Information I'd love to know

Yow wrote:Inner dialog from President Harris before his demise from the SVW

The arrival of the dreadnoughts which had compelled Admiral Chin to surrender would have been bad enough, but it hadn't been the end. Oh, no. Not the end.

She surrendered.

Inner dialog from Citizen Rear Admiral Genevieve Chin on Victor Cachat at La Martine Sector shortly before the first Manticore-Haven war ended in a cease fire from the SotS: Fanatic

Even assuming she was right, that cold-blooded part of her which had enabled a disgraced admiral to survive for ten years through Haven's Pierre–Saint-Just–Ransom regime would have preferred an outright sadist to a sheer fanatic as the effective new head of State Security in La Martine Sector.

The war was from 1905 until 1915 as stated in the wikia. My only other argument in support of her being returned to Haven before the wars actual declaration is Solarian Navy Rear Admiral Sigbee's return to the League. Not a precedent obviously but a declaration of war was not given and Vice Admiral Henke didn't even take her prisoner even though legally she could and allowed her to return home with her crew. There is no text as to what happened to Rear Admiral Chin and her surrendered crew but David Weber allowed Eric Flint to use two of his characters that had to fit into the overall story and he often leaves out explanations from info dumps and expects that we will understand from context what happened or should have happened. Bold italics are mine to highlight time indicated.

Yow wrote: The war was from 1905 until 1915 as stated in the wikia. My only other argument in support of her being returned to Haven before the wars actual declaration is Solarian Navy Rear Admiral Sigbee's return to the League. Not a precedent obviously but a declaration of war was not given and Vice Admiral Henke didn't even take her prisoner even though legally she could and allowed her to return home with her crew.

At the moment, O'Cleary was a pariah, tainted with the same contamination as Evelyn Sigbee. Unlike Sigbee, of course, O'Cleary was home on Old Earth, where she could have her disgrace rubbed firmly in her face, and even though she was Battle Fleet, not Frontier Fleet, Teague found herself feeling a powerful sense of sympathy for the older woman. It was hardly O'Cleary's fault she'd found herself under the orders of a certifiable moron and then been left to do the surrendering after Crandall sailed her entire task force straight into the jaws of catastrophe.

Yow wrote: The war was from 1905 until 1915 as stated in the wikia. My only other argument in support of her being returned to Haven before the wars actual declaration is Solarian Navy Rear Admiral Sigbee's return to the League. Not a precedent obviously but a declaration of war was not given and Vice Admiral Henke didn't even take her prisoner even though legally she could and allowed her to return home with her crew.

Bill Woods wrote:Nitpick: I think you mean Adm. O'Cleary, not Sigbee. The latter was left on New Tuscany along with the rest of Byng's task force, and that's the last we've heard of them. The former was transported back to the League, but the rest of Crandall's task force are still in POW camps on Spindle.

From Mission:

At the moment, O'Cleary was a pariah, tainted with the same contamination as Evelyn Sigbee. Unlike Sigbee, of course, O'Cleary was home on Old Earth, where she could have her disgrace rubbed firmly in her face, and even though she was Battle Fleet, not Frontier Fleet, Teague found herself feeling a powerful sense of sympathy for the older woman. It was hardly O'Cleary's fault she'd found herself under the orders of a certifiable moron and then been left to do the surrendering after Crandall sailed her entire task force straight into the jaws of catastrophe.

