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HMS Casey

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Re: HMS Casey
Post by Dafmeister   » Wed Jun 03, 2015 12:08 pm

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n7axw wrote:
Up to the moment when those torpedo planes managed to put Bismark's rudder out of order making it impossible for her to steer. That slowed her up considerably.

Don


True, and that's the only reason even KG5 could catch her in the end, let alone Rodney. However, in the Denmark Strait, Bismark could have avoided action against any capital ship we had except for KG5, Prince of Wales and the battlecruisers, simply by going to full power. She would thereby have avoided the shell hit she took from Prince of Wales which cut the feeds from one of her forward fuel tanks, and could have disappeared into the Atlantic instead of having to turn toward the French coast where recon aircraft were able to pick her up again.
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Re: HMS Casey
Post by PalmerSperry   » Wed Jun 03, 2015 1:47 pm

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saber964 wrote:Here's an off topic question.

Do you think the Bismarck is overrated?


Well it depends ... Some people do describe her being the best WW1 design battleship that ever went to sea! :D
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Re: HMS Casey
Post by Theemile   » Wed Jun 03, 2015 1:54 pm

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Bill Woods wrote:
Theemile wrote:If the [Bismarck] had run into any other RMN ship, that first encounter would have been very different.
(emph added)
Sure would! :D The merest frigate could have blown her to smithereens with one kinetic shot.

:P - lol missed that one...
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RFC said "refitting a Beowulfan SD to Manticoran standards would be just as difficult as refitting a standard SLN SD to those standards. In other words, it would be cheaper and faster to build new ships."
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Re: HMS Casey
Post by PalmerSperry   » Wed Jun 03, 2015 2:00 pm

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Dafmeister wrote:
n7axw wrote:
Up to the moment when those torpedo planes managed to put Bismark's rudder out of order making it impossible for her to steer. That slowed her up considerably.

Don


True, and that's the only reason even KG5 could catch her in the end, let alone Rodney. However, in the Denmark Strait, Bismark could have avoided action against any capital ship we had except for KG5, Prince of Wales and the battlecruisers, simply by going to full power. She would thereby have avoided the shell hit she took from Prince of Wales which cut the feeds from one of her forward fuel tanks, and could have disappeared into the Atlantic instead of having to turn toward the French coast where recon aircraft were able to pick her up again.


A raider which everyone knows the location of, because it's being followed by units of the RN isn't *that* much of a threat. Convoys will be routed around it as much as possible, and many convoys where escorted by old R and QE class battleships anyway. Sure, Bismarck is probably a match for any one of those but if it's got one of those in front and KGV/POW or a battlecruiser behind it then engaging seems like a high risk option. (Remember Scharnhorst and Gneisenau together retreated from HMS Renown and refused to close with a convoy escorted by HMS Malaya.)

Even if the convoy doesn't have a heavy escort, there's still not guarantee of success. HMS Jervis Bay and HMS Rawalpindi (particularly the latter) pressed the attack with what can only be described IMHO as "suicidal bravery" and arguable succeeded in their missions - since the convoys they where escorting largely escaped. See also HMS Glowworm.

There's also something I remember from an autobiography I read some of. The author was serving on some class of sloop, 3 of which and an "armed yacht" consisted of the escort for their convoy. Their orders if attacked by a large surface unit where :-

[1] Convoy to scatter in the opposite direction, whilst sloops stream battle ensigns.
[2] Sloops to approach on a course that made their silhouettes looks like destroyers (i.e. threaten a potential torpedo attack).
[3] Sloops to load semi-armour piercing shells and aim for turret bases and range fingers (i.e. mission kill the opponent).
[4] Armed yacht to continue signalling an RRR distress call, and then "attempt to delay the enemy as long as possible".

They apparently did start this routine when a unknown surface contact came over the horizon near east Africa. They never did learn what the contact was because as soon as it saw them, it retreated back over the horizon!
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Re: HMS Casey
Post by Fox2!   » Thu Jun 04, 2015 12:26 am

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JeffEngel wrote:
Fair point. Still, if the Bismarck could make it to PD 1922, I'm confident an RMN cutter (along with a lot else) could visit Sol any time it cared to.


Isn't that the premise of Space Battleship Yamoto?
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Re: HMS Casey
Post by fallsfromtrees   » Thu Jun 04, 2015 2:38 am

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JeffEngel wrote:
Fair point. Still, if the Bismarck could make it to PD 1922, I'm confident an RMN cutter (along with a lot else) could visit Sol any time it cared to.


I thought there was a general agreement that the RMN wasn't going to attack Sol :D
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Re: HMS Casey
Post by JeffEngel   » Thu Jun 04, 2015 7:59 am

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fallsfromtrees wrote:
JeffEngel wrote:Fair point. Still, if the Bismarck could make it to PD 1922, I'm confident an RMN cutter (along with a lot else) could visit Sol any time it cared to.


I thought there was a general agreement that the RMN wasn't going to attack Sol :D

Well yeah, but that's before they start waving the Bismarck around like a red flag before a bull!
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