGN ability to create and sustain itself flies direction counter to basic human nature. Other than this massive foundational foopah, the series is excellent...

Just one word: Illuminati
https://postimg.org/image/3o2yz5jep/

founded on May 1, 1776 then went underground when the catholic church outlawed them in 1784. here is an example of a secret society that has remained hidden for hundreds of years.

Start out telling your teenage kid that you are a genie and better than everyone else. after he/she braggs a couple of times and gets the C**P beat out of him/her a few times he/she will learn to keep his/her mouth shut.

Than when he is in his late 20's, introduce him/her into the outer layer of the onion. You are destined to be a leader of men, we are a secret group and will help you, you will need to help others once you become successful.

Once he/she becomes a successful leader, he/she is introduced to the next layer of the onion.

darrell wrote:

Relax wrote:See, to join a group, be it a religous group, rebellion to overthrow a government, or a country club, a person has to have a reason to do so. Such a reason is not genetics... It is not because your parents are in such and such group.

Yes, you can hold people at gunpoint, but that always ends badly and does nothing but create double agents. No one likes being told what to do. Let alone at gunpoint.

The MALIGN has no reason for drawing in new members. Everyone already thinks they are the top of the food chain. There is no reason to reach for the top if one does not get the trappings(mostly adulation and power of others) if it is hidden. The MALIGN ability to create and sustain itself flies direction counter to basic human nature. Other than this massive foundational foopah, the series is excellent...

Just one word: Illuminati
https://postimg.org/image/3o2yz5jep/

founded on May 1, 1776 then went underground when the catholic church outlawed them in 1784. here is an example of a secret society that has remained hidden for hundreds of years.

Start out telling your teenage kid that you are a genie and better than everyone else. after he/she braggs a couple of times and gets the C**P beat out of him/her a few times he/she will learn to keep his/her mouth shut.

Than when he is in his late 20's, introduce him/her into the outer layer of the onion. You are destined to be a leader of men, we are a secret group and will help you, you will need to help others once you become successful.

Once he/she becomes a successful leader, he/she is introduced to the next layer of the onion.

Sorry but nothing in the more reputable sources to suggest that the illuminati actually exist as a real thing outside the dates you mention. Trying to claim otherwise is laughable and is generally considered to be proof of belonging to the moster raving loony conspiricy brigade. Trying to use them as an example to support the Onion is laughable, again they are not secret, everyone knows about them. No serious scholar suggests that the illuminati are anything more than a particularly successful myth and darling of hollywood.

The short version is that there is no credible evidence of ANY conspiricy (government or otherwise) being totally invisible for any significant period of time. Human society just does not work that way. There are totally visible "secret societies" such as the Masons and governement secrets shuch as Area 52 and whatever the ministry of ungentelmany warfare did in WW2 but while the details are murky the existance of these organisations and the general organisation goals are never in doubt. For years the NSA was know as no such agency as they were not officially acknowledged but tht didn't mean that they were actually secret.