Honorverse HIGHER Education

cthia wrote:I seem to remember that Katherine was very educated as well, even to have received several degrees as Honor considered in textev. But does it state whether she was self-taught or tutored?

Echoes of Honor: Ch 7 wrote:Katherine grinned.
"I imagine you've heard at least a few people muttering about how 'proper' Grayson women don't work?"
"Well, yes. I have," Allison admitted.
"Well, that's one of the stupider social fables around," Katherine said roundly. "Traditionally, women haven't been paid for working, but believe me, running a Grayson home requires more than someone to bear and raise children. Of course, most of us were never allowed the formal training men got—Benjamin was dreadfully unconventional in that regard—but you try tearing down an air filtration plant, or monitoring the metals levels in the vegetables you're planning on cooking for supper, or managing the reclamation plant, or setting the toxicity alarms in the nursery, or any one of a thousand and one other 'household' chores without at least a practical education in biology, chemistry, hydraulics—!" She snorted with magnificent panache.
"Elaine and I have the degrees that go with what we know; most Grayson women don't have that certification, but that doesn't mean they're ignorant. And, of course, Elaine and I are from the very tip-top of the upper class. We really don't have to work if we don't want to, and most women can at least turn to their families or clans for a household niche to fill even if they never manage to catch a husband, but there have always been some women who've had no option but to support themselves in the workplace.

cthia wrote:Does anyone recall if textev gives the University attended by Shannon Foraker?

Phalanx wrote:

cthia wrote:I imagine that Semmelweis University, the school of medicine that Allison attended, is inundated with applicants all over the galaxy.

A thought occurred to me. I wonder what happened to all of the off-planet students all over the Honorverse after Case Lacoon. Are they stuck? Do they have to withdraw? Wasted semesters? Wasted time? And I thought I had problems with red-tape at Uni.

In the case of students 'stranded' by Case Lacoon, I would imagine that the Diplomatic Corps would make arrangements to transfer Manticoran Nationals either offworld or to the safety of the local embassy.

Those who chose to return home(or were asked to come home by their families) would likely be allowed transfer credits to the Manticoran Higher Institution of their choice.

The students doing studies on Earth would be in the toughest bind politically, given the rise in anti-manticoran sentiment.

Most students I suspect are on worlds like Beowulf, which has always been friendly to Manticore.

Phalanx wrote:

cthia wrote:I imagine that Semmelweis University, the school of medicine that Allison attended, is inundated with applicants all over the galaxy.

A thought occurred to me. I wonder what happened to all of the off-planet students all over the Honorverse after Case Lacoon. Are they stuck? Do they have to withdraw? Wasted semesters? Wasted time? And I thought I had problems with red-tape at Uni.

In the case of students 'stranded' by Case Lacoon, I would imagine that the Diplomatic Corps would make arrangements to transfer Manticoran Nationals either offworld or to the safety of the local embassy.

Those who chose to return home(or were asked to come home by their families) would likely be allowed transfer credits to the Manticoran Higher Institution of their choice.

The students doing studies on Earth would be in the toughest bind politically, given the rise in anti-manticoran sentiment.

Most students I suspect are on worlds like Beowulf, which has always been friendly to Manticore.

saber964 wrote:The Manticoran embassy would likely warn the said students to book passage on manticoran and allied merchants heading out of Sol. If they don't heed the warning after a certain point there on there own. They maybe able to get help from allied embassies like Beowulf Erewhon and Andermani.

Jonathan_S wrote:

cthia wrote:I seem to remember that Katherine was very educated as well, even to have received several degrees as Honor considered in textev. But does it state whether she was self-taught or tutored?

The only text I could find on her, or Elaine's higher education was this snippet.

