CLAC's in Home Fleet

saber964 wrote:"stewart"]"Brigade XO"]We should also consider that we are being shown the --use CLACs to deliver LAC squadrons (and larger groups) to systems in Talbott-- as plot device. The CLACs show up, Mike takes control of them with her new orders and attach them to the 10th Fleet. I don't recall if it was just to the 10th Fleet or she put some of them into the TO of Talbot Quadrant forces.

Essentialy she changed the orders of the arriving "shuttle" CLACS so that she added them to her combat force and is/has taken most if not all along with her to Mesa and for whatever she plans. She has also now been to Meyers and "liberated" that system from OFS control even if Meyers wasn't trying to use a revolution to throw off OFS/FF control. She has sucessfully dispatched Task Groups off to support local liberation movements in other systems in control of or at least under the thrall of OFS or Transtellar. Of course she also sent the force to Saltash to free Manticorian Citizens and in the process, along with chopping up local OFS/FF forces, set up a situtation for regime change at least in the person of the Lt. Gov. getting the Gov. removed and POSSIBLY a situation where the Lt. Gov. and remnants of the original government shift into something in that single system that could resemble what Berragos is doing with Maya.

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As Terekhov demonstrated, a CLAC looks like a SD; with Sag-C's to provide the long-ranged missile support, the CLAC can also be a heavy assault ship with Marine Assault Craft in the small craft bays.

-- Stewart[/quote]

Terakhov had a total of 2 battalions at Mobius. He is also going to be parked there for the immediate future serving as peacekeeper and neutral observer for the trials that are more than likely happening.[/quote]


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The Mobius locals should be able to find, or make from local industry, the rope needed; OFS has already provided the scaffolds.

-- Stewart

Brigade XO wrote:We should also consider that we are being shown the --use CLACs to deliver LAC squadrons (and larger groups) to systems in Talbott-- as plot device. The CLACs show up, Mike takes control of them with her new orders and attach them to the 10th Fleet. I don't recall if it was just to the 10th Fleet or she put some of them into the TO of Talbot Quadrant forces.

Essentialy she changed the orders of the arriving "shuttle" CLACS so that she added them to her combat force and is/has taken most if not all along with her to Mesa and for whatever she plans. She has also now been to Meyers and "liberated" that system from OFS control even if Meyers wasn't trying to use a revolution to throw off OFS/FF control. She has sucessfully dispatched Task Groups off to support local liberation movements in other systems in control of or at least under the thrall of OFS or Transtellar. Of course she also sent the force to Saltash to free Manticorian Citizens and in the process, along with chopping up local OFS/FF forces, set up a situtation for regime change at least in the person of the Lt. Gov. getting the Gov. removed and POSSIBLY a situation where the Lt. Gov. and remnants of the original government shift into something in that single system that could resemble what Berragos is doing with Maya.

stewart wrote:
As Terekhov demonstrated, a CLAC looks like a SD; with Sag-C's to provide the long-ranged missile support, the CLAC can also be a heavy assault ship with Marine Assault Craft in the small craft bays.

-- Stewart

saber964 wrote:Terakhov had a total of 2 battalions at Mobius. He is also going to be parked there for the immediate future serving as peacekeeper and neutral observer for the trials that are more than likely happening.

I seriously doubt that he's going to stay there with all the ships he brought. He's most likely going to peel off one or two ships so the rest can join up with Tenth Fleet.

JohnRoth wrote:

Brigade XO wrote:We should also consider that we are being shown the --use CLACs to deliver LAC squadrons (and larger groups) to systems in Talbott-- as plot device. The CLACs show up, Mike takes control of them with her new orders and attach them to the 10th Fleet. I don't recall if it was just to the 10th Fleet or she put some of them into the TO of Talbot Quadrant forces.

Essentialy she changed the orders of the arriving "shuttle" CLACS so that she added them to her combat force and is/has taken most if not all along with her to Mesa and for whatever she plans. She has also now been to Meyers and "liberated" that system from OFS control even if Meyers wasn't trying to use a revolution to throw off OFS/FF control. She has sucessfully dispatched Task Groups off to support local liberation movements in other systems in control of or at least under the thrall of OFS or Transtellar. Of course she also sent the force to Saltash to free Manticorian Citizens and in the process, along with chopping up local OFS/FF forces, set up a situtation for regime change at least in the person of the Lt. Gov. getting the Gov. removed and POSSIBLY a situation where the Lt. Gov. and remnants of the original government shift into something in that single system that could resemble what Berragos is doing with Maya.

stewart wrote:
As Terekhov demonstrated, a CLAC looks like a SD; with Sag-C's to provide the long-ranged missile support, the CLAC can also be a heavy assault ship with Marine Assault Craft in the small craft bays.

-- Stewart

saber964 wrote:Terakhov had a total of 2 battalions at Mobius. He is also going to be parked there for the immediate future serving as peacekeeper and neutral observer for the trials that are more than likely happening.

I seriously doubt that he's going to stay there with all the ships he brought. He's most likely going to peel off one or two ships so the rest can join up with Tenth Fleet.

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I would suspect Terekhov will remain until a stable government sets up, the trials start (or complete) and likely retain the CLAC and 1 division of DD's, sending the other DD division and the other 3 Sag-C CA's back to Montana.

-- Stewart

stewart wrote:
I would suspect Terekhov will remain until a stable government sets up, the trials start (or complete) and likely retain the CLAC and 1 division of DD's, sending the other DD division and the other 3 Sag-C CA's back to Montana.

