Thinking about King Zhames

Louis R wrote:I was just asking myself the same question, and I'm afraid that at the moment the only answer I have is "Your guess is as good as mine"

If you look closely, you see that the lines marking them off on the map are the same as those dividing the provinces of South Harchong, and are a different colour from the lines dividing Desnair, Sodar and Harchong, but have the same form. However, while the same line is used to separate Siddarmark and Silkiah, the lines used for other national demarcations in Haven are different. More importantly, the line dividing Delfarahk from Ashton and Myratha is exactly the same as the one separating the provinces of South Harchong - which is _not_ the line used for the northern Empire.

IOW, all we can tell for for sure is that RFC doesn't have a small mind. Or, at least, that it's remarkably free of hobgoblins.

isaac_newton wrote:Something about Delferak that I am not quite clear about from the map at Fifth Imperium - national and province boundary designations not being v clear - is it totally surrounded by Desnair?

Who do Myratha and Ashton belong to? They have single names like the other South Harchong provinces, unlike the Duchy this, Barony that in Desnair?

JeffEngel wrote:

Isilith wrote:Selkar and Myratha were referenced as having princes/being princedoms. Beyond that, as you say, we have no idea.

Just from how the map is drawn, I had assumed Ashton was a province of Delfarahk. After all, Delf has 83 million people, they sort of need that land area to have a population that high.

The detailed map of Delferahk (from HFAF) indicates that Ashton is north of Delferahk's border. It's a peculiarly large population for the land area for Safehold, particularly when the description of the great escape from it does not make the kingdom out to be an intensely farmed or heavily urbanized state.

isaac_newton wrote:
hmmmmm - I see what you mean about the colours - against that bright green background the differences are rather less than marked!

I'm tending toward the SH provinces. Someone else suggested they might be princedoms - but I see that Transhar in West Haven is shown as a princedom.

BTW love that quote, and the subtle use... I tend to use it when my speiling geos a bit erratic

Isilith wrote:

isaac_newton wrote:
hmmmmm - I see what you mean about the colours - against that bright green background the differences are rather less than marked!

I'm tending toward the SH provinces. Someone else suggested they might be princedoms - but I see that Transhar in West Haven is shown as a princedom.

BTW love that quote, and the subtle use... I tend to use it when my speiling geos a bit erratic

Because Transhar IS a princedom, and part of the Border States, not a part of Harchong.

isaac_newton wrote:
hmmmmm - I see what you mean about the colours - against that bright green background the differences are rather less than marked!

I'm tending toward the SH provinces. Someone else suggested they might be princedoms - but I see that Transhar in West Haven is shown as a princedom.

BTW love that quote, and the subtle use... I tend to use it when my speiling geos a bit erratic

isaac_newton wrote:

Isilith wrote:
Because Transhar IS a princedom, and part of the Border States, not a part of Harchong.

That was exactly my point!

Louis R wrote:isaac is being obscure, to put it mildly:

I think his main point was that the independent states of Haven are also not marked off by the line used for clear international boundaries in the north - which isn't the same form, although it is the same colour, as the one used in the south. However, Transhar is clearly identified as a Princedom, where Selkar, Myratha and Ashton aren't. The problem with that thought is that either Sardahn, Jhurlahnk, Faralas and Sabana have a complex political organisation without a clear sovereign prince, or once again, the prince's title isn't included on the map.

We actually have exactly the same situation WRT the eastern border of Harchong on Haven as on Howard. To whit, the maps aren't really intended for anybody but Himself so they aren't entirely useful to anybody else.

Louis R wrote:isaac is being obscure, to put it mildly:

I think his main point was that the independent states of Haven are also not marked off by the line used for clear international boundaries in the north - which isn't the same form, although it is the same colour, as the one used in the south. However, Transhar is clearly identified as a Princedom, where Selkar, Myratha and Ashton aren't. The problem with that thought is that either Sardahn, Jhurlahnk, Faralas and Sabana have a complex political organisation without a clear sovereign prince, or once again, the prince's title isn't included on the map.

We actually have exactly the same situation WRT the eastern border of Harchong on Haven as on Howard. To whit, the maps aren't really intended for anybody but Himself so they aren't entirely useful to anybody else.

SNIP

isaac_newton wrote:
Sorry - wasn't meaning to be obscure. You are correct, I think - my eyes had skipped over those other entities - was just looking for princedoms at the time.

Also correct about the maps purpose - on the other hand it does give us hours of fun