Relative size of combatants

PeterZ wrote:...snipped...
I seem to recall spells can be carried through a portal and be activated once past the barrier. Why haven't such weapons been produced? Why was that idiot Thalmayr so oblivious to the possibility that something could be hurled through the portal and "detonated/activated" once past the portal?

There are just too many gaps between the observed responses of the Arcanan military and what appears to be possible. That suggests that there are limits to how magic can be applied to both everyday activities and fighting war.

PeterZ wrote:

brnicholas wrote:True.

The question though is going to be power. For all the weakness of the weapons we have seen the hover spell used for Dragon pods and slider cars, which Gadrial described as "inefficient" shocks me. It keeps 50-60 tons floating against the force of gravity for hours and hours! They may be cheating somehow rather then using raw power to do that but the power output is really impressive. In light of that power output I am very cautious about assuming limits.

Nicholas

Yet the power output of the demolition spell was orders of magnitude lower. The force might have been big but the time to deliver that force was not as short as a dynamite explosion. The lack of sound suggests as much. That spells haven't been used to hurl objects at targets rather than using stored muscle power also suggests power limits.

That suggests to me that magic is more a function of changing physical fields rather than applying brute force to overcome gravity and the like.

Fireballs excite the molecules sufficiently to burn combustibles in the area of effect. Lightning bolts direct massive amounts of electrons in the area of effect along a prescribed path. The actual energy involved is great, but the power is not so great as it first seems. When it comes to using pure power to effect physical results, the amount we have seen appears to be more limited.

It follows then that the primary advantage of the arcane is to alter the physical laws in a limited area and for a limited duration. Viewing magic in this light is more consistent with what we have already observed than seeing it as some sort of universal energy source used to overcome the immutable laws of physics.

brnicholas wrote:

SCC wrote:Um, what? Slider cars can carry a quarter the weight of TTE transport cars

Yes, Slider cars carry a quarter of the weight of TTE transport cars. Per the second chapter of RTH the heavy lift TTE transport cars carry 220 tons. One quarter is 50-60 tons.

Per snippet 4 a dragon can carry 25 tons on a short hop and the Dragon pods with levitation spells let them carry twice that, so 50 tons.

Either way you get levitation spells that support 50 tons for hours.

Nicholas

brnicholas wrote:One limitation to magic that has always struck me as very likely is that I don't think they can delay the activation of a spell. A spell can be on or it can be stored in an accumulator where it can be set to activate when a button is pressed. But, I don't think a spell can be set to activate 5 seconds after a button is pressed.

Delayed activation is the only part of a hand grenade we don't see in the books and hand grenades are so obviously useful in so many different situations that I can't image they have never occurred to any Arcanan in the last few centuries.

Nicholas

PeterZ wrote:...snipped...
I seem to recall spells can be carried through a portal and be activated once past the barrier. Why haven't such weapons been produced? Why was that idiot Thalmayr so oblivious to the possibility that something could be hurled through the portal and "detonated/activated" once past the portal?

There are just too many gaps between the observed responses of the Arcanan military and what appears to be possible. That suggests that there are limits to how magic can be applied to both everyday activities and fighting war.

PeterZ wrote:
{snip} why haven't longer ranged weapons been developed for infantry? Is this some inherent limit on magic or spells? Is this a limit imposed by a mindset reliant on magic?

I seem to recall spells can be carried through a portal and be activated once past the barrier. Why haven't such weapons been produced? Why was that idiot Thalmayr so oblivious to the possibility that something could be hurled through the portal and "detonated/activated" once past the portal?

There are just too many gaps between the observed responses of the Arcanan military and what appears to be possible. That suggests that there are limits to how magic can be applied to both everyday activities and fighting war.

Howard T. Map-addict wrote:The Arcanan Military has not been in an arms race
for almost two centuries. They have not needed to
improve their weapons for most of that time.

The Treaty Of Union has worked!
It has given Arcana two centuries of Peace.
That despite Mythalan insanity, which still exists.

Therefore the Arcanan Military has become decadent.
Their weapons are "less than they might be."
Their officers are "less than they might be" too.
The politicians who control the Military do not need
to make it more battleworthy than it was two centuries
ago, and so they don't.

Meanwhile, on Sharona, the Uromathans are regularly
trying to defeat Ternath, and take over the world.
The Ternathians are just as regularly preparing to
stop them. And the Arpathians are habitually preparing
to resist either or both of them.
Sharona is prepared for war.

HTM

PeterZ wrote:I can see some of this applying, but not all of it.

The key factor is Mythal. They are acting as if they are at war with their Union partners. So far they are playing politics, but politics of a brutal sort. They have long ranged plans to subvert the Andran hierarchy. That is not something that Mythal would do unless they prepared for potential hostilities as a possible consequence. That would indicate some research into magical warfare on Mythal's part.

Howard T. Map-addict wrote:The Arcanan Military has not been in an arms race
for almost two centuries. They have not needed to
improve their weapons for most of that time.

The Treaty Of Union has worked!
It has given Arcana two centuries of Peace.
That despite Mythalan insanity, which still exists.

Therefore the Arcanan Military has become decadent.
Their weapons are "less than they might be."
Their officers are "less than they might be" too.
The politicians who control the Military do not need
to make it more battleworthy than it was two centuries
ago, and so they don't.

Meanwhile, on Sharona, the Uromathans are regularly
trying to defeat Ternath, and take over the world.
The Ternathians are just as regularly preparing to
stop them. And the Arpathians are habitually preparing
to resist either or both of them.
Sharona is prepared for war.

HTM

PeterZ wrote:I can see some of this applying, but not all of it.

The key factor is Mythal. They are acting as if they are at war with their Union partners. So far they are playing politics, but politics of a brutal sort. They have long ranged plans to subvert the Andran hierarchy. That is not something that Mythal would do unless they prepared for potential hostilities as a possible consequence. That would indicate some research into magical warfare on Mythal's part.

Howard T. Map-addict wrote:The Arcanan Military has not been in an arms race
for almost two centuries. They have not needed to
improve their weapons for most of that time.

The Treaty Of Union has worked!
It has given Arcana two centuries of Peace.
That despite Mythalan insanity, which still exists.

Therefore the Arcanan Military has become decadent.
Their weapons are "less than they might be."
Their officers are "less than they might be" too.
The politicians who control the Military do not need
to make it more battleworthy than it was two centuries
ago, and so they don't.

Meanwhile, on Sharona, the Uromathans are regularly
trying to defeat Ternath, and take over the world.
The Ternathians are just as regularly preparing to
stop them. And the Arpathians are habitually preparing
to resist either or both of them.
Sharona is prepared for war.

HTM