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The Temple and Merlin

This fascinating series is a combination of historical seafaring, swashbuckling adventure, and high technological science-fiction. Join us in a discussion!
The Temple and Merlin
Post by schoeffelk   » Wed Oct 07, 2015 8:28 am

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We know the ending will be the defeat and eventual collapse of the CoGA. The EoC army marches into Zion and enters the Temple. The 'one' person who can't enter is Merlin and his SNARCs as he's worried that may awake what's under the Temple.

Is there a solution?

Think of this like a starving person who has a plate of aromatic food placed in front of them and they know they can't touch it. Even those of the Inner Council can't enter without leaving their technology outside.

Frustration!!!!!
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Re: The Temple and Merlin
Post by Weird Harold   » Wed Oct 07, 2015 8:43 am

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schoeffelk wrote:Is there a solution?


Once Pater Wylsynn activates the 'whatever' the Key of Shueler fits, he will have control of the Temple Systems and OBS and can turn off any defenses that would react to Merlin.

Problem solved. :lol:
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Answers! I got lots of answers!

(Now if I could just find the right questions.)
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Re: The Temple and Merlin
Post by Dilandu   » Wed Oct 07, 2015 11:36 am

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Weird Harold wrote:
schoeffelk wrote:Is there a solution?


Once Pater Wylsynn activates the 'whatever' the Key of Shueler fits, he will have control of the Temple Systems and OBS and can turn off any defenses that would react to Merlin.

Problem solved. :lol:


Or something other would happen. We didn't knew, what exactly is under the Temple, and what level of control is here. The Key may pretty much activate some sort of stored personality in the computers that would evaluate the situation and then react accordingly.
------------------------------

Oh well, if shortening the front is what the Germans crave,
Let's shorten it to very end - the length of Fuhrer's grave.

(Red Army lyrics from 1945)
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Re: The Temple and Merlin
Post by n7axw   » Wed Oct 07, 2015 3:34 pm

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Weird Harold wrote:
schoeffelk wrote:Is there a solution?


Once Pater Wylsynn activates the 'whatever' the Key of Shueler fits, he will have control of the Temple Systems and OBS and can turn off any defenses that would react to Merlin.

Problem solved. :lol:


We really don't know whether its problem solved or made worse. When that key is inserted and those executables start to come active, it could make Pandora's box look pretty tame. Father Paityr may well not be in control of anything.

Don
When any group seeks political power in God's name, both religion and politics are instantly corrupted.
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Re: The Temple and Merlin
Post by Undercover Fat Kid   » Wed Oct 07, 2015 4:24 pm

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Whoever activates it will almost certainly not be in control of anything, beyond possibly describing the situation to whatever personality or AI gets activated.

My thought for a long time has been that, if a victorious EOC, having decisively thrown the temple down, has an envoy activate the system, the controlling personality will have no real choice but to aid and abet them. My reasoning is that, by that point, the beginnings of innovation and industry will have progressed to the point where it simply isn't an option to scour it away the way it was in the beginning, because trying to do so will require either too many casualties, or too much damage to the planet, or more resources than are available. That being true, it's only a matter of time before scientific progression will lead humanity back into space, even if that progression has to wait until the AI or whatever is rendered impotent. It follows then, in light of the failure of the Langhorne plan, which was shuddering toward collapse due to corruption long before the intervention of Merlin et al, that the next most logical course is to ensure that when the fated rematch commences, it does so with a forewarned, prepared humanity ready chew bubble gum and kick butt. By the way, the bubble gum recipe didn't work out well in the Safeholdian biome....

At the end of the day, everybody in Project Arc wanted the same thing; peace and continued survival for humanity. Since crawling into a hole and pulling the hole in after themselves isn't working out, it may simply be necessary to utter the old adage, "Si vis pacem, para bellum"
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Death is as a feather,
Duty is as a mountain
This life is a dream
From which we all
Must wake
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Re: The Temple and Merlin
Post by Expert snuggler   » Wed Oct 07, 2015 8:08 pm

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Whoever gets to brief the Thing Under the Temple will have a lot of power as a result. Where would the TUTT get independent information?
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Re: The Temple and Merlin
Post by JeffEngel   » Wed Oct 07, 2015 8:36 pm

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Expert snuggler wrote:Whoever gets to brief the Thing Under the Temple will have a lot of power as a result. Where would the TUTT get independent information?

