HFQ Official Snippet #26 (I think)

lyonheart wrote:SNIP

I also wonder if OWL and Nahrmahn might or could use the evident holographic projector capabilities to send false semaphore messages of assurance etc.

SNIP

This is so fiendishly clever I'm proposing Lyonheart for the Totally Unexpected Weapon of the Book Award. Here the rest of us have been thinking obvious things like scout/snipers or mobile infantry going ahead to handle the semaphore problem and Lyonheart surprises all with this brilliant innovation!!
Protocol for winning the TUWB calls for the recipient to buy a virtual round so let's head for the club to raise our glasses to the recipient. Way to go L!














weapon of the Book

EdThomas wrote:

lyonheart wrote:SNIP

I also wonder if OWL and Nahrmahn might or could use the evident holographic projector capabilities to send false semaphore messages of assurance etc.

SNIP

This is so fiendishly clever I'm proposing Lyonheart for the Totally Unexpected Weapon of the Book Award. Here the rest of us have been thinking obvious things like scout/snipers or mobile infantry going ahead to handle the semaphore problem and Lyonheart surprises all with this brilliant innovation!!
Protocol for winning the TUWB calls for the recipient to buy a virtual round so let's head for the club to raise our glasses to the recipient. Way to go L!

Seconded, this is such a brilliant idea!

BTW, if Charis had some infantry regiments "in the know", perhaps they could use projectors to make an army seem bigger than it is? Although this wouldn't hold for long if the enemy actually attacked...

EdThomas wrote:

This is so fiendishly clever I'm proposing Lyonheart for the Totally Unexpected Weapon of the Book Award.

I don't mean to be a wet blanket, but I don't think it would work. The Church of God Awaiting has been using codes, pass phrases, and cyphers for so long, that I very much doubt that an enemy can duplicate the necessary encoded message to convince the recipients that it's genuine.

~Tonto

Tonto Silerheels wrote:EdThomas wrote:

This is so fiendishly clever I'm proposing Lyonheart for the Totally Unexpected Weapon of the Book Award.

I don't mean to be a wet blanket, but I don't think it would work. The Church of God Awaiting has been using codes, pass phrases, and cyphers for so long, that I very much doubt that an enemy can duplicate the necessary encoded message to convince the recipients that it's genuine.

~Tonto

Ya know, you may be right. But we are so snippet-deprived, and we know how Nahrmann responds to a challenge and it is a fiendishly clever idea and it gives us something to argue about with no idea whatsoever of the computer power required for hologram projection or of the limits of Owl's abilities to project said power and this may be the longest sentence I've ever written. Also, I may look for a Dickens course this fall.

Hi Ed Thomas,

Thank you very much for your kind complements.

I'd claim it was something I'd thought a lot about, but it wasn't.

I'm not sure I could even claim to be the first with this idea, RFC may have addressed why it won't work already, but I'm not sure.

From what we know of the holographic projector, which the cave has several if not many for the SNARC's not just Merlin's etc, and can make more at need; is that it can blur what is seen so it isn't recognizable anymore, but counter-wise it ought to be able to show the observer reading the next semaphore's billboard the code groups [which at up to ten miles, is pretty amazing in the first place for 18-19th century telescopes] assuring all is well or why there was a delay due to some common accident or personnel quirk etc.

Given the SNARC sensors' capabilities, I doubt there's a Go4 code left that OWL hasn't 'broken' a while back [by simply copying the codes from the other end] and Nahrmahn has subjectively learned all that's available in the library about the history and methods of security versus espionage etc [maintaining cover stories], especially the psychology and other means of keeping the victim unaware and thinking what he's supposed to, since it was one of his hobbies when he was alive, while the SNARC sensors could easily provide the expected normal messages that would keep Wyrshym ignorant of what's really happening until its too late.

There are limits to all things, but between OWL, Nahrmahn and the scout snipers, Nybar and Wyrshym could be kept uninformed for quite some time, in part simply because they wouldn't believe the truth until they see it themselves.

L

EdThomas wrote:

lyonheart wrote:SNIP

I also wonder if OWL and Nahrmahn might or could use the evident holographic projector capabilities to send false semaphore messages of assurance etc.

SNIP

This is so fiendishly clever I'm proposing Lyonheart for the Totally Unexpected Weapon of the Book Award. Here the rest of us have been thinking obvious things like scout/snipers or mobile infantry going ahead to handle the semaphore problem and Lyonheart surprises all with this brilliant innovation!!
Protocol for winning the TUWB calls for the recipient to buy a virtual round so let's head for the club to raise our glasses to the recipient. Way to go L!














weapon of the Book

Hi Tonto Silverheels,

I understand your concern.

However, since the only gap in OWL's coverage is the temple, and any message out requires a code book at the other end that OWL can read, I suspect all Go4 codes outside those used solely in the temple [probably darn few official ones] to have been compromised and so available to Nahrmahn, Owl and the inner circle at need.

Given the various ways the human operator element can ruin or subvert the most 'unbreakable codes' by taking short cuts if not selling what they know, I suspect many if not most Go4 codes haven't been secure for some time to the major nation states etc.

If OWL or Nahrmahn needed any help, and I'm not sure they do; I'm quite sure Nynian and the SSK could provide the code books, NTM messages, from centuries of their successful penetration of the temple.

L

Tonto Silerheels wrote:EdThomas wrote:

This is so fiendishly clever I'm proposing Lyonheart for the Totally Unexpected Weapon of the Book Award.

I don't mean to be a wet blanket, but I don't think it would work. The Church of God Awaiting has been using codes, pass phrases, and cyphers for so long, that I very much doubt that an enemy can duplicate the necessary encoded message to convince the recipients that it's genuine.