-- Stewart

So how many months do you think it is reasonable to keep a significant fraction of the firepower of 10th fleet out of the fight? What does that say about the whole Manticore liberates the verge plan?

kzt wrote:

stewart wrote:
I would suspect Terekhov will remain until a stable government sets up, the trials start (or complete) and likely retain the CLAC and 1 division of DD's, sending the other DD division and the other 3 Sag-C CA's back to Montana.

-- Stewart

So how many months do you think it is reasonable to keep a significant fraction of the firepower of 10th fleet out of the fight? What does that say about the whole Manticore liberates the verge plan?

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That's why Terekhov will send the majority of his assigned mini-task force back, 1 CA, 4 DD's and 1 CLAC is 1/2 the hulls he brought to Mobius and 1/3 his long range fire-power.

Since his response to the humanitarian request overthrew (or shook up) the local political establishment, he and the SEM have a moral obligation to see Mobius at least on the road to self-stability.

Personally, I think that will happen fairly quickly, likely within 3 months to get it started. A follow-up mission from Talbot / Spindle will help with their long-term stability.

-- Stewart

saber964 wrote: Terakhov had a total of 2 battalions at Mobius. He is also going to be parked there for the immediate future serving as peacekeeper and neutral observer for the trials that are more than likely happening.

JohnRoth wrote: I seriously doubt that he's going to stay there with all the ships he brought. He's most likely going to peel off one or two ships so the rest can join up with Tenth Fleet.

stewart wrote: I would suspect Terekhov will remain until a stable government sets up, the trials start (or complete) and likely retain the CLAC and 1 division of DD's, sending the other DD division and the other 3 Sag-C CA's back to Montana.

Fortuitously, Terekhov has already killed the upper echelons of the old government, the local branches of the transtellar corps, and the Solly force. And taken the rest of the last prisoner. The only force left standing on the planet is the rebels. So there isn't much left to do — he can sail back to Montana knowing that the civil war is over. There may be some dispute about whether he takes the Sollies with him as POWs, or leaves them to be given a fair trial and then executed, but that's about it.

By the way, Henke has taken the bulk of 10th Fleet off to Mesa, and won't be coming back any time soon. So either her fleet or the remnant defending the Talbott Quad needs a new designation, and the latter needs a new commander. Adm. Culbertson?

A lot depends on what is presently still within (and supposed to be circulating in) the nominally SL controlled space in the frontier areas around the Talbott Quadrant. Given that FF is mostly thinly distributed, single FF ships are going to have major problems running into any of the most modern RMN ships. We have seen three major forces of FF being destroyed (Meyers and Mobius and Saltash) so you have to wonder what is available for the LOCAL force commanders to do something significant.

It is going to take time for SLN to pull together the planning, logisitics and gather the forces to mount the discussed commerce raiding. Once the raiding forces are actually dispatched, the situation changes to the point that RMN forces in most of the systems could be overmatched at any given time but the raiders are not going to be able to stay and actually recover or garrison any of those systems for OFS or the transpolar controlled puppet government. It is unlikely that any transstallar is going to be able (or told about) FF/BF raiding forces going out and be able to have even escort, let alone local enforcer support to restablish control on a system that has had RMN assistance in liberation.

The CLACs being retained in Talbott are going to spend a lot of time waiting to be sent as reaction forces to other places while they are maintaining a security presence and assisting training the local defence forces in the Talbott systems.

stewart wrote:----------------

As Terekhov demonstrated, a CLAC looks like a SD; with Sag-C's to provide the long-ranged missile support, the CLAC can also be a heavy assault ship with Marine Assault Craft in the small craft bays.

-- Stewart

Not just looks like an SD, For all intents and purposes, until it enters energy range, it might as well be an SD. With a Hydra, it can fire 24 round salvos of Mk 23s from 1/2 an AU away - enough to beat on another DN/SD, while it has more/better defensive systems than a Gryphon. Add in any pods it may have handy, and it can easily rip apart another waller at range. Yes, it doesn't have the armor or energy weaps to go toe to toe with another waller at close range, But it can take out anything smaller than a waller on it's own and with it's brood can probably handle 1-2 conventional SDs without a problem.

I'm not advertising that a CLAC should hazard itself, but a Minotaur or Hydra can look after itself when necessary, even when faced with the big guys - and to anything else, they might as well treat it with the same respect or learn the consequences.

Bill Woods wrote:Fortuitously, Terekhov has already killed the upper echelons of the old government, the local branches of the transtellar corps, and the Solly force. And taken the rest of the last prisoner. The only force left standing on the planet is the rebels. So there isn't much left to do — he can sail back to Montana knowing that the civil war is over. There may be some dispute about whether he takes the Sollies with him as POWs, or leaves them to be given a fair trial and then executed, but that's about it.

This might be an overly optimistic pov... Revolutions have a very poor record for producing positive results in places that don't have a track record of participatory government, Mobius being a case in point. Without long term outside help, the cure could turn out worse than the original disease.

I find myself thinking that there is going to be a need for political mediation teams and perhaps help in organizing civil institutions which is beyond the mission scope of a task force commander. Unfortunately a good share of the Verge is more like Mobius than Meyers.

Interesting times ahead...

Don

n7axw wrote:This might be an overly optimistic pov... Revolutions have a very poor record for producing positive results in places that don't have a track record of participatory government, Mobius being a case in point. Without long term outside help, the cure could turn out worse than the original disease.

Highly optimistic. The previous government had reasonable support, they always do. Planets are big, with an enormous population. The fact that someone has a bunch of guys with guns does not mean they have broad popular support or can produce a government with broad popular support. It especially does not mean that they WILL produce a government with broad popular support when they have a bunch of guys with guns.