Thank you, Theemile. I appreciate the distillation involved.
The one-dimensionality referred to is visible in some of the responses and it's a real-world issue, not one confined to forums like this. Here, it's visible in the way responses are framed within contexts. For example, let's look at the issue of SD's. The conventional context is to see them as a capital ship, hence refits/conversions etc have to be done in first class dockyards, we are, after all, discussing a capital ship.
This is a classic sign of constrained thinking. For example, the work of converting most of the obsolete capital ships of the RN to auxiliary uses during WWI was not done in naval yards at all. Much of the stripping was done in commercial scrapyards which had skilled people and cranes sufficient to remove valuable equipment undamaged, and scrap unnecessary structures and equipment. Most of the reconstruction work to convert the hull to its new purpose was done in commercial repair yards. Only work requiring a combat oriented outcome was done in naval yards: examples such as
Vindictive's conversion for Zeebrugge spring to mind. However, most of the conversion of
Thetis,
Intrepid and
Iphigenia was not. Similarly, the conversion of the Crimean War blockships (wooden BB reduced to lesser service) was mostly done in commercial yards.
In this instance, conversion of large, why would cheaply available hulls to training ships require a first-class yard? it certainly will not require first-class manning on its original scale for it would no longer be a capital ship at all. It's been converted into a training ship.
The manpower issue is a critical one where any force is expanding rapidly. There, the larger the TS, the better. The larger vessel can handle more trainees for the same sunk costs in ship terms (as in ship crew and skilled personnel to run the ship) while providing the accommodation and training facilities equivalent to many smaller vessels. A standard RN practise was to assign obsolescent large warships in good material condition to shoreside training establishments as tenders. This allowed economies in training staff and training continuity. The same instructors ashore as at sea, the shore base XO was usually the tender's CO and so forth.
We did exactly the same thing when HMAS Jervis Bay was our TS, Staff from the training establishments went aboard with the trainees and we scripted the training to our own personalities. I am methodical, calm and patient, which meant I taught the Mids blind pilotage. A lot.
I take your point on the small regional navies. Indeed, that's why I commented, that's precisely the position my own Navy was in after Australian Federation in 1901. Subsequent to that we formed our own small national navy within the much larger Imperial Navy of the Second British Empire. hence the parallels I have been pointing out here.
The smaller and less wealthy navies will behave in a way similar to the way the Colonial governments here did from 1880 to 1901, and then in a way analogous to the way the federal government did after 1901.
so I note your point on the way 'Rembrandt and the other former members of the Rembrandt league' might behave. As they exist in substantial form they will want to upgrade to Imperial standard ASAP. For them, immediate availability of no-cost, large, robust hulls for local conversion to TS is a "no-brainer" (if I recall my Americanisms properly). They can be gotten into local TS service before a proposal winds its way through the bureaucracy of the Imperial capital.
The very minor or non-existent other naval services down at the hardscrabble layer might well act in a way similar to the way New Zealand acted 1880-1914. They'd be able to man small local squadrons in the same way NZ manned the New Zealand Squadron of the Royal Navy. Their fundamental need will be for a training ship and it may well be a stationary one. Like NZ in the 1890s, it might well form their entire initial training infrastructure.
So giving one of those navies anything larger than a CL will eat up enormous % of the existing manpower of any SDF. Few will have the manpower to man 1 SD even if they strip their entire navy.
So this is the core matter. None of these navies require a capital ship, and that's NOT what is being proposed. Their natural milieu is as trade protection forces and the Admiralty will know that.
That also gives this fictional Admiralty exactly the problem the real one had with Dominion naval forces, how to ensure training to common standards? Within the British Empire that was done by mutually agreed standards, adoption of RN training systems and standards etc. That will not work easily on the sort of scale involved in this fictional universe. it will have to be 'tiered' especially at lower skill/education levels.
This is precisely where a standardised class of TS inexpensive enough for each 'nation' to own and operate directly is required. It enables the upper end of a remedial training system to be standardised. That forms a 'gateway' in terms of standards. In this case, that 'gateway' will be the
minimum standard required for remedially trained personnel to be employable in basic roles aboard Imperial Navy ships to Imperial Naval standards. That means they can start cycles of Imperial service - back to their own Navy to raise their standards. This is all common 'train the trainers' stuff, I might add. The Romans did stuff like this.
I, for one, was an early advocate for upgrading the SDFs to a "uniform standard" using the SLN ships - however over the course of many discourses we proved it probably would not happen.
Not what they need at all. The SDF's are your local trade protection forces. As such they have to focus on significant numbers of small trade protection units. Sure, they need the odd heavy unit for flagship and deterrence value, but the refitted TS can do that. As they reach a set minimum standard they may start to form Squadrons that can go 'off station' as part of the Imperial Navy. That's when they will get first class units. Giving them first class units their people cannot handle for local trade protection won't occur.
The formation ofthe RAN on a first class unit basis occurred in 1913 - that was quite a long while after 1885 when we agreed to form the Auxiliary Squadron, which was specifically tasked with building up a pool of naval personnel trained to the point where they could be employed aboard Imperial ships. By 1913, we knew we had the trained personnel, although we had to borrow a lot of RN officers and SNCO to obtain the expertise to reach Imperial Fleet levels on modern ships so we could conduct offensive actions off the Australia Station against a first class enemy.
Sorry maintenance standards are, at the start, just another training opportunity. So when the hull arrives, the first classes done aboard involve cleaning gear and hatch maintenance Phase 1. It's a training ship, not a front line warship, and there's enough captured to pick a standardised group.
So to reiterate, what I am specifically not saying is that these vessels should be reactivated as capital ships at all. I am saying that they are large, cheap hulls well suited to conversion down to TS, where they can play an important role in training SDF personnel and new inductees up to a minimum Imperial Navy standard.
Cheers; Mark
