Expressions of Manticoran wealth

drothgery wrote:

cthia wrote:One would also suspect, that someone in the aircar has to be a licensed driver. I suspect, it's the one behind the wheel.

Here on Earth, companies are beginning to experiment with cars that drive themselves. But that technology does not, should not, can not be expected to replace a licensed driver.

There's a school of thought that says that a mostly self-driving car (one that's expected to rely on human backup in emergencies, but can otherwise handle itself) is probably more dangerous than an entirely human-driven car OR an entirely automated car, because if the car can normally drive itself, you're not going to be paying enough attention to take over fast enough when you need to.

ncwolf wrote:We've sort of seen that with airplanes. Do you remember the pilot and co-pilot who overshot the airport by one or two hundred miles (which is, what, 15 to 30 minutes) because they both fell asleep?

Just plain not funny. So why am I laughing?

kzt wrote:

cthia wrote:I remember yesteryear when I was a newly hired member of an Engineering firm. We were all sitting around drinking coffee or hot chocolate when I read the specs on a new offering of automobile safety that was slated to save lives. Gas airbags! All the new rave. "They'll really work with a reaction time of a few milliseconds and deploy at an astounding 200 mph!"

"What?!" I nearly jumped out of my seat. "This tech is going to kill people. A lot of people!"

It turns out that about the same number of little kids get killed every year by their parents accidentally leaving them in their car than were killed by airbags when they rode in the front seats....

Misleading.

What percentage of kids were forgotten of those that were taken to the local grocer?

What percentage of kids were killed, injured or maimed of the number subjected to the flying shrapnel of an artificial warzone?


Traveling with mom w/o airbag is still the safest way to travel.

People are disabling the systems in their cars.

I know! Everyone in the car could wear the bombsquad blast units!

"Mom! I don't wanna wear this blast unit!"

"At least wear your football helmet and the bulletproof vest."

"Give the blast unit to the baby!"

Two similar threads yet neither snoops around into the backyard of the royalty. I'll just use this thread instead of creating another...

I've a luxury flat in Fuerteventura -- sentimental. Very sentimental. I purchased it for my parents shortly after graduating college. They have passed on and I've kept it as they have left it. I have a nice home in Cape Cod where I go to watch my friends lose several hundred dollar frisbees in the Sound -- purchased after being introduced to Martha's Vineyard by my parents.

I have a flat in the UK, it comes in handy when visiting the wife's family. I purchased an unused commercial building in Bucuresti that I've turned into a very nice suite. My Romanian friends have confiscated it. (It's near the hospital where many of them are doctors and it affords them down time while being on call) I still own my original home (a glorified closet says my sister) that I purchased fresh out of college after landing my grad school sports car of a spaceship in Silicon Valley. I currently live on the East Coast with my newly wed wife, and my siblings and I own beach property on the East Coast that has been in the family for decades. However, owning several homes doesn't put you into an exclusive club -- just a higher tax bracket.

I'm not a billionare. I'm not a multi-millionaire. Yet I do have several tens of millions of liquid assets lying around to play monopoly. Yet, where do the real money hang out -- the truly exclusive, by birth or by stratospheric attainment? Certainly not in my social circles. I've met quite a few "rich" people. Silicon Valley is responsible for that. But where does real exclusivity hang out? I've seen lots of famous people. But these are just millionaires. Where do people like Kings and Queens hang out? Billionaires?

One social hub I know of is St. Moritz, a very posh ski resort. I'm talking very posh. People throw money around there like its tainted with some version of the Andromeda Strain. You may see some of anybody there -- the ordinarily rich and famous that is. But "surfs up" if you like hanging "cold ten." It's the best skiing you'll find -- there is no second.

One of my favorite restaurants (and of my sisters) and well worth the cost, is Il Ristorante di Giorgio Baldi in Santa Monica - a very exclusive high end Italian restaurant. (I go straight for the Main lobster every time -- though I always order a new second dish to try.) If you want to see a star, eat there. It's their watering hole. Very good food. Beautiful ambiance. Espensive. But well worth it if you're looking to take that special someone on a romantic date -- or just the familiar company of either of your lovely sisters.

A very beautiful spot of heaven is Barbuda, in the Carribean. Princess Diana frequented it. A lot of the rich and famous do as well. One of my sisters honeymooned there. It truly is a non cliche type of very lovely. From what I've seen, twenty five percent of the guests are very lucky bird watchers. My mother once said that "Barbuda should be held in as precious a memory as any old gems or stones."

These are all places that I've frequented. Where do the real money go -- the billionaires, the Kings and Queens, the oil sheiks?

Some of my friends think I'm seeing these people, but I don't. Others of my friends should be seeing these people, but they don't. Sure, I've seen many Hollywood personalities. Just spend two hours dressing up for an evening at Giorgio Baldi for that. But where are the truly rich and famous?

It is interesting that success places what the snub nose sect snub for, into the reach of music artists, athletes, lottery winners, lucky investers, smart investers and the like. Which forces these people to create their own planet of exclusivity within the walls of their homes. Or on a private island or on their own floating ship.

Exactly how exclusive is Cosmos in the Honorverse? Where do the Hauptmans eat out? I can't imagine Klaus frequenting Cosmos. I can't even imagine Klaus as a member of the Cosmos Club on Old Earth -- though it'd be right down the line of his daughter.

