Treecat Marines

I wouldn't be surprised if there is a post somewhere about this, but all I've found is jokes about grav lances on tree cats. So my question is are there going to be tree cat marines?

Personally I think there will/should be a limited number of them for multiple reasons. After the recent events in the honorverse where tree cats have decided to fight with the Star Empire I imagine they won't be satisfied with just sending out a few hundred bodyguards.

They would make great marines. We already know that humans can create skin suits for tree cats, and tree cats can use them. I imagine powered armor and pulsars aren't that far behind. Along with their ability to sense humans I'd imagine they would be invaluable for marines fighting in an urban environment since they would be able to sense enemies and if they were about to be ambushed. In a situation where the marines or navy has to conquer and patrol a planet they would be even more valuable at distinguishing civilians from enemies. At the very least it would be useful to deploy a tree cat with a squad of marines just for it's ability to sense enemies.

A team of tree cats with their ability to talk to each other would probably decimate any equal sized human force. First they can sense enemies and each other and talk to each other in a way that can't be jammed or even detected. Second they are smaller making them harder to hit and easier to get into areas a human couldn't get into. And third they have a number of physiological advantages with 6 limbs and being faster than humans.

Considering the Star Empire is obviously going to have ground force issues trying to secure even a portion of the Solarian League they would be crazy not to use tree cats if they volunteered. Yes they may not be able to make the same technology as a human, but you don't have to know how to make a gun, or in this case a pulsar, in order to use it. I can easily imagine at least a couple thousand tree cats joining the Manticorian marines and army.

PS. With memory singers once the first tree cat marine is trained all training can be shared with future tree cats. Meaning although the first tree cat may take longer to train in tactics and human equipment all the rest could be trained in a fraction of them time a human marine could be trained. In addition combat experience memories can be directly shared, giving green troops an advantage humans could never have.

I'd have to check but I seem to remember a line from one of the books where a memory singer told Honor she had some of Stephanie Harrington's memories. In that case it may be possible for memory singers to pull those memories of training and combat directly from humans. Although it may not be as effective it would still be a significant boost in training time and experience that no human could have.

AaronStorm wrote:I wouldn't be surprised if there is a post somewhere about this, but all I've found is jokes about grav lances on tree cats. So my question is are there going to be tree cat marines?

Personally I think there will/should be a limited number of them for multiple reasons. After the recent events in the honorverse where tree cats have decided to fight with the Star Empire I imagine they won't be satisfied with just sending out a few hundred bodyguards.

They would make great marines. We already know that humans can create skin suits for tree cats, and tree cats can use them. I imagine powered armor and pulsars aren't that far behind. Along with their ability to sense humans I'd imagine they would be invaluable for marines fighting in an urban environment since they would be able to sense enemies and if they were about to be ambushed. In a situation where the marines or navy has to conquer and patrol a planet they would be even more valuable at distinguishing civilians from enemies. At the very least it would be useful to deploy a tree cat with a squad of marines just for it's ability to sense enemies.

We might see treecats attached to marine units, but I don't see them getting integrated as full marines.
Even if it is possible to miniaturize power armor treecats are small enough they're going to have major difficulty carrying or using weapons capable of taking on armored or power armored enemies. A human pulse rifle, which is still somewhat effective against up-armored skin suits would be the equivalent of at least a crew served heavy machine gun, if not a crew served light anti-tank gun for 'cars. Too big for a single 'cat to carry and use.

They can't help split up the squads shared equipment and supplies. They have quite limited ability to communicate with humans. Especially over distance. That makes them hard to tactically integrate into combat plans and communications. There's no evidence they can understand and handle to complicated tac link and (IIRC) heads up display armored marines use for situational awareness, force tracking, and communications. Can't operate vehicles, can't drag a downed Marine to safety...

I don't deny that in some roles they bring unique and valuable assets, but they still seem like more of a specialist attached to, and protected by, a Marine unit for particular operations...

Actually You won't be able to train them as fast as you might think.
The memory singers can teach the mental side of things but there is no evidence that they can speed up the physical side, the "muscle memory" involved in doing a physical task.

Jonathan_S wrote:

AaronStorm wrote:I wouldn't be surprised if there is a post somewhere about this, but all I've found is jokes about grav lances on tree cats. So my question is are there going to be tree cat marines?