Owl gets a lot through SNARC's. The creators of the new Temple didn't have precisely the same goals, skill sets, or resources as the Peis did setting up the Cave and its genus loci, but the tech base was comparable and they had a freer hand to use all they had. So recon drones of gratuitous stealth and teeny-tiny size and satellites (that are part of the OBS, or at least ignored by it, rather than avoiding it) are plausible, along with bugs throughout Zion with feed for centuries to review.
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Re: The Temple and Merlin
Post by n7axw   » Wed Oct 07, 2015 9:12 pm

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JeffEngel wrote:
Expert snuggler wrote:Whoever gets to brief the Thing Under the Temple will have a lot of power as a result. Where would the TUTT get independent information?

Owl gets a lot through SNARC's. The creators of the new Temple didn't have precisely the same goals, skill sets, or resources as the Peis did setting up the Cave and its genus loci, but the tech base was comparable and they had a freer hand to use all they had. So recon drones of gratuitous stealth and teeny-tiny size and satellites (that are part of the OBS, or at least ignored by it, rather than avoiding it) are plausible, along with bugs throughout Zion with feed for centuries to review.


If we are talking about recorded personalities, I don't see them as being very rational or happy when their will is thwarted. I rather doubt that their reaction is going to be very pleasant, esp. for the good guys.

Don
When any group seeks political power in God's name, both religion and politics are instantly corrupted.
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Re: The Temple and Merlin
Post by Bluestrike2   » Wed Oct 07, 2015 11:57 pm

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Undercover Fat Kid wrote:Whoever activates it will almost certainly not be in control of anything, beyond possibly describing the situation to whatever personality or AI gets activated.

My thought for a long time has been that, if a victorious EOC, having decisively thrown the temple down, has an envoy activate the system, the controlling personality will have no real choice but to aid and abet them. My reasoning is that, by that point, the beginnings of innovation and industry will have progressed to the point where it simply isn't an option to scour it away the way it was in the beginning, because trying to do so will require either too many casualties, or too much damage to the planet, or more resources than are available. That being true, it's only a matter of time before scientific progression will lead humanity back into space, even if that progression has to wait until the AI or whatever is rendered impotent. It follows then, in light of the failure of the Langhorne plan, which was shuddering toward collapse due to corruption long before the intervention of Merlin et al, that the next most logical course is to ensure that when the fated rematch commences, it does so with a forewarned, prepared humanity ready chew bubble gum and kick butt. By the way, the bubble gum recipe didn't work out well in the Safeholdian biome....

At the end of the day, everybody in Project Arc wanted the same thing; peace and continued survival for humanity. Since crawling into a hole and pulling the hole in after themselves isn't working out, it may simply be necessary to utter the old adage, "Si vis pacem, para bellum"


For rational beings? That makes sense. But we're not very rational even in the best of circumstances. RFC has repeatedly pointed out how living under the threat of the Gbaba warped humanity. Whatever canned personality gets awakened was shaped by that reality. And then they went from that traumatic nightmare of an existence and went to Safehold where they chose to become part of a twisted system that set themselves up as a gods--excuse me, "Archangels"--amongst men. They spent centuries living that life where they were worshipped as divine beings. Even for a normal person, untainted by the knowledge that they and the entire human race was going to be exterminated, living that sort of life would twist them to the point where they readily believed in the image of themselves that was worshipped. If I recall correctly, I think Pei's message for Nimue touched on the idea that they started to believe their own tripe.

Langhorne and his ilk thought that humanity and its pursuit of technological growth was to blame for how things worked out with the Gbaba. That's a pretty perverse sort of victim blaming, and it does'n't lend well to just accepting a revision in the plan for Safehold that'd open the door to the same thing. We don't know just how much whatever virtual personality is under the table agrees with that line of thought, but it's safe to assume that some sort of overlap is likely.

So no, they aren't going to see it as a plan to avoid the Gbaba falling apart. They're going to see it as their divine will and their life's work being thwarted by some bastards living on an island.
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Re: The Temple and Merlin
Post by Dilandu   » Thu Oct 08, 2015 12:07 am

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n7axw wrote:If we are talking about recorded personalities, I don't see them as being very rational or happy when their will is thwarted. I rather doubt that their reaction is going to be very pleasant, esp. for the good guys.

Don


Well, i think SOME of them may agree with rational explanation, that experiment on Safehold was a proven faliure even before Merlin appeared.
------------------------------

Oh well, if shortening the front is what the Germans crave,
Let's shorten it to very end - the length of Fuhrer's grave.

(Red Army lyrics from 1945)
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