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Clyntahn's most disturbing comment to date (SPOILER)

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Re: Clyntahn's most disturbing comment to date (SPOILER)
Post by Bruno Behrends   » Wed Oct 14, 2015 1:27 am

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Upon reading that paragraph I had the same impression as the OP and others in this post.

And then came to the conclusion that Clynthan would have already used any modern tech he had.

But for theory's sake lets speculate.

Maybe he simply knows about the impending return of the Archangels and thus thinks all he has to do is wait. He even would be right in a way.

Or he has info about the Wylson key (or another of its kind) and is planning to get his hands on it.

OR ...

hm - what if he has something which he hasn't used so far because the consequences for himself would be unpleasant?

(Some sort of martyr device? Like: 'place yourself in Schueler's Holy Meditation Cradle. Be warned that you will perish as a person but in return the church will be reborn!' Or: 'Enter the Holy Ascension device. You will leave this world forever but in return you will be able to speak to the Archangels themselves'.)

Heh. That would be cool if he had to 'ascend' to communicate his disaster to his archangelic superiors.
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Re: Clyntahn's most disturbing comment to date (SPOILER)
Post by Expert snuggler   » Thu Oct 15, 2015 1:18 am

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Maybe this ties in with his dawning belief, real belief as opposed to public lies, that he's dealing with actual literal demonic forces. We could imagine something in the Temple labeled "In case of demons break glass". Clyntahn might be afraid to use it for any merely worldly threat because it would have power and not be his slave.

The alternative explanation is that he actually believes in God.
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Re: Clyntahn's most disturbing comment to date (SPOILER)
Post by Dauntless   » Thu Oct 15, 2015 8:42 am

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to some extent the former has to be more likely but it has been evident for the last 4/5 books that clynthan has very dubious connection to reality, so his belief that god and therefore his church MUST win can not be ruled out.
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Re: Clyntahn's most disturbing comment to date (SPOILER)
Post by Louis R   » Thu Oct 15, 2015 12:58 pm

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There's an interesting description for people like Clyntahn that translates [I believe the original is in Arabic] as "Joining partners with God": you decide what God is permitted to do, and He gets on with doing it. It's an occupational hazard for any clergyman, and seems to be particularly pronounced in those who reach positions of great power in religious hierarchies.

Since such people _know_ God's will in any matter, they also know that things will come to pass in the way they envisage. How could it be otherwise? If it appears to be happening otherwise, it must be due to the failings of others, as they have none that matter. As the weak reeds are broken and tossed aside, victory becomes more assured, and so grows their own certainty. Of course, victory has its price, and nothing can be accomplished without sacrifice. That's probably what Clyntahn is expressing here: certainty of ultimate victory and willingness to pay the price of victory when those around him hesitate. He's probably entirely willing to expend himself as well - although I rather doubt that he really anticipates that particular necessity arising.

Dauntless wrote:to some extent the former has to be more likely but it has been evident for the last 4/5 books that clynthan has very dubious connection to reality, so his belief that god and therefore his church MUST win can not be ruled out.
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Re: Clyntahn's most disturbing comment to date (SPOILER)
Post by n7axw   » Thu Oct 15, 2015 2:44 pm

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I think the explamation to the comment is really simple. Clyntahn has always had a strong dash of paranoia along with his megolomania...

As his fear of losing grows, his paronoia grows, weakening his already hesitant grip on reality as well as strengthening his impulse to take control.

Hence the threat.

I find myself thinking Maigwair will personally off him, out of pure self defense. He isn't taking a whole lot of crap from Clyntahn these days. He's actually grown a spine.

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Re: Clyntahn's most disturbing comment to date (SPOILER)
Post by XofDallas   » Thu Oct 15, 2015 3:03 pm

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Time (and another book or two) will tell on this one. To me, though, Clyntahn was talking as if he had access to some info neither Ducharin nor Maguire (sp) was privy to.

If he does, and if the information is couched in some form of religious verbiage, I think it's possible. It might be in the form of "He will come and judge all - including you!"

Would that give Clyntahn pause? Likely.

All this is speculation anyway, but it's never too soon to start! ;)
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Re: Clyntahn's most disturbing comment to date (SPOILER)
Post by Dilandu   » Thu Oct 15, 2015 4:11 pm

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Must admit that i haven't read the book (yet), but could suggest some explanation. Clyntahn may have acsess to some "divine power", but hesitate to use that. Because declaring that "my will is the will of God" is the one thing; to be the one who directly contacted with the will of God is completely another. With all the self-deception capabilites of Clyntahn, even he should hesitate to make such direct contacn with the supernatural powers, over whom he would have no control and whom he would not be able to deceive.
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Re: Clyntahn's most disturbing comment to date (SPOILER)
Post by pokermind   » Fri Oct 16, 2015 5:12 am

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Or his cruelty as in the case of Stephanie [I have Audio book don't know the written form's spelling] causes a revolt. People can take only so much and they break and don't care if they live or die. Revolts of the people combined with mutiny in the army could cause the fall of Clyntahn and lead to a negotiated end of the war.

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Re: Clyntahn's most disturbing comment to date (SPOILER)
Post by wrlee1966   » Sat Oct 17, 2015 12:21 pm

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ayg wrote:Or it's another sign that he's gone completely insane.

XofDallas wrote:Sounds like Clyntahn may have access to some tech, as Grand Inquisitor, that no one else knows about. Scary, scary stuff, if true....


Could be taken as he may have control of the bombardment plate forms. But I don't think that is it. in the context of what they were talking about I think Clyntahn's is talking about removing his perceived enemies and taking soul control of Mother Church and all her armies and so on. And with out the Treasure and General he will surely loose. I think his hints that there maybe some kind of suspended Archangel is more troubling. and I bet if it is an archangel it is Chihiro. We have discovered from HFQ some new info which make me think that. Could be Schueler or both. We will just have to see where this all goes and I hope it wont be a year for the next book. And I am sad he has not written anything new of Honor. oh well Just waiting willhave to do I guess :)
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Re: Clyntahn's most disturbing comment to date (SPOILER)
Post by LadyWhirlwind   » Sat Oct 17, 2015 6:08 pm

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Unless of course, Clyntahn has access to the bombardment platforms, but has no way to activate on his whim. What ever the Archangel were, they were determined to assure mankinds survival. They would have made sure, that no one could accidently wipe out mankind with those bombardment platforms. If they left the church a way to activate it, they would have stipulated strong rules on their use. Probably protected by an AI that actually verifys if the usage is justified. Or it would actually require the Grand Vicar to confirm the activation. Not even Clynthahn is mad enough to try to use them, without having met the requirements. I'm quite sure that there is somewhere a rule that says: Anyone who tries to use them unjustified is going to die a very horrible death.
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