Honorverse - Snotty Row

Y'all be nice to the snotties. You know what Harkness'll do ta ya!

=====================================================
S.O.S.
For those of us Lost in Translation. Lost in hyper. Lost in n-space. Or just plain lost (like me).
=====================================================

I'm trying to get my bearings right, my mind's astrogator has snot behind his ears and, I'm afraid, related to Elvis Santino.

Ok...

At All Costs...

1) There is the wormhole junction and ACS (Astro Control Service) and JDC (Junction Defense Command). I am assuming that these entities are in relatively close proximity.

2) There is the inner system arrays (Where would they be, using Earth and the Sol system as a prop if you can.)

3) The Inner System Defenses. Where are they, using Earth as a prop. What kinds of defenses? There are no inner system forts are there? The forts are all around the junction.

Where are the Alpha arrays in relation to everything else.

"Ma'am, the Alpha Arrays are reporting—sweet Jesus!"

Now from where does Tourville's force come over the hyper wall in relation to all of this?


****** *


I'd like to thank many of you who have been kind and patient with me for many moons and have filled many holes in my Honorverse star map of understanding. I thank all of you who have pointed me to the many anthologies of which I wasn't aware and even suggested reading order. Crewdude48 comes to mind there. Thank you dude. The most recent being pokermind's post that made me go, "Woe... there really is a lot I have to read." He laid it all out in a nice post. So I decided to check everything off that I have against his post to make sure I have everything, because I'm going to read it all beginning NOW!

"Yaaaaaaaaay!" Thank you very much. I'm proud of me too.

"Finally!" Yep, I agree. But before I go, I wanted to know the above things so that I can take the most understanding with me to this great sofa read-in! Hypering in and out from time to time to drop a post when I can catch a dispatch boat.

Yes, I'm a snotty. I got my rank by a glitch in the system, but I'm going to try and pass the Crusher, so I'm going to cram and read everything that I haven't.

Let this thread be for us snotties... everything we've always wanted to ask but was embarrassed or couldn't form the question in our heads, or didn't know there was a missing question, was afraid of the answer or like myself, all of the above.

So, we welcome and thank all ye tutors. Do it for The Honor of the Queen.

A mind is a terrible thing to waste because then it becomes a terrible thing to taste.

Let the snot run...
There are no wrong questions here, only wrong answers. We all gotta crawl before we can hyper.

Oh! Oh!!... and thanx!!!



Referencing poker's awesome RIF (reading is fundamental) post.
viewtopic.php?f=1&t=7447&start=33

cthia wrote:
[SNIP]

Oh! Oh!!... and thanx!!!



Referencing poker's awesome RIF (reading is fundamental) post.
viewtopic.php?f=1&t=7447&start=33

[SNIP]

Chief, "You're welcome list comes in handy when you try to remember which book a story is in a problem for us old curmudgeons."

Mange, <Beam me up SNOTTY.>

"Let us prey that the next HH Book comes out before:

1) Loosen your tie.
2) Put your head between your knees.
3) Kiss your posterior good bye!

The Yellowstone super volcano may be clearing it's throat:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DF4w7O46-7w

<Gloom and doom, Oooo!>

Poker & Mange

cthia wrote:Y'all be nice to the snotties. You know what Harkness'll do ta ya!

=====================================================
S.O.S.
For those of us Lost in Translation. Lost in hyper. Lost in n-space. Or just plain lost (like me).
=====================================================

I'm trying to get my bearings right, my mind's astrogator has snot behind his ears and, I'm afraid, related to Elvis Santino.

Ok...

At All Costs...

1) There is the wormhole junction and ACS (Astro Control Service) and JDC (Junction Defense Command). I am assuming that these entities are in relatively close proximity.

2) There is the inner system arrays (Where would they be, using Earth and the Sol system as a prop if you can.)

3) The Inner System Defenses. Where are they, using Earth as a prop. What kinds of defenses? There are no inner system forts are there? The forts are all around the junction.

Where are the Alpha arrays in relation to everything else.

"Ma'am, the Alpha Arrays are reporting—sweet Jesus!"

Now from where does Tourville's force come over the hyper wall in relation to all of this?


****** *


I'd like to thank many of you who have been kind and patient with me for many moons and have filled many holes in my Honorverse star map of understanding. I thank all of you who have pointed me to the many anthologies of which I wasn't aware and even suggested reading order. Crewdude48 comes to mind there. Thank you dude. The most recent being pokermind's post that made me go, "Woe... there really is a lot I have to read." He laid it all out in a nice post. So I decided to check everything off that I have against his post to make sure I have everything, because I'm going to read it all beginning NOW!

"Yaaaaaaaaay!" Thank you very much. I'm proud of me too.

"Finally!" Yep, I agree. But before I go, I wanted to know the above things so that I can take the most understanding with me to this great sofa read-in! Hypering in and out from time to time to drop a post when I can catch a dispatch boat.

Yes, I'm a snotty. I got my rank by a glitch in the system, but I'm going to try and pass the Crusher, so I'm going to cram and read everything that I haven't.

Let this thread be for us snotties... everything we've always wanted to ask but was embarrassed or couldn't form the question in our heads, or didn't know there was a missing question, was afraid of the answer or like myself, all of the above.

So, we welcome and thank all ye tutors. Do it for The Honor of the Queen.

A mind is a terrible thing to waste because then it becomes a terrible thing to taste.

Let the snot run...
There are no wrong questions here, only wrong answers. We all gotta crawl before we can hyper.

Oh! Oh!!... and thanx!!!