Chin nodded back. Sabourin was probably the only member of her staff who could fully savor her own sense of . . . completion. She’d come a long way to reach this point. She’d survived being scapegoated by the Legislaturalists for the disaster of Hancock Station at the very start of the last war. She’d survived long, dreary years in the service of the Committee of Public Safety—never quite trusted, too valuable to simply discard, always watched by her people’s commissioner. She’d even survived Saint-Just’s ascension to complete power . . . and the chaos following his overthrow. She’d been “rehabilitated” twice now. Once by Rob Pierre’s lunatics, solely because she’d been scapegoated by the previous régime. And once by the new Republic, because she’d damned well done a good job protecting her assigned sector despite the psychotic sadist they’d assigned as her people’s commissioner. This time, she actually believed it was going to stick. She’d still lost a lot of ground in the seniority game. Men and women who’d been junior officers, or even enlisted personnel, when she’d already been a flag officer, were senior to her now. Thomas Theisman, for one, who’d been a commander when she’d been a rear admiral. But she was one of only a handful of people who’d made admiral under the Legislaturalists who were still alive at all, so she supposed that was something of a wash. And whether the universe was always a fair place or not, she couldn’t complain about where she was today. The woman who’d been saddled with the blame for the Legislaturalists’ disastrous opening campaign against the Star Kingdom of Manticore, was also the woman who’d been chosen to command the decisive jaw of the trap which would crush the Star Kingdom once and for all. She’d waited fifteen T-years for this moment, and it tasted sweet. Nicodème Sabourin understood that. She hadn’t known it for quite some time, but he’d been a second-class petty officer aboard one of her dreadnoughts at Hancock Station. Like her, he was looking forward to getting some of his own back this afternoon.

Carl wrote:@Yow: Chin makes a specific point that the committee only kept her alive because she got scapegoated for the Hannock disaster which meant they saw rehabilitating her as viable. Which makes sense, she'd owe her continued career to them.


Sinc ei have to seem to keep repeating myself here;s the AAC text dump on the matter:

Chin nodded back. Sabourin was probably the only member of her staff who could fully savor her own sense of . . . completion. She’d come a long way to reach this point. She’d survived being scapegoated by the Legislaturalists for the disaster of Hancock Station at the very start of the last war. She’d survived long, dreary years in the service of the Committee of Public Safety—never quite trusted, too valuable to simply discard, always watched by her people’s commissioner. She’d even survived Saint-Just’s ascension to complete power . . . and the chaos following his overthrow. She’d been “rehabilitated” twice now. Once by Rob Pierre’s lunatics, solely because she’d been scapegoated by the previous régime. And once by the new Republic, because she’d damned well done a good job protecting her assigned sector despite the psychotic sadist they’d assigned as her people’s commissioner. This time, she actually believed it was going to stick. She’d still lost a lot of ground in the seniority game. Men and women who’d been junior officers, or even enlisted personnel, when she’d already been a flag officer, were senior to her now. Thomas Theisman, for one, who’d been a commander when she’d been a rear admiral. But she was one of only a handful of people who’d made admiral under the Legislaturalists who were still alive at all, so she supposed that was something of a wash. And whether the universe was always a fair place or not, she couldn’t complain about where she was today. The woman who’d been saddled with the blame for the Legislaturalists’ disastrous opening campaign against the Star Kingdom of Manticore, was also the woman who’d been chosen to command the decisive jaw of the trap which would crush the Star Kingdom once and for all. She’d waited fifteen T-years for this moment, and it tasted sweet. Nicodème Sabourin understood that. She hadn’t known it for quite some time, but he’d been a second-class petty officer aboard one of her dreadnoughts at Hancock Station. Like her, he was looking forward to getting some of his own back this afternoon.

Doesn't cover the stuff from fanatic, (not sure i've got that, will have to check), and does not cover FoD stuff but it's enough to cover some of the points that keep getting re-raised.

Yow wrote:So she didn't go back alone. It looks to me as if her crew was returned with her. Wither she and her crew was exchanged, returned or escaped it seems to me to all happen before or around the declaration of war from manticore in 1905.

SWM wrote:I have always been under the impression that there were a few prisoner exchanges throughout the war. The text didn't bother to mention them, but I believe they did happen.

svenhauke wrote:what i really want to know is :

how does a ship and its wedghes look like ?

i juust cant see how it works

i mean the wedges are suposed to be so close to top and bottom of the ship that they protect it , right ?

so that means they go back from the front and back, and meet in the middle ??? how is that suposed to work ???

can t see it

if anyone can please a picture