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HFQ Official Snippet #23

This fascinating series is a combination of historical seafaring, swashbuckling adventure, and high technological science-fiction. Join us in a discussion!
Re: HFQ Official Snippet #23
Post by Randomiser   » Thu Apr 30, 2015 5:03 pm

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McGuiness wrote:

With my luck he's referring to the next book in the Honorverse, which wouldn't hurt my feelings either. The fact that "Hell's Gate" is being published in July means that the clock is ticking on the release of the "The Road to Hell," so RFC has to write his half and edit the entire novel sometime in the next few months, if he isn't editing it now.


Over on the Multiverse forum on April 27th Joelle Presby wrote

Himself (aka RunsWithCelery) has sent me the *full* draft. I'm excited. Soon, I hope very soon, we'll be sending the manuscript to Baen.

We have a tentative publication slot of March 2016 for THE ROAD TO HELL.

http://forums.davidweber.net/viewtopic.php?f=6&t=6132&start=20#p189731

Suggests that RFC's big push has been on this. (Back in October he was talking about maybe getting it finished by the end of 2014!)
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Re: HFQ Official Snippet #23
Post by Captain Igloo   » Thu Apr 30, 2015 5:43 pm

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chrisd wrote:
runsforcelery wrote: For all its size, it had a curiously unfinished — or perhaps the word he wanted was “crude” — appearance compared to the imagery of last-generation steam locomotives from Old Earth with which Owl had provided him. By the same token, though, it looked far sleeker and much more sophisticated than its early nineteenth century predecessors ever had. It was built in what would have been called a 2-4-0 configuration back on Old Earth, with a two-wheeled front bogey followed by two paired drive wheels powered by two twenty-one-inch diameter drive cylinders with a thirty-inch stroke. Unlike the marine engines which were Praigyr’s first true love, the automotive used a fire tube arrangement, with the hot gases from the furnace carried through a water-filled boiler. It was, however, designed to run at rather higher pressure and temperature than most Old Earth locomotives prior to the twentieth century, and it incorporated both a superheater (tubes in which boiler steam passed through the hot furnace gasses in front of the boiler proper, which further heated it to produce “dry steam” for the cylinders) and a blast pipe using waste steam to boost the firebox draught to increase its efficiency. The superheater had been one of Praigyr’s ideas, based on his work with the marine engines, but the blast pipe had been Howsmyn’s suggestion, based on input from Owl and Doctor Dahnel Vyrnyr’s suggestions.  




Well, a good example (okay, its a 4-4-0 American on steroids) is the preserved PRR 1223.
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Re: HFQ Official Snippet #23
Post by chrisd   » Fri May 01, 2015 10:18 am

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Captain Igloo wrote:
chrisd wrote:


Well, a good example (okay, its a 4-4-0 American on steroids) is the preserved PRR 1223.


Putting the "weight on the driving wheels" and driving wheel diameter from your PRR D16 into the equation and assuming a boiler pressure of 200psi the Nominal tractive effort would come out at 33,075 lbf which would then give a "Factor of Adhesion" of 33.58%

This would make the locomotive extremely liable to "slip" and would be impractical for any heavy load-hauling.

If the cylinders are "outside" , as I believe that they would have to be,then the relatively large reciprocating weights and their associated balance weights would give very heavy "Hammer-blow" at any speed and a large "swaying couple" as well
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Re: HFQ Official Snippet #23
Post by Annachie   » Fri May 01, 2015 11:33 am

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ChrisD, I was thinking the same thing about the power, but was wondering if the Charisian loco was heavier. More loco weight means more power that can go through the wheels. (I know, overly simplistic)
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You are so going to die. :p ~~~~ runsforcelery
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still not dead. :)
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Re: HFQ Official Snippet #23
Post by chrisd   » Fri May 01, 2015 1:43 pm

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Annachie wrote:ChrisD, I was thinking the same thing about the power, but was wondering if the Charisian loco was heavier. More loco weight means more power that can go through the wheels. (I know, overly simplistic)


Another point raised from the PRR D16 shown, MOST 2-4-0's were rigid frame to give more stability on the track, basicall an0-6-0 but with carrying wheels inste4ad of "leading drivers". The USA preferred the 4-4-0 "American" type because of the relatively crude tracks employed at the time, their suspension was essentially "three point" as the coupled wheels were compensated and the fulcrum of the bogie formed the third point.

