Information I'd love to know

Carl wrote:I've got a question. How the hell did Chin escape Hancock station to get blamed for the disaster there? I thought her flagship got captured yet according to ALC she escaped to be scapegoated by the legisurists, only to be picked up by the CPS.

Prisoner exchanges

Yow wrote:

Carl wrote:I've got a question. How the hell did Chin escape Hancock station to get blamed for the disaster there? I thought her flagship got captured yet according to ALC she escaped to be scapegoated by the legisurists, only to be picked up by the CPS.

Prisoner exchanges

After Ashes of Victory, when the Conservative-Progressive-Liberal coalition came to power, they did prisoner exchanges with the Havenites (which would have to be the Committee of Public Safety, since we see Admiral Chin back with the PRN* (not the RHN*) in Fanatic in The Service of the Sword anthology--and not until the end of the short story does word of the fall of the Committee reach La Martine).

War of Honor, Chapter 5 wrote:"None of us have any imperial ambitions, Marisa," he told her earnestly. "Despite that, however, and especially in light of the security problems the Cromarty Government committed us to in the annexation of Trevor's Star, we're going to have to insist on some Havenite concessions. And it's about time they were the ones who gave a little ground, too. We already made a major gesture towards meeting them more than half way by agreeing to the general repatriation of POWs when we didn't have anything but a truce agreement, you know."
New Kiev gazed at the Prime Minister for several seconds, then nodded thoughtfully. Descroix, on the other hand, confident that New Kiev was looking elsewhere, rolled her eyes cynically. "Repatriating prisoners of war" sounded very generous, but New Kiev ought to realize as well as she did that the Star Kingdom hadn't proposed it out of the goodness of High Ridge's heart or to demonstrate its willingness to be accommodating. Just getting out from under the expense of feeding and caring for the far more numerous Peep prisoners held by the Manticoran Alliance would have been worthwhile in its own right, and as for the enormous PR advantages in being the Government which had "brought our men and women home" . . .

Boldface is my emphasis.

* PRN = People's Republic Navy - First under the Legislaturists (with the nepotism and political backscrathing), then later continued the Committee of Public Safety (with the political commissars).

Which differs completely from the

* RHN = Republic of Haven Navy - The Navy of the restored Republic of Haven, with Thomas Theisman as Secretary of War and Chief of Naval Operations, and Eloise Pritchart as President of the Repbublic of Haven.

Thats' all well and good but the textev of at least AAC notes that she spent years in committee of public safety service. the committee fell literally within weeks of the send back.

That combined with the fact that the Legislaturalists tried to scapegoat her at hannock suggests she went home immediately.

Vince wrote:

Yow wrote:Prisoner exchanges

After Ashes of Victory, when the Conservative-Progressive-Liberal coalition came to power, they did prisoner exchanges with the Havenites (which would have to be the Committee of Public Safety, since we see Admiral Chin back with the PRN* (not the RHN*) in Fanatic in The Service of the Sword anthology--and not until the end of the short story does word of the fall of the Committee reach La Martine).

The ceasefire was barely in place when Theisman shot Saint-Just. The prisoner exchange came afterwards and was negotiated between the Pritchart administration(whether provisional or confirmed by elections) and the High Ridge government.

Until then, there were no prisoner exchanges, with the sole exception of a few surviving PN personnel from Giscard's commerce raiding operation in Silesia(and the Cerberus prison break).

Fanatic also makes it clear that Chin has been in La Martine for several years. Not only that, the news of McQueen's coup attempt reached La Martine three weeks prior to the commencement of the story.

Furthermore, I don't see Chin voluntarily returning to a PRH ruled by the CPS - certainly not after the Cerberus escapees brought along Amos Parnell and all the other evidence impeaching Pierre and Saint-Just for the Harris Assassination.

Given how quickly Pierre's coup came after the start of the war, the only possible explanation is Chin hopped into a faster ship that was able to retreat, as happened with Oliver Diamoto in a later battle in the same system.

Since severe wounds weren't mentioned, the only explantion I can think of as to why she wasn't shot or dismissed for abandoning her command(remember how reviled the RMN were by Young's actions, bar a few political officers) is that Admiral Rollins ordered her to evacuate.

The problem with that munroburton is that text ev of book 4 indicates she was captured. Also her chief of staff from AAC was a lower decks petty officer on one of her DN's at hannock and from his promotions it appears he got out as well, (i know that he might have gone back at the end of AoV but he's gone from low grade non-commissioned to a very high level commissioned position, that's a bit much even in the 3-4 years or so he's had to since AoV).

The one real possibility is that there's more than one Admiral Gewnive Chin in the PRN.

