How will it work out in Desnair?

would those rulers truly trust the church with that much power? as secret police are in a position of great power, enough to force out the current leadership if needed.

SYED wrote:would those rulers truly trust the church with that much power? as secret police are in a position of great power, enough to force out the current leadership if needed.

They would trust the church with that much power if that was the price of survival...

And, think about it... the church already has had that power all along. In many ways that has been business as usual on Safehold. In fact cut off from Zion, the inquisition would be in a somewhat weakened position, more dependent on the state. So the arrangement would be mutually reinforcing.

Don

Except that Harchong, at least, already has a secular secret police, in the Emperor's Spears. Who are unlikely not to have already been keeping tabs on the Inquisition [and vice versa]. Unless their masters have reason to doubt their effectiveness, I'm not persuaded that they will see a need to put that much dependence on an Inquisition that will have its own agenda. The Imperials will almost certainly be wanting to grind a rather different set of axes.

n7axw wrote:

SYED wrote:would those rulers truly trust the church with that much power? as secret police are in a position of great power, enough to force out the current leadership if needed.

They would trust the church with that much power if that was the price of survival...

And, think about it... the church already has had that power all along. In many ways that has been business as usual on Safehold. In fact cut off from Zion, the inquisition would be in a somewhat weakened position, more dependent on the state. So the arrangement would be mutually reinforcing.

Don

Louis R wrote:Except that Harchong, at least, already has a secular secret police, in the Emperor's Spears. Who are unlikely not to have already been keeping tabs on the Inquisition [and vice versa]. Unless their masters have reason to doubt their effectiveness, I'm not persuaded that they will see a need to put that much dependence on an Inquisition that will have its own agenda. The Imperials will almost certainly be wanting to grind a rather different set of axes.

Umm, secret police? The "Emperor's Spears" were mentioned as being the elite backbone of the Harchong Army, not its secret police.

Louis R wrote:Except that Harchong, at least, already has a secular secret police, in the Emperor's Spears. Who are unlikely not to have already been keeping tabs on the Inquisition [and vice versa]. Unless their masters have reason to doubt their effectiveness, I'm not persuaded that they will see a need to put that much dependence on an Inquisition that will have its own agenda. The Imperials will almost certainly be wanting to grind a rather different set of axes.

.

The other possibility is that even in Harchong and Desnair, the people and the aristocracy will go after the inquisition with torches and tongs and be eager to be rid of it.

My speculation is that for at least the short to intermediate term future the deeply conservative nature of these countries will tie them firmly to the COGA, thus sheltering the inquisition.

Don

Louis R wrote:Except that Harchong, at least, already has a secular secret police, in the Emperor's Spears. Who are unlikely not to have already been keeping tabs on the Inquisition [and vice versa]. Unless their masters have reason to doubt their effectiveness, I'm not persuaded that they will see a need to put that much dependence on an Inquisition that will have its own agenda. The Imperials will almost certainly be wanting to grind a rather different set of axes.

n7axw wrote:
The other possibility is that even in Harchong and Desnair, the people and the aristocracy will go after the inquisition with torches and tongs and be eager to be rid of it.

My speculation is that for at least the short to intermediate term future the deeply conservative nature of these countries will tie them firmly to the COGA, thus sheltering the inquisition.

Don

Although it has been pointed out that using Earth's history is questionable on Safehold, historically for the most part, the established church and the aristocracy have supported each other, so your speculation seems appropriate, at least until it becomes obvious that the COGA is on the ropes, and then the aristocracy may start to waver, at least some of it - similar to the rise of Protestantism in the North of Europe in the 16th century, which was as much a revolt of the Northern European aristocracy against the Catholic Church's political control as a protest of abuses in the Church.

WIth any percieved weakening of the church, might enspire some nobility to attempt to improve their positions, by taking up the slack, and getting in a good position for any potential out come to the war.

fallsfromtrees wrote:Although it has been pointed out that using Earth's history is questionable on Safehold, historically for the most part, the established church and the aristocracy have supported each other, so your speculation seems appropriate, at least until it becomes obvious that the COGA is on the ropes, and then the aristocracy may start to waver, at least some of it - similar to the rise of Protestantism in the North of Europe in the 16th century, which was as much a revolt of the Northern European aristocracy against the Catholic Church's political control as a protest of abuses in the Church.

The rise of Protestantism happened where the merchant classes were the most vibrant. Those countries where the merchnt class were weaker tended to remain Catholic.

Don

n7axw wrote:The rise of Protestantism happened where the merchant classes were the most vibrant. Those countries where the merchnt class were weaker tended to remain Catholic.

Don

... Venice?

JeffEngel wrote:

n7axw wrote:The rise of Protestantism happened where the merchant classes were the most vibrant. Those countries where the merchnt class were weaker tended to remain Catholic.

Don

... Venice?

Touche!