You can go heavier, but the axle loading sets a limit as to how far you can go and this also defines just how heavy the track and substructure have to be to support the loadings imposed.

Most British Main Line track is now suitable for up to 25 (long) tons axle loading; sleeper spacing, permitted curvature and ballast weight defining how fast that track can then be used. USA tracks are usually loadable in excess of 30 tons per axle.

The Bulleid "Spam Cans" were notoriously "Light on their wheels" with an Adhesion factor of 22% and IIRC the BR "Standard" classes were designed to have an adhesion factor no more than 15%

For a "Load Hauler" then the Delthak works would be better off going for more coupled axles. For an early American example see "Memnon", built withing the first twenty years of "modern" railway operation in this world, now on display in the B & O Roundhouse in Baltimore :-
www.borail.org/Memnon.aspx
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Re: HFQ Official Snippet #23
Post by Captain Igloo   » Fri May 01, 2015 3:55 pm

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chrisd wrote:
Annachie wrote:ChrisD, I was thinking the same thing about the power, but was wondering if the Charisian loco was heavier. More loco weight means more power that can go through the wheels. (I know, overly simplistic)


SNIPP

For a "Load Hauler" then the Delthak works would be better off going for more coupled axles. For an early American example see "Memnon", built withing the first twenty years of "modern" railway operation in this world, now on display in the B & O Roundhouse in Baltimore :-
http://www.borail.org/Memnon.aspx


MORE details

how about a Consolidation? Standard heavy freight locomotive at the early 20th century.
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Re: HFQ Official Snippet #23
Post by pokermind   » Fri May 01, 2015 10:01 pm

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The Bisell swiveling two wheel lead truck patented in 1858 allowed a two wheel truck to lead the drivers into curves similar to the earlier four wheel trucks. prior to this ridged wheels were used. The 2-8-0 Consolidation type was the most produced locomotive in the United States between the years of 1866-1950. [American Locomotives An Engineering History 1830-1880, John H. White Jr., Johns Hopkins Press, Baltimore, Maryland, 1968; Bissel truck p 62; Consolation p.65]

World Wide I think the 2-8-2 was the most produced steam locomotive including the last steam locomotives made for regular railroad service in China in the 1990s IIRC. The trailing wheels supported a longer and deeper firebox needed for successful coal burners.

Charlie
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Re: HFQ Official Snippet #23
Post by anwi   » Sat May 02, 2015 7:11 am

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Thanks for long snippet. Now, a lot of exposition for the phase after the current war, I guess, and some raising of steam. Now, while locomotive drive systems make for interesting discussion, I've another question:

runsforcelery wrote: You take the right cardstock, now, and you bind one end into a brass cup t’ hold the primer, and all you’d have t’ do’d be to —”


Anyone with me in expecting that this storyline continues with "BOOM"?
And I'm talking about a serious BOOM, martian style...

As an aside: Ahlverez might be wandering in the wilderness after Pentecoste, still. :)
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Re: HFQ Official Snippet #23
Post by Weird Harold   » Sat May 02, 2015 3:05 pm

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anwi wrote:
runsforcelery wrote: You take the right cardstock, now, and you bind one end into a brass cup t’ hold the primer, and all you’d have t’ do’d be to —”


Anyone with me in expecting that this storyline continues with "BOOM"?
And I'm talking about a serious BOOM, martian style...


Nope, no earth-shattering kaboom here. That's the way shotgun shells have been made in the real world almost since breech-loaders were invented.
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.
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Answers! I got lots of answers!

(Now if I could just find the right questions.)
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Re: HFQ Official Snippet #23
Post by Kytheros   » Sat May 02, 2015 3:50 pm

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runsforcelery wrote: You take the right cardstock, now, and you bind one end into a brass cup t’ hold the primer, and all you’d have t’ do’d be to —”

anwi wrote:
Anyone with me in expecting that this storyline continues with "BOOM"?
And I'm talking about a serious BOOM, martian style...

Weird Harold wrote:
Nope, no earth-shattering kaboom here. That's the way shotgun shells have been made in the real world almost since breech-loaders were invented.

I think he means that he thinks that Mahldyn is being interrupted by something going BOOM.
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