Referencing poker's awesome RIF (reading is fundamental) post.
viewtopic.php?f=1&t=7447&start=33

1) The ACS is in a Civilian platform with customs controls and the "air traffic controllers"

The JDC is in one (or more) of the forts around the junction.

2) These are immense arrays (1000s of KM on a side) that detect gravitational disturbances a great distance out in normal space. (In Manticore's case, Light months out from the star.) There are multiple arrays and are a great distance from gravitation producing objects so their sensors are not overwhelmed by the strong, close sources. They are useless a normal, shipborne detection ranges. We don't know where they are, but most likely outside of the inner system, yet inside the hyperlimit, and well above or below the ecliptic, and there are multiple arrays so strong gravitational sources (like suns and planets) do not block their detection of the weak sources they are looking for.

3) The planets themselves have defenses. Each planet has several forts (number never mentioned) and now, shoals of pods. In addition, there are CL sized buoys made out of a SD's nodes and a fusion reactor who are placed so that their wedges will overlap like scales to form a protective barrier around the planet they are protecting. The large stations also had bubble sidewalls, ecm and CM capability. During wartime, there may have been minefields and Independent energy platforms deployed. On Manticore's moon, there was a missile base with oversized system defense missiles at the beginning of the series. The Palace on Manticore also has anti-shipping weaponry, but that would be suicide to use them against a large force.

So even if the mobile forces are drawn off, the planets are far from toothless, and Tourville would have had to fight through Sphinx and Manticore's defenses to dictate terms - in addition to watching his back in case the junction sent a portion of their fortresses and LACs (it would take ~45 hours for the Fortresses to 0/0 with Manticore) to remove him from the inner system. So even if Honor didn't show or didn't have Apollo, Tourville still had far to go to win his battle, especially since he was down to <160 effectives (~66% losses) after Kusak was dealt with.

Are the planet's defenses -- forts, pods ... -- inside or outside of the moon's orbit?

When Honor took Fearless out of orbit in OBS and took out Coglin's ship there in orbit with her, I'm trying to get an image of how much stuff she had to immediately avoid.

Edit:
Oops, I guess your answer for #2 fits here.

And thanx Theemile.

I'm still needing input on entering the system via hyper and via junction. Of course, the Peeps didn't come through the junction, but how far was Tourville's fleet away from the junction when hypering in?

Could not the junction target the Peeps with long range ballistic Apollo attacks, or was the distance too great?

cthia wrote:Are the planet's defenses -- forts, pods ... -- inside or outside of the moon's orbit?

When Honor took Fearless out of orbit in OBS and took out Coglin's ship there in orbit with her, I'm trying to get an image of how much stuff she had to immediately avoid.

1n 1900, Basilisk didn't have squat for defenses. The politics just made it impossible for anything to get done in Basilisk in the period between King Roger's death and OBS. That's why the entire defensive squadron for an "owned" planet and 1 wormhole terminus (Defensive commitments #5 and 6 in a Navy with 250 SDs and DNs) had only a CA and an elderly, gutted CL.

Honor's actions in OBS changed that status.

We don't know where the forts are located - no text ex - no Pearls from on high. Chances they are in high orbit (>Geo stationary) since they are self propelled and don't interfere with the story line so far.

cthia wrote:Are the planet's defenses -- forts, pods ... -- inside or outside of the moon's orbit?

It's unstated. But space is BIG, avoiding a collision with anything big enough that you care about it should be pretty simple.

The only example of orbital fortresses discussed I can think of was in "A Whiff of Grapeshot." If you haven't read that you should go buy it from Baen right now.
http://www.baenebooks.com/p-286-more-than-honor.aspx

or for free from here IIRC: http://baencd.thefifthimperium.com/22-M ... onorCD.zip

cthia wrote:I'm still needing input on entering the system via hyper and via junction. Of course, the Peeps didn't come through the junction, but how far was Tourville's fleet away from the junction when hypering in?

Vicinity 12 light hours, which makes it kind of long range.

cthia wrote:I'm still needing input on entering the system via hyper and via junction. Of course, the Peeps didn't come through the junction, but how far was Tourville's fleet away from the junction when hypering in?

Could not the junction target the Peeps with long range ballistic Apollo attacks, or was the distance too great?

I don't remember if the Junction forts has been upgrade to Apollo yet; but even if they has the Junction is roughly 7 lighthours from the hyper limit (can't recall if it's 7 from the star, from Manticore's orbit, or from the hyper limit; so maybe subtract up to 20ish lightminutes from that)

Apollo can hold an FTL firecontrol link for less than 8 lightminutes. Even the longer ranged Hermes comm bouys need a chain of relays to get an FTL message from Manticore to the Junction.


Now eventually at least the inner system will be seeded with Mycroft FTL fire-control relays. Those will allow effective Apollo fire at vastly more than 8 lm. But at the time of the BoM Tourville's fleet was something like 50x beyond the range of any Apollo-controlled missile fired from the Junction.
Edit: also if the missiles went ballistic after their 2nd drive they'd have to coast for around 13 hours before crossing the hyperlimit. Even MDMs aren't designed for that long a high-speed (.54c) coast - the particles would tear them up. Plus the whole battle was long over before they could arrive.

At All Costs

"A good point." She nodded. "But that means the defense pods deployed around Sphinx are going to be coming into range of them, too, and the system reconnaissance platforms are going to give the defense pods very good accuracy."

I don't understand how the recon platforms can affect accuracy. These are not Apollo systems and they are not feeding telemetry to the missiles. The platforms are FTLing telemetry back to the platforms that then have to course correct the missiles but from platform to missiles is FTL free. No?