Warrior class Energy weapon loadout question.

I thought the Graysons developed the all Graser energy weapon loadout concept but when I was re-reading Ms. Midshipwoman Harrington I noticed that War Maiden was never mentioned as having any offensive lasers. So I checked House of Steel says the Warrior class CCA had an all Graser energy weapon array despite being in service for more then a century before the Grayson and Manticore alliance formed.

So was the Warrior class some kind of test for an all Graser armament that Manticore abandoned but Grayson picked up and ran with? If so why was the all Graser loadout concept initially abandoned by the RMN until the GSN picked up the idea when the Warrior class was well regarded?

Roguevictory wrote:I thought the Graysons developed the all Graser energy weapon loadout concept but when I was re-reading Ms. Midshipwoman Harrington I noticed that War Maiden was never mentioned as having any offensive So was the Warrior class some kind of test for an all lasers. So I checked House of Steel says the Warrior class CCA had an all Graser energy weapon array despite being in service for more then a century before the Grayson and Manticore alliance formed.

Graser armament that Manticore abandoned but Grayson picked up and ran with? If so why was the all Graser loadout concept initially abandoned by the RMN until the GSN picked up the idea when the Warrior class was well regarded?

The Warriors were developed ~100 years prior to where events started in OBS, and even on Honor’s middy cruise, they were old and outdated. They come from a time where ship building had just embraced the pdlc, and missile strikes just became that much harder to obtain, meaning ships would have to get to energy range to complete the deed.

Because of the difficulty of just hitting a ship through its sidewalls (because you can’t see exactly where it is at inside the wedge), doctrine about energy armaments had constantly swung back and forth between few weapons of large, slow, firing hitting power, and multitudes of small, quick firing daggers. We see many Manty ships in the early 1800s favor heavy graser armaments (Like the Couragous class CL), while by the 1850s, the doctrine appears to be that small combatants should have many medium sized lasers, instead of Grasers, giving many, medium sized hits. This appears to be a tradeoff between more hits to localize a target and heavier weapons to seriously damage a target. And comparing classes, an 1875-1900 Manty DD had roughly the same energy weapons fit as a Silensian CA and a Havenite CL.

Looking at the Manty statistics of The devastation of the laser head and the power of modern sensors, lead Grayson to conclude that between the probably battle damage incurred entering energy range and the power of Manty ship’s sensors, individual energy weapons had a high probability to hit – so more, quicker firing weapons were not required and larger, battle resolving weapons were not wasted, hence the all Graser Grayson modern fleet.

Roguevictory wrote:I thought the Graysons developed the all Graser energy weapon loadout concept but when I was re-reading Ms. Midshipwoman Harrington I noticed that War Maiden was never mentioned as having any offensive lasers. So I checked House of Steel says the Warrior class CCA had an all Graser energy weapon array despite being in service for more then a century before the Grayson and Manticore alliance formed.

So was the Warrior class some kind of test for an all Graser armament that Manticore abandoned but Grayson picked up and ran with? If so why was the all Graser loadout concept initially abandoned by the RMN until the GSN picked up the idea when the Warrior class was well regarded?

Grayson didn't just go with an all Graser broadside, they went up an emitter range so their CAs carried what was often a BC graser mount; but it carried fewer energy mounts than other CAs, specifically despite the larger individual mounts it dedicated less broadside volume to energy weapons than other similar vintage CAs -- freeing up that volume for PDLCs, CMs, and Missile Tubes.

We don't know that the Warrior-class did the same, just that it didn't mount any lasers, but the grasers lick would have been normal CA sized ones. Certainly they don't seem to have been going for grasers to squeeze in more missiles or missile defense.

Now we do know from the class descriptions that the Warrior and Truncheon class CAs were designed together with the Truncheon being the lower cost design. Per broadside Truncheons traded off 3 grasers and a missile tube for 5 lasers. (Presumably that means that CA weight lasers are cheaper than CA weight grasers; though probably not in a 3/5 ratio). The partial switch to lasers seems like it pretty much had to be primarily a cost saving measure one way or another; otherwise why not just squeeze in a 7th or maybe even 8th graser to replaced to omitted tube?

Theemile wrote:

Because of the difficulty of just hitting a ship through its sidewalls (because you can’t see exactly where it is at inside the wedge), doctrine about energy armaments had constantly swung back and forth between few weapons of large, slow, firing hitting power, and multitudes of small, quick firing daggers. We see many Manty ships in the early 1800s favor heavy graser armaments (Like the Couragous class CL), while by the 1850s, the doctrine appears to be that small combatants should have many medium sized lasers, instead of Grasers, giving many, medium sized hits. This appears to be a tradeoff between more hits to localize a target and heavier weapons to seriously damage a target. And comparing classes, an 1875-1900 Manty DD had roughly the same energy weapons fit as a Silensian CA and a Havenite CL.

I know the balances between numbers of Grasers and number of Lasers shifted based on period but the Warriors are the only pre-Grayson RMN class I can find with a pure Graser broadside. All of the others include at least a few offensive Lasers alongside their Grasers and I was wondering if anything had explained why the designers went with a pure Graser armerment with one class then didn't do so again for more then a century.

Roguevictory wrote:

Theemile wrote:

Because of the difficulty of just hitting a ship through its sidewalls (because you can’t see exactly where it is at inside the wedge), doctrine about energy armaments had constantly swung back and forth between few weapons of large, slow, firing hitting power, and multitudes of small, quick firing daggers. We see many Manty ships in the early 1800s favor heavy graser armaments (Like the Couragous class CL), while by the 1850s, the doctrine appears to be that small combatants should have many medium sized lasers, instead of Grasers, giving many, medium sized hits. This appears to be a tradeoff between more hits to localize a target and heavier weapons to seriously damage a target. And comparing classes, an 1875-1900 Manty DD had roughly the same energy weapons fit as a Silensian CA and a Havenite CL.

I know the balances between numbers of Grasers and number of Lasers shifted based on period but the Warriors are the only pre-Grayson RMN class I can find with a pure Graser broadside. All of the others include at least a few offensive Lasers alongside their Grasers and I was wondering if anything had explained why the designers went with a pure Graser armerment with one class then didn't do so again for more then a century.

What I was trying to point out was that other light units pre-1850 did mount grasers, but they switched to larger lasers in the 1850+ period. While not entirely the armament, they were part of the armament. And Manticore has continued to mount heavier weapons than competitors. Unfortunately, we don't have insite into that many ships of the period the Warrior was built to see if that was the norm for light Manty ships of the era.

However, in the SITS 2 update for the Warrior Class, we find the following:

"Of note is that it's also armed with an extensive graser armament; a throwback to a different tactical situation, but one that gives it a unique niche in the modern navy."

This does tend to suggest that lighter units in it's era did mount similar offensive mixes, and the grasers were slowly replaced with lasers as the tactical calculus changed, only to resurface in the modern age.