Echoes of Honor: Ch 7 wrote:Katherine grinned.
"I imagine you've heard at least a few people muttering about how 'proper' Grayson women don't work?"
"Well, yes. I have," Allison admitted.
"Well, that's one of the stupider social fables around," Katherine said roundly. "Traditionally, women haven't been paid for working, but believe me, running a Grayson home requires more than someone to bear and raise children. Of course, most of us were never allowed the formal training men got—Benjamin was dreadfully unconventional in that regard—but you try tearing down an air filtration plant, or monitoring the metals levels in the vegetables you're planning on cooking for supper, or managing the reclamation plant, or setting the toxicity alarms in the nursery, or any one of a thousand and one other 'household' chores without at least a practical education in biology, chemistry, hydraulics—!" She snorted with magnificent panache.
"Elaine and I have the degrees that go with what we know; most Grayson women don't have that certification, but that doesn't mean they're ignorant. And, of course, Elaine and I are from the very tip-top of the upper class. We really don't have to work if we don't want to, and most women can at least turn to their families or clans for a household niche to fill even if they never manage to catch a husband, but there have always been some women who've had no option but to support themselves in the workplace.

But that simply says they each have degrees.

Though a bit before that quote Benjamin does day Katherine "has a better biosciences background" than he does - but that doesn't means she necessarily got a degree in that. Nor does was I able to find anything saying which University Katherine or Elaine's degree were from.

cthia wrote:Just one University for an entire planetary population which also included Masadans seems a stretch.

Weird Harold wrote:

cthia wrote:Just one University for an entire planetary population which also included Masadans seems a stretch.

I think you're confusing the current Protector Benjamin with Benjamin the Great who exiled the Masadans something like 500 years ago. There were no Masadans openly attending Grayson Universities within the story arc of the Honorverse mainline novels.

cthia wrote:I just referred to them as Masadans as a label in verse to reference the addition of that population now exiled. Unless you are implying there was no higher education during those times?

Weird Harold wrote:

cthia wrote:Just one University for an entire planetary population which also included Masadans seems a stretch.

I think you're confusing the current Protector Benjamin with Benjamin the Great who exiled the Masadans something like 500 years ago. There were no Masadans openly attending Grayson Universities within the story arc of the Honorverse mainline novels.

cthia wrote:Same here. Since the only University mentioned on Grayson is Mayhew University, I just assumed. Certainly Grayson women never left planet side. Just one University for an entire planetary population which also included Masadans seems a stretch. And how good could the quality of Grayson education be being pure of foreign professors since first landing? That they fared so well is a testament to Grayson.

The Service of the Sword, Promised Land wrote:Judith had been very young when the raiders took the ship, young, but not too young to remember. There had been explosions, the shrill scream of tearing metal, the insidious tugging of air leaking from a ruptured compartment before someone slapped on a patch.
The battle had been muffled, somehow less than real, made distant by the swaddling vac suit two sizes too big, but the best they'd had intact. It had been muffled, less than real, but that didn't save the child.
Reality came through later, came through with a vengeance.

***Snip***

The ship that had captured theirs had been from Masada. Judith had been too young to understand the difference between pirates and privateers. When she was old enough to know, she was also old enough to know that when it came to Masadans preying on Graysons the distinctions were so much fertilizer.
Her father had been killed helping to defend the ship. Her mother had died trying to defend her child. Judith only wished she could have died with them.

***Snip***

She had a secret, a secret she held onto even as she bit her lip to keep from crying out when her husband used her again and yet again. She held onto it even when she saw the grudging pity in the eyes of her co-wives. She held onto it as she had from the moment she watched her mother bleed her life out onto the deck plates, remembering that brave woman's final warning.
"Never let them know that you can read."

***Snip***

To his fellows, who hated the Graysons with singleminded fanaticism, Judith was presented as a soul redeemed from sin, a vessel who would carry within her womb those who would prove the undoing of their own forbearers. For this reason, Ephraim often took Judith with him when his duties took him away from home. She was a trophy: living, breathing proof that the Masadan struggle to conquer Grayson would not be in vain.
Initially, Judith, then only twelve, had hated these voyages. They forced her into increased intimacy with her husband, for Ephraim didn't bring any other of his wives. However, once Judith realized that during her voyages on Aaron's Rod she was free from observation—for jealous Ephraim kept her locked in the captain's quarters lest she incite unholy lust among his crew—she took advantage of her isolation.

***Snip***

There were exceptions. In the early years of their marriage, Ephraim had taken Dinah on his voyages, and she, like Judith, had striven to learn something about the various departments. Dinah's actual skills were woefully outdated, but at least she understood the concept of three-dimensional astrogation and tactics. Many of the Sisters persisted, no matter how carefully Judith explained, in visualizing their ship as sailing over a flat surface.