Where could I take a discreet photo of the image of Stacey Hauptman soaking in the rays of the sun on the beach -- or just soak up the image to be indeliby burned into my brain? And where does Elizabeth and Justin go to let down their hair -- to walk along the beach line with sand between their toes while wearing tattered and worn, yet quite comfortable, familiar old denim?

Even though these people represent the truly exclusive by nature -- they are still only human.

Note: Silicon Valley is not to be confused with Silicone Valley -- both being appendages of California.

ncwolf said:
I guess the closest we've seen to the struggling class is the steader family (from Grayson) in the last Honorverse collection who had a feckless youth as family head, two girls making a living as strippers, and a midship(wo)man -- sorry y'all it's late, and I can't find it on my computer.

The Grayson steader family with the irresponsible teenager as pater families, cousins working as strippers on one of the Blackbird habitats, and the newly minted Ensign was in Obligated Service.

Cthia, I'd not share such details with close friends let alone the internet.
Air travel is one way to show luxury levels. Now that I'm retired and paying for it myself I go cattle class, and use the terminal facilities. At work for many years I flew business class and was a business club member, with occasional upgrades to first travel and clubs. The higher the nicer in comfort, drink and food. In my last position I had access to corporate jets, and the time saving was very welcome, but we didn't access any airport facilities, just came and went.

As to the very upper crust, I have occasionally came into contact & it is not as many might think. Rich and famous means target for robbery or kidnapping plus papparzi, so they have no privacy and are restricted in what they can do, with body guards and flunkeys always there. Most rich and famous are there because they are driven workacholics anyway, so don't relax and enjoy the luxury.

Daryl wrote:As to the very upper crust, I have occasionally came into contact & it is not as many might think. Rich and famous means target for robbery or kidnapping plus papparzi, so they have no privacy and are restricted in what they can do, with body guards and flunkeys always there. Most rich and famous are there because they are driven workacholics anyway, so don't relax and enjoy the luxury.

It depends. I used to do occasional work for a very wealthy woman, as in billionaire level. While she had a protective staff, she had no dedicated security people as far as I know. But she was pretty damn private. It's not like it would be a secret that she had a lot of money (her name is on more than one large public building), but she lived out of the public eye. She raised her kids and did a bunch of charity work, letting her staff run her money. On the other hand, Taylor Swift is much less wealthy than the first woman, she travels in a security bubble because she is in the public eye all the time, it's part of how she became and remains successful. And she attracts crazies and overenthusiastic fans.

Are the expressions of wealth => simply an extension of freedom towards a "slightly" more Utopian planetary system as designed by our favorite space-opera's author.

The setup favors the result. Roger Winton sets out with an expedition designed with "Western European" ideals in mind. Then there's a plague needing a huge number of emigres to "restock the planet with people", so the offer is "we need really hard workers with skills in return for a stake in the system".

Granted, Weber shows us enough corruption (mostly in certain parts of the Manticoran nobility, who realistically have no need to work much) that we buy off on the rest, but if the system wide economy requires hard working, smart people in order to function, and there's not an attitude of either raw capitalism or raw socialism, minus the excesses of planet-altering ecological stupidity -- you might end up where Weber's books predict. That's the reason I got hooked to begin with.

Daryl wrote:
snip

Rich and famous means target for robbery or kidnapping plus papparzi, so they have no privacy and are restricted in what they can do, with body guards and flunkeys always there.

snip

We should have several classes here - the wealthy, the heavy spenders, and the famous. The brightest often try to avoid the latter two classes. If you are not famous, you are much less of a target. Stealth wealth is the aim.

There is a book, "The Millionaire Next Door," by Thomas J. Stanley and William D. Danko that covers their research into US millionaires. The facts often don't fit the images

cthia wrote:Manticoran children are richer than the adults on many planets.

The true measure of Manticoran wealth is in the flaunts of their kids.

My very first car at 16 was a brand spanking new Volvo that I purchased with my own money and many adults were needlessly (IMO) and jealously pissed that a 16-yr-old would be driving a car like that.

They didn't realize that I, on the other hand, hated the car. It looked like a boxy tank! Which was why my parents INSISTED that ALL first cars had to be a Volvo -- take it or leave it. BECAUSE THEY ARE TANKS. Then after a year or two experience you could get what you wanted -- with your own cash. I could afford to buy my OWN car at 16 -- but still had to drive that tank! Only difference, is it was at least a new tank. Unlike my siblings.

What I wanted at 16, was an Alfa Romeo. Or a Porsche 924.

My parents said fine if I wanted to kill myself, driving a fast sports car with the experience of a newly minted teenage driver, but I wasn't going to be killing any of my sisters or cousins who at times would be riding with me.

Parents are supposed to have enough experience to be wiser than even bright kids. Yours qualify

DDHvi wrote:

Daryl wrote:
snip

Rich and famous means target for robbery or kidnapping plus papparzi, so they have no privacy and are restricted in what they can do, with body guards and flunkeys always there.

snip

We should have several classes here - the wealthy, the heavy spenders, and the famous. The brightest often try to avoid the latter two classes. If you are not famous, you are much less of a target. Stealth wealth is the aim.

There is a book, "The Millionaire Next Door," by Thomas J. Stanley and William D. Danko that covers their research into US millionaires. The facts often don't fit the images

"The millionaire next door" A truly fine book. You should all read it. I have retired. I can promise that it works, at least on average.