I don't think I could ever give you a blow by blow dates and such, but there was a time period between the Battle of Hancock and the official declaration of war where the government resisted declaring war while it waited for Haven to implode after the supposed navy coup and the emergence of the Committee of Public Safety that "stepped in to restore order" and hold the navy accountable for its betrayal and for creating a incident. Personaly I think they requested and received their crews back for accountability and trials minus ships and the Manticoran government ever war shy accepted and delivered the captured spacers back thinking that the Committee of Public Safety would stop there with the new government in place in Haven... Assumptions made from inferences in the first half of the Field of Dishonor.

munroburton wrote:"Vince"]"Yow"]Prisoner exchanges

After Ashes of Victory, when the Conservative-Progressive-Liberal coalition came to power, they did prisoner exchanges with the Havenites (which would have to be the Committee of Public Safety, since we see Admiral Chin back with the PRN* (not the RHN*) in Fanatic in The Service of the Sword anthology--and not until the end of the short story does word of the fall of the Committee reach La Martine).[/quote]

The ceasefire was barely in place when Theisman shot Saint-Just. The prisoner exchange came afterwards and was negotiated between the Pritchart administration(whether provisional or confirmed by elections) and the High Ridge government.

Until then, there were no prisoner exchanges, with the sole exception of a few surviving PN personnel from Giscard's commerce raiding operation in Silesia(and the Cerberus prison break).

Fanatic also makes it clear that Chin has been in La Martine for several years. Not only that, the news of McQueen's coup attempt reached La Martine three weeks prior to the commencement of the story.

Furthermore, I don't see Chin voluntarily returning to a PRH ruled by the CPS - certainly not after the Cerberus escapees brought along Amos Parnell and all the other evidence impeaching Pierre and Saint-Just for the Harris Assassination.

Given how quickly Pierre's coup came after the start of the war, the only possible explanation is Chin hopped into a faster ship that was able to retreat, as happened with Oliver Diamoto in a later battle in the same system.

Since severe wounds weren't mentioned, the only explantion I can think of as to why she wasn't shot or dismissed for abandoning her command(remember how reviled the RMN were by Young's actions, bar a few political officers) is that Admiral Rollins ordered her to evacuate.[/quote]


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I am afraid this detail may be either
(1) an unmentioned prisoner exchange (possibly between Battle of Hancock and the vote on Declaration of War in Parliament)
or
(2) a case of textual Hand-Wavium

-- Stewart

The one real possibility is that there's more than one Admiral Gewnive Chin in the PRN.

Nope she specifically notes she was a commander of the attack on Hannock station.

I am afraid this detail may be either
(1) an unmentioned prisoner exchange (possibly between Battle of Hancock and the vote on Declaration of War in Parliament)
or
(2) a case of textual Hand-Wavium

Most likely the former. I' just love to know more TBH, why and how basically.

munroburton wrote:The ceasefire was barely in place when Theisman shot Saint-Just. The prisoner exchange came afterwards and was negotiated between the Pritchart administration(whether provisional or confirmed by elections) and the High Ridge government.

Until then, there were no prisoner exchanges, with the sole exception of a few surviving PN personnel from Giscard's commerce raiding operation in Silesia(and the Cerberus prison break).

Fanatic also makes it clear that Chin has been in La Martine for several years. Not only that, the news of McQueen's coup attempt reached La Martine three weeks prior to the commencement of the story.

Furthermore, I don't see Chin voluntarily returning to a PRH ruled by the CPS - certainly not after the Cerberus escapees brought along Amos Parnell and all the other evidence impeaching Pierre and Saint-Just for the Harris Assassination.

Given how quickly Pierre's coup came after the start of the war, the only possible explanation is Chin hopped into a faster ship that was able to retreat, as happened with Oliver Diamoto in a later battle in the same system.

Since severe wounds weren't mentioned, the only explantion I can think of as to why she wasn't shot or dismissed for abandoning her command(remember how reviled the RMN were by Young's actions, bar a few political officers) is that Admiral Rollins ordered her to evacuate.

Inner dialog from President Harris before his demise from the SVW

The arrival of the dreadnoughts which had compelled Admiral Chin to surrender would have been bad enough, but it hadn't been the end. Oh, no. Not the end.

She surrendered.

Inner dialog from Citizen Rear Admiral Genevieve Chin on Victor Cachat at La Martine Sector shortly before the first Manticore-Haven war ended in a cease fire from the SotS: Fanatic

Even assuming she was right, that cold-blooded part of her which had enabled a disgraced admiral to survive for ten years through Haven's Pierre–Saint-Just–Ransom regime would have preferred an outright sadist to a sheer fanatic as the effective new head of State Security in La Martine Sector.

The war was from 1905 until 1915 as stated in the wikia. My only other argument in support of her being returned to Haven before the wars actual declaration is Solarian Navy Rear Admiral Sigbee's return to the League. Not a precedent obviously but a declaration of war was not given and Vice Admiral Henke didn't even take her prisoner even though legally she could and allowed her to return home with her crew. There is no text as to what happened to Rear Admiral Chin and her surrendered crew but David Weber allowed Eric Flint to use two of his characters that had to fit into the overall story and he often leaves out explanations from info dumps and expects that we will understand from context what happened or should have happened. Bold italics are mine to highlight time indicated.