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One way to kill the grand inquisitor and rayno now

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Re: One way to kill the grand inquisitor and rayno now
Post by lyonheart   » Fri Apr 03, 2015 2:12 pm

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Hi FallsFromTrees,,

Thanks for remembering one of the points I forgot! 8-)

Now if I could only remember what the other one was. :oops:

L


fallsfromtrees wrote:*quote="lyonheart"*Hi Don,

You're right, its certainly not going to happen.

While it indeed might well be possible to snag such a passing rock with a recon skimmer, the odds of finding one when it was possible [when the skimmer wouldn't appear to threaten the OBS and destroyed] are remote, Merlin and the inner circle would never condone such an atrocity in the first place, so it wouldn't happen.

It would definitely put Merlin and the inner circle on the same bottom moral expedient level as Clyntahn, so it wouldn't happen.

Given how Merlin agonized over killing just the semaphore station crews, around 50 or so, killing a million or 2 innocents would make him suicidal, so it wouldn't happen.

Which is why I tell you three times it wouldn't happen.;)

L

*quote*
n7axw wrote:*quote="OrlandoNative"*Actually, probably the easiest, and least bloody (if one doesn't mind a single city of "collateral damage" would have been to use the skimmers spacial abilities to find and de-orbit a rock onto Zion. A little underground "prep" work in having the SNARC's putting up posters predicting the "cleansing" of the Church hierarchy by the same means used in the "Wars against the Fallen"; coupled with that happening, could have easily resulted in massive changes in the Church's direction; especially if some particular doctrinal points were declared to be in error. After all, if "God and the Archangels" did it *once*, there's no reason they couldn't have done it again; and, after all, the "fallen" were originally Archangels too; so the concept of men, and, for that matter, even angels and archangels falling into error, corruption, and/or evil isn't unknown.*quote*

Perhaps that could be done except that Merlin and Nimue have already rejected the idea because of all the innocents who would die because of such an act.

Don

And for a practical reason, destroying the Temple in such a fashion has a good chance of destroying the controls for the OBs, which means you may well NEVER be able to move beyond steam, because you have no way of disarming the OBS. In this case the moral thing to not do is also the smart thing to not do.
Last edited by lyonheart on Fri Apr 03, 2015 2:17 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: One way to kill the grand inquisitor and rayno now
Post by lyonheart   » Fri Apr 03, 2015 2:17 pm

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Hi Don,

I was going to give three different unique reasons, harking back to our high school debate technique for impromptu talks etc, but the others promptly evaporated when I began to type.

Sorry. :oops:

L


n7axw wrote:
lyonheart wrote:Hi Don,

You're right, its certainly not going to happen.

While it indeed might well be possible to snag such a passing rock with a recon skimmer, the odds of finding one when it was possible [when the skimmer wouldn't appear to threaten the OBS and destroyed] are remote, Merlin and the inner circle would never condone such an atrocity in the first place, so it wouldn't happen.

It would definitely put Merlin and the inner circle on the same bottom moral expedient level as Clyntahn, so it wouldn't happen.

Given how Merlin agonized over killing just the semaphore station crews, around 50 or so, killing a million or 2 innocents would make him suicidal, so it wouldn't happen.

Which is why I tell you three times it wouldn't happen.;)

L



Hi Lyonheart,

That's ok. My wife repeats things at least three times because she thinks I'm a bit slow... :lol:

Don
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Re: One way to kill the grand inquisitor and rayno now
Post by SWM   » Fri Apr 03, 2015 2:34 pm

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lyonheart wrote:Hi FallsFromTrees,,

Thanks for remembering one of the points I forgot! 8-)

Now if I could only remember what the other one was. :oops:

L


fallsfromtrees wrote:And for a practical reason, destroying the Temple in such a fashion has a good chance of destroying the controls for the OBs, which means you may well NEVER be able to move beyond steam, because you have no way of disarming the OBS. In this case the moral thing to not do is also the smart thing to not do.

The other reason is that it might not destroy the controls or whatever is under the temple, and would be almost certain to awaken whatever it is. David has said that the entire temple is very heavily armored, and hinted that a nuclear or kinetic strike might not take out whatever is below the Temple.
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Re: One way to kill the grand inquisitor and rayno now
Post by n7axw   » Fri Apr 03, 2015 4:51 pm

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I've wondered about Armageddon Reef and what an excavation of the area might discover...Could it be that the techies might have buried something deep enough to avoid destruction?

No textev for this, but the idea is intriguing...

Don
When any group seeks political power in God's name, both religion and politics are instantly corrupted.
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Re: One way to kill the grand inquisitor and rayno now
Post by jasonized   » Mon Apr 06, 2015 11:43 pm

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How about this as something that's not going to happen? Make sure every "civilian" gets out of Zion, then send in a remote with a spark-gap transmitter. Let the Rakurai take out Zion...