Personally I think there will/should be a limited number of them for multiple reasons. After the recent events in the honorverse where tree cats have decided to fight with the Star Empire I imagine they won't be satisfied with just sending out a few hundred bodyguards.

They would make great marines. We already know that humans can create skin suits for tree cats, and tree cats can use them. I imagine powered armor and pulsars aren't that far behind. Along with their ability to sense humans I'd imagine they would be invaluable for marines fighting in an urban environment since they would be able to sense enemies and if they were about to be ambushed. In a situation where the marines or navy has to conquer and patrol a planet they would be even more valuable at distinguishing civilians from enemies. At the very least it would be useful to deploy a tree cat with a squad of marines just for it's ability to sense enemies.

We might see treecats attached to marine units, but I don't see them getting integrated as full marines.
Even if it is possible to miniaturize power armor treecats are small enough they're going to have major difficulty carrying or using weapons capable of taking on armored or power armored enemies. A human pulse rifle, which is still somewhat effective against up-armored skin suits would be the equivalent of at least a crew served heavy machine gun, if not a crew served light anti-tank gun for 'cars. Too big for a single 'cat to carry and use.

They can't help split up the squads shared equipment and supplies. They have quite limited ability to communicate with humans. Especially over distance. That makes them hard to tactically integrate into combat plans and communications. There's no evidence they can understand and handle to complicated tac link and (IIRC) heads up display armored marines use for situational awareness, force tracking, and communications. Can't operate vehicles, can't drag a downed Marine to safety...

I don't deny that in some roles they bring unique and valuable assets, but they still seem like more of a specialist attached to, and protected by, a Marine unit for particular operations...

I agree. And I don't think it would be fair to the cats to needlessly place them in that sort of harm's way. You really can't bring claws to a tribarrel fight.

However, I am open to the possibility of specialized use. Perhaps on some very elite SpecOps, SOCOM units on a highly suitable mission in some jungle. They may have been used as recon against the Medusans.

It does beg to question whether a bonded Marine could have his treecat present on missions. It could be risky though. If one goes down in the middle of a bloodbath the other, in his incapacitated state, is likely to follow.

good question.

mike henke had a couple of marines with cats and had one of them sit in on a couple of interrogations of OFS but i can see taking a cat into ground combat as being very tricky.

until recently 'cats bonded to naval personnel went into special armoured life support boxes. also while we know nimitiz and a few others bonded/working with admirals/flag staff ride their person's shoulder on the flag deck/bridge.

I don't see anyway less then a captain/chief of staff having that option.

Dauntless wrote:I don't see anyway less then a captain/chief of staff having that option.

Ms Midshipwoman Harrison gives some idea of the life of a bonded pair in the lower ranks.

Jonathan_S wrote:..snip..
Even if it is possible to miniaturize power armor treecats are small enough they're going to have major difficulty carrying or using weapons capable of taking on armored or power armored enemies. A human pulse rifle, which is still somewhat effective against up-armored skin suits would be the equivalent of at least a crew served heavy machine gun, if not a crew served light anti-tank gun for 'cars. Too big for a single 'cat to carry and use.
..snip..

Here we have a prime example of the size-fallacy. Just because treecats have a small stature compared to humans it doesn't follow that any powered armor has to be tailored to their stature.

Imagine powered armor for treecats that are as big or bigger than humans, you could for example model it after hexa-pumas. Imagine an armored six legged monstrosity charging down a street towards you, cue brown pants moment.

Weird Harold wrote:

Dauntless wrote:I don't see anyway less then a captain/chief of staff having that option.

Ms Midshipwoman Harrison gives some idea of the life of a bonded pair in the lower ranks.

yes it did but that was pre-cat skinsuits.

i agree that it shows how the cat will probably be left in snotty row/quarters rather then going all over the ship unless they are bonded with a fiarly senior officer like the Chief Engineer, XO or Captain. CMedO and logistics as well probably.

but middies, ensigns and lieutenants probably don't take their companions with them the way Honor (once she made Lt Cdmr/XO) and Harry Tschu seemed to.

I seem to recall a short fanfic posted on bean's bar not long after AoV was released about treecat commandoes training on Home fleets flagship and threatening to blow up the ship if they didn't get all the celery

Given that the total population of treecats is 'under 12 million" (per Mission of Honor), I don't think using them in large mass groups such as Marines is the best employment for them.

Now, as Special Forces Operatives, I think they'd be the cat's meow...(sorry about that).