~Tonto

I'd say that you're quite correct about what David Kahn referred to as 'practical cryptanalysis' of church codes by OWL and Nahrmahn since the war started. Even Nahrmahn, however, would have made the amourous porcupines look like daredevils when it came to reading the Church's mail before that. Kings and Emperors can always be 'killed resisting arrest' if the Church decides that a big showy trial isn't feasible this time around.

What has me scratching my head, though, is why? It's so trivially easy to capture a real station intact and put real operators into it with a real 'stolen' or 'captured', or, as far as that goes, a really truly stolen or captured, code book to send your fake messages. And this way there's no risk of scaring the pants off any of your own troops who happen to look over their shoulders - or, much worse, start them wondering about misplaced allegiances.

lyonheart wrote:Hi Tonto Silverheels,

I understand your concern.

However, since the only gap in OWL's coverage is the temple, and any message out requires a code book at the other end that OWL can read, I suspect all Go4 codes outside those used solely in the temple [probably darn few official ones] to have been compromised and so available to Nahrmahn, Owl and the inner circle at need.

Given the various ways the human operator element can ruin or subvert the most 'unbreakable codes' by taking short cuts if not selling what they know, I suspect many if not most Go4 codes haven't been secure for some time to the major nation states etc.

If OWL or Nahrmahn needed any help, and I'm not sure they do; I'm quite sure Nynian and the SSK could provide the code books, NTM messages, from centuries of their successful penetration of the temple.

L

Tonto Silerheels wrote:EdThomas wrote:

This is so fiendishly clever I'm proposing Lyonheart for the Totally Unexpected Weapon of the Book Award.

I don't mean to be a wet blanket, but I don't think it would work. The Church of God Awaiting has been using codes, pass phrases, and cyphers for so long, that I very much doubt that an enemy can duplicate the necessary encoded message to convince the recipients that it's genuine.

~Tonto

Louis R wrote:I'd say that you're quite correct about what David Kahn referred to as 'practical cryptanalysis' of church codes by OWL and Nahrmahn since the war started. Even Nahrmahn, however, would have made the amourous porcupines look like daredevils when it came to reading the Church's mail before that. Kings and Emperors can always be 'killed resisting arrest' if the Church decides that a big showy trial isn't feasible this time around.

What has me scratching my head, though, is why? It's so trivially easy to capture a real station intact and put real operators into it with a real 'stolen' or 'captured', or, as far as that goes, a really truly stolen or captured, code book to send your fake messages. And this way there's no risk of scaring the pants off any of your own troops who happen to look over their shoulders - or, much worse, start them wondering about misplaced allegiances.

As I understand it, messages are encrypted at the source and decrypted at the destination. Semaphore operators NEVER know the contents of the messages they're transmitting because the text they're transmitting is encrypted. To them, it's meaningless gibberish that has to be retransmitted EXACTLY as they received it.

And yes, OWL can't get SNARCs into the Temple... which isn't required for reading the Temple's incoming and outgoing mail, because the SNARCs can read the unencrytped versions over the shoulders of whoever is corresponding with the Temple. And then read their codebooks. Given SNARC capabilities, there's not much difference between reading the encoded message en route and the decrypted versions at their source/destination.

Sure OWL can't read the Temple's purely internal mail, but then again, he can't get access to that mail anyway.

Not invariably true. When there's no common cryptosystem between originator and one or more addressee one of the transmitting stations is going to have to break and reencrypt the message. Even if it's just a matter of different addressees not having a common system, it won't be unusual for the originating station to let somebody else do the work of preparing the multiple copies required. You have no idea how lazy operators can get if they know someone else will be carrying the can.

You're right that line relay stations like the ones between Fairkyn and St Zhana won't have codes unless they're also local delivery points, but the relays at major route junctions likely will have a set. [How complete will depend on how big they are and how concerned the administrators of the system are about genuine cryptosecurity, as opposed to simple privacy. If it was me, no station would have anything that wasn't in regular use there. Rare, low-traffic or high-sensitivity systems would be up to the end users to supply where needed.] In any case, the reason substitute operators would need them is precisely so they could fake the traffic they're pretending to forward.

evilauthor wrote:

Louis R wrote:I'd say that you're quite correct about what David Kahn referred to as 'practical cryptanalysis' of church codes by OWL and Nahrmahn since the war started. Even Nahrmahn, however, would have made the amourous porcupines look like daredevils when it came to reading the Church's mail before that. Kings and Emperors can always be 'killed resisting arrest' if the Church decides that a big showy trial isn't feasible this time around.

What has me scratching my head, though, is why? It's so trivially easy to capture a real station intact and put real operators into it with a real 'stolen' or 'captured', or, as far as that goes, a really truly stolen or captured, code book to send your fake messages. And this way there's no risk of scaring the pants off any of your own troops who happen to look over their shoulders - or, much worse, start them wondering about misplaced allegiances.

As I understand it, messages are encrypted at the source and decrypted at the destination. Semaphore operators NEVER know the contents of the messages they're transmitting because the text they're transmitting is encrypted. To them, it's meaningless gibberish that has to be retransmitted EXACTLY as they received it.

And yes, OWL can't get SNARCs into the Temple... which isn't required for reading the Temple's incoming and outgoing mail, because the SNARCs can read the unencrytped versions over the shoulders of whoever is corresponding with the Temple. And then read their codebooks. Given SNARC capabilities, there's not much difference between reading the encoded message en route and the decrypted versions at their source/destination.

Sure OWL can't read the Temple's purely internal mail, but then again, he can't get access to that mail anyway.

Leaving the world of codes for a moment.
How does a holographic projector work? Please restrict answers to words with no more than eight syllables.
Thanks