And of course, if it doesn't, you get better communications... :}

Heh.. talk about your problems with saying "God is on our side"...
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Re: One way to kill the grand inquisitor and rayno now
Post by Dilandu   » Tue Apr 07, 2015 2:50 am

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n7axw wrote:I've wondered about Armageddon Reef and what an excavation of the area might discover...Could it be that the techies might have buried something deep enough to avoid destruction?

No textev for this, but the idea is intriguing...

Don


Highly unlikely. The Alexandria Enclave was open to any observation or inspection. No large-scale operation could be conducted here without someone notice. And, in case of any conflict between fractions, the Alexandria was the obvious traget; event without knowing about Rakurai, Shain-Wei must knew, that Langhorne would try to took control over Alexandria immediatly.

No, there was no reason for them to do so. Of course, SOME additional caches could be designed and build on other places. Doctor Pei have a tendency toward reservation and differet, completely isolated plans (like Nimue Cave and re-educated colonists)

In fact, i wonder - could Shain-Wei placed something other, that was not revealed yet?
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Re: One way to kill the grand inquisitor and rayno now
Post by Alistair   » Tue Apr 07, 2015 10:32 pm

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There were a lot of colonists that were seeded out by Shan wei how many of them kept an organisation going though is anyones guess.

I suspect that there might be one other hidden group that influenced things maybe the formation of Siddarmarks rebublic for example.
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Re: One way to kill the grand inquisitor and rayno now
Post by McGuiness   » Wed Apr 08, 2015 7:06 pm

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Alistair wrote:There were a lot of colonists that were seeded out by Shan wei how many of them kept an organisation going though is anyone's guess.

I suspect that there might be one other hidden group that influenced things maybe the formation of Siddarmark's rebublic for example.
Here's a link where RFC goes into some depth regarding the governments of the various realms on Safehold: viewtopic.php?f=7&t=6148&hilit=Republic+Siddarmark&start=10

Regarding the origins of the Republic of Siddarmark RFC says: "I don't intend to give you all the details about the Republic's formation at this time. They may never be included in one of the books at all, and probably won't be unless they become germane to the story I'm telling at that point. However, the Republic is quite old. It's form of government does not date from the Day of Creation itself, but that's actually true of most of the great realms of Safehold by Merlin's time. Most of the original enclaves "just grew" into nations and, along the way, independent enclaves merged with one another. In many cases, it was that merger which created the new nations' aristocracy; the folks who had been the ruling class of an enclave received specific titles as part of the merger process. Not all of those mergers were peaceful, either, although Mother Church had a tendency to step in if things got too . . . rambunctious.

What sets the Republic apart from most of the other realms is that it has a written Constitution dating back centuries and that the Siddarmarkians have a profound respect for the rule of law and the sanctity of constitutional principle. People were generally more willing to peaceably join a growing nation if they could count on being integrated into the system which would respect their existing rights and in which they could feel confident they wouldn't find themselves subject to the caprice of an entrenched aristocracy. There's a reason places like Desnair and Harchong had a tendency to expand through conquest, whereas Siddarmark expanded by remarkably peaceful voluntary annexations up until it found itself forced into a war it didn't really want against Desnair."

It's rather suggestive that Siddarmark ended up with a Republic when nobody else did, and that it's had a constitution for several centuries, but if that's due to Shan-wei planting some of her colonists there, RFC isn't telling... ;)

"Oh bother", said Pooh as he glanced through the airlock window at the helmet he'd forgotten to wear.
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Re: One way to kill the grand inquisitor and rayno now
Post by MPCatchup   » Wed Apr 08, 2015 7:28 pm

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McTurbo wrote:then comes the other question.. do you want to kill them?

without a doubt they are despicable characters who need to face some form of justice in the end. But at this time their blunders and errors due to blindly thrashing about is helping more than hurting.

Would we really want to cut off the head of the snake so to speak and find that we have instead of solving the problem. arranged to our dismay a power vacuum that is filled by someone or thing just as ruthless but far smarter and methodical about its decisions.

Deal with the Devil you know?


Good point, Clyntahn is acting somewhat like Hitler near the last years of WWII in that his policies and leadership is starting to cause his own side to not take advantage of situations because they are afraid of what his reaction might be.
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Re: One way to kill the grand inquisitor and rayno now
Post by McGuiness   » Wed Apr 08, 2015 7:50 pm

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MPCatchup wrote:Clyntahn is acting somewhat like Hitler near the last years of WWII in that his policies and leadership is starting to cause his own side to not take advantage of situations because they are afraid of what his reaction might be.
Since Hitler also had several of his generals shot or forced them to commit suicide, like Rommel did, if the resemblance between der Fuhrer and Clyntahn continues, we may see Kaitswyrth up against the wall for cowardice. It would be more useful to the allies to have Wyrshym shot since he's a better commander, but we can't have everything... :lol:

"Oh bother", said Pooh as he glanced through the airlock window at the helmet he'd forgotten to wear.
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