Pronouncing Sharleyan?

Knowing RFC's sneakiness, I believe the pronunciation is Sharon

As in Sharon Tate, erm, Sharleyan Tayt

Roman and Polanski are already on the board of directors, albeit in a different universe.

Tenshinai wrote:

MTO wrote:I always thought it was "Charlene", but in a recent thread, it was suggested it was "Shirley Anne". Discuss!

Charlene should be Sharleen, and since language drift tends towards simpler, Charlene by itself at least is unlikely to be the source...

And you can´t get "Shir" from Shar without butchering pronounciation so badly the language will run and hide for ever and ever at the atrocity visited upon it.

heh. I read "Sharley" as "Charley", which seemed like a reasonable shortening of Charlene to me.

Charlie is used as a nickname for Charlene, compound the two and you could at least in theory end up with something like Sharleyan...
Even if it´s more than a little far out.

Charlie Ann(e) to get the whole. Or the latter part could be Lee-Ann(e) or some variation on that.

The origin could also be non-English, in which case the beginning might be "Char", "Skar/Skär", "Zha", "Cha", "Schar" and any number of others, those were just a few i could come with from languages i know.


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For 'Sharleyan', I go "shar lay ann"

That´s how i expect it should be pronounced.

emeye wrote:Knowing RFC's sneakiness, I believe the pronunciation is Sharon

As in Sharon Tate, erm, Sharleyan Tayt

Roman and Polanski are already on the board of directors, albeit in a different universe.

If that was true, someone needs to learn either spelling or pronounciation. Beacuse getting that to "Sharon" is just outrageously far beyond realistic, not to mention 100% opposite to what would be normal for language drift(which tends to be very predictable).

Hi Teshinai,


I agree, plain and simple, it's Sharleyan.

Her mother's nick name for her is Sharley, which she gets to do since she named her, and its probably a diminutive of Sharleyann or even Sharleyanne, with Charlene etc absurd.

'nuff said.

L

Tenshinai wrote:

emeye wrote:Knowing RFC's sneakiness, I believe the pronunciation is Sharon

As in Sharon Tate, erm, Sharleyan Tayt

Roman and Polanski are already on the board of directors, albeit in a different universe.

If that was true, someone needs to learn either spelling or pronounciation. Beacuse getting that to "Sharon" is just outrageously far beyond realistic, not to mention 100% opposite to what would be normal for language drift(which tends to be very predictable).

Tenshinai wrote:

emeye wrote:Knowing RFC's sneakiness, I believe the pronunciation is Sharon

As in Sharon Tate, erm, Sharleyan Tayt

Roman and Polanski are already on the board of directors, albeit in a different universe.

If that was true, someone needs to learn either spelling or pronounciation. Beacuse getting that to "Sharon" is just outrageously far beyond realistic, not to mention 100% opposite to what would be normal for language drift(which tends to be very predictable).

The fact that it is not akin to natural language drift is not a compelling argument. Most of the language drift evident in the Safehold books does not match natural language drift in the real world. And there have been quite a few which appear to be quite outrageously far beyond realistic. David is not a linguist, does not pretend to be, and is not writing the books from a linguistic perspective. He's even admitted that the alternative spellings were a mistake.

JeffEngel wrote:

jgnfld wrote:Speaking of language drift which is often in the "lazy" direction, mentally I have migrated from "Sharley Anne" to "Sharlayne" which is easier to pronounce over the series. Probably not "correct" but who really knows?!

There are a lot of names on Safehold I barely try to pronounce even in my head, much less aloud. It can make for difficult reading. For 'Sharleyan', I go "shar lay ann", with little or no particular emphasis and no regard as a rule for what it may have originated as.

Women's names in 20th and 21st century in the U.S. at least tend to come from a huge existing pool, to steal names from the male pool, and to get pulled out of thin air by parents. If that trend continued even as one thread among many in the Terran Federation (much less Safehold later), 'Sharleyan' may well have no ancestor we'd recognize anyway, or to have such a convoluted history ("Yeah, goes back to 'Margaret'... funny story....") that is may as well have been pulled out of thin air.

I agree with the Vice Admiral and not because I am bucking for a promotion.

The whole issue of drift... the hand full of w's, y's and h's and I also barely try to pronounce most of the names but... that said I lean towards Shirley Ann.
I expect you all noticed Norman Bates (as in Psycho) and the baseball pitcher John Smoltz. I also have a tendency to think of Jasper Clinton and Peter Wilson, but off the top of my head, can think of no other significant observations on the subject.

Charlie

I like trying to figure out the names...

It gives me something to do!

In the beginning of the series (I think I am remembering correctly), it was stated that while spelling of words was the same, the pronunciation had changed and, in some areas, had become a different dialect. Not sure, but I think Safehold names are meant to be pronounced as spelled. I also think that the "Safeholdian accent" is a cross between American Deep-South English and possibly(?) British English.
My aunt in Georgia has a son named Hal. Her pronunciation is "Haiyaaaul". The "ai" is pronounced like a long "i", the "y" is pronounced "yuh"; and then you have a long, drawn-out "aaaau" (the au is a diphthong) finally ending with an L sound. So. I think that Sharleyan is Charlene. Plus, I like trying to work out different pronunciations for the names and then figuring their present day equivalents. I find it fun and it adds an extra dimension to the reading experience. Yes? No? I dunno.

Appalachiacat wrote:

I also think that the "Safeholdian accent" is a cross between American Deep-South English and possibly(?) British English. My aunt in Georgia has a son named Hal. Her pronunciation is "Haiyaaaul". The "ai" is pronounced like a long "i", the "y" is pronounced "yuh"; and then you have a long, drawn-out "aaaau" (the au is a diphthong) finally ending with an L sound.

You remind me of a conversation I had with my grandmother. Mom had sent me over to borrow an iron. I said, "Grandma, can Mom borrow your iron?"

"Iron? What's that?" she asked.

"It's a flat thing that you get hot and you use it to get wrinkles out of clothes." I answered.

"Oh! You mean a ahrn."

"Yes," I explained.

~Tonto

Language drift always goes to simpler is clearly implausible, as it leads to a state where all words vanish.There is an obvious contrary trend in early 19th century America leading to splendiferous enhancements of grandiloquent phrasing.

Tenshinai wrote:

MTO wrote:I always thought it was "Charlene", but in a recent thread, it was suggested it was "Shirley Anne". Discuss!

Charlene should be Sharleen, and since language drift tends towards simpler, Charlene by itself at least is unlikely to be the source...

And you can´t get "Shir" from Shar without butchering pronounciation so badly the language will run and hide for ever and ever at the atrocity visited upon it.

heh. I read "Sharley" as "Charley", which seemed like a reasonable shortening of Charlene to me.

Charlie is used as a nickname for Charlene, compound the two and you could at least in theory end up with something like Sharleyan...
Even if it´s more than a little far out.

Charlie Ann(e) to get the whole. Or the latter part could be Lee-Ann(e) or some variation on that.

The origin could also be non-English, in which case the beginning might be "Char", "Skar/Skär", "Zha", "Cha", "Schar" and any number of others, those were just a few i could come with from languages i know.


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For 'Sharleyan', I go "shar lay ann"

That´s how i expect it should be pronounced.

Shahr LAY in