Question about Beowulf tactics

SWM wrote:

StealthSeeker wrote:This also gives the back story on how HH wound up being a "geni" with a much higher metabolism and as a result needs to consume more food than other people. But this story line of the "geni" genetics seems to have a touch of a flaw to it for me. It would seem that for Honor to be a "geni" her mother would also have to be one. Yet I specifically remember the plot line were Honor and her mother are talking about teaching the treecats to communicate via sign language and Honor offered her mother a cookie, which she refused, to keep her weight down. So Honor's mother is not a "geni". I suppose recessive traits can surface, but that would seem improbable. Or did Honor get her "geni" traits through he father??? Honor gets her height from him but I don't remember anything about him being a "geni" too.

Honor got her genetic modifications from her father. Yes, he is a genie, too. It goes all the way back to Honor's great, great, great, great-something family, the first Harringtons who emigrated to Sphinx from Meyerdahl. Meyerdahl was an even higher-grav planet than Sphinx, and genetic modification was almost a necessity to survive there. The genetic modifications were done in such a way that they would permanently dominate (apparently using some technique unknown to 20th century genetics). So the Harringtons of Sphinx have always been genies. In fact, somewhere in the text is the statement that a very large percentage of the population of Sphinx has heavy-grav genetic modifications.

Actually modern genetics has shown that there is no such thing as a dominant gene. Rather there is a mechanism that HEAVILY weights genes available. Linean genetics as explained in High school and even most College texts books is out-of-date, and heavily leaning towards blatantly wrong. We are beginning to understand there are far fewer mutations than we have thought. So far the total amount of so called "junk DNA" keeps shrinking as our understanding of what/how that so called "junk DNA" works. We started with what? 25% "junk DNA". That dropped to 15% a few years ago and now that number is well under 5% and most in the human genome mapping project are positive it is 0% if not very close to 0% and we simply do not have a clue yet.

Beyond this my ability to decipher what is going on vanishes and to get this far I basically leaned on my sister to interpret what she has been sending my direction.

PS. I made it up-through microbiology in college(minor in Biology), but honestly my love was in mechanical engineering.

SWM wrote:

StealthSeeker wrote:This also gives the back story on how HH wound up being a "geni" with a much higher metabolism and as a result needs to consume more food than other people. But this story line of the "geni" genetics seems to have a touch of a flaw to it for me. It would seem that for Honor to be a "geni" her mother would also have to be one. Yet I specifically remember the plot line were Honor and her mother are talking about teaching the treecats to communicate via sign language and Honor offered her mother a cookie, which she refused, to keep her weight down. So Honor's mother is not a "geni". I suppose recessive traits can surface, but that would seem improbable. Or did Honor get her "geni" traits through he father??? Honor gets her height from him but I don't remember anything about him being a "geni" too.

Honor got her genetic modifications from her father. Yes, he is a genie, too. It goes all the way back to Honor's great, great, great, great-something family, the first Harringtons who emigrated to Sphinx from Meyerdahl. Meyerdahl was an even higher-grav planet than Sphinx, and genetic modification was almost a necessity to survive there. The genetic modifications were done in such a way that they would permanently dominate (apparently using some technique unknown to 20th century genetics). So the Harringtons of Sphinx have always been genies. In fact, somewhere in the text is the statement that a very large percentage of the population of Sphinx has heavy-grav genetic modifications.

Weren't both the Meyerdahl and the Winton mods prior the Beouwulf code? That's how I remember it, anyway if my memory isn't playing tricks on me..AGAIN

Don

StealthSeeker wrote:This also gives the back story on how HH wound up being a "geni" with a much higher metabolism and as a result needs to consume more food than other people. But this story line of the "geni" genetics seems to have a touch of a flaw to it for me. It would seem that for Honor to be a "geni" her mother would also have to be one. Yet I specifically remember the plot line were Honor and her mother are talking about teaching the treecats to communicate via sign language and Honor offered her mother a cookie, which she refused, to keep her weight down. So Honor's mother is not a "geni". I suppose recessive traits can surface, but that would seem improbable. Or did Honor get her "geni" traits through he father??? Honor gets her height from him but I don't remember anything about him being a "geni" too.

SWM wrote:Honor got her genetic modifications from her father. Yes, he is a genie, too. It goes all the way back to Honor's great, great, great, great-something family, the first Harringtons who emigrated to Sphinx from Meyerdahl. Meyerdahl was an even higher-grav planet than Sphinx, and genetic modification was almost a necessity to survive there. The genetic modifications were done in such a way that they would permanently dominate (apparently using some technique unknown to 20th century genetics). So the Harringtons of Sphinx have always been genies. In fact, somewhere in the text is the statement that a very large percentage of the population of Sphinx has heavy-grav genetic modifications.

n7axw wrote:
Weren't both the Meyerdahl and the Winton mods prior the Beouwulf code? That's how I remember it, anyway if my memory isn't playing tricks on me..AGAIN

Don

I don't believe so. The Beowulf code was formulated as a direct result of the Final War. I believe that both the Meyerdahl and Winton mods were post Final War.

My curiosity is up and I am going to have to go look... Report back if I can find it. I know that Detweiler and his crew left in disgust over the Beowulf code. That might help locate it chronologically.

Don

n7axw wrote:My curiosity is up and I am going to have to go look... Report back if I can find it. I know that Detweiler and his crew left in disgust over the Beowulf code. That might help locate it chronologically.

Don

It's explained partially in David's posts here, as well as the pearls and in the text.

JeffEngel wrote:They'd be in poor shape to live there otherwise - they'd be looking at health problems or spending most of their time in housing with grav plates working in the floors. (Put that down as another thing Alison Harrington accepted for the sake of Alfred.) And certainly Sphinx is a good place to move to if you are a heavy worlder and want a new home - it's wide open, the SEM is and has been a great place for personal opportunity and civil rights, and the RMN has liberated more than its share of genetic slaves, some of whom will be suited to high gravity living.

Somehow I missed that Sphinx was a high gravity planet. In the HH books it really isn't made a point of that much. The only time I remember it being made a big deal of was in what I think is considered a young adult book where some researcher came to Sphinx to study the treecats and they got stranded somewhere and their gravity belts ran out of power. I wasn't really paying attention to where the researchers came from and I guess I was assuming they came from a light gravity planet and that is why they needed the gravity belts. But now that I know that Sphinx is a high gravity planet a few other things make more sense.

StealthSeeker wrote:

JeffEngel wrote:They'd be in poor shape to live there otherwise - they'd be looking at health problems or spending most of their time in housing with grav plates working in the floors. (Put that down as another thing Alison Harrington accepted for the sake of Alfred.) And certainly Sphinx is a good place to move to if you are a heavy worlder and want a new home - it's wide open, the SEM is and has been a great place for personal opportunity and civil rights, and the RMN has liberated more than its share of genetic slaves, some of whom will be suited to high gravity living.

Somehow I missed that Sphinx was a high gravity planet. In the HH books it really isn't made a point of that much. The only time I remember it being made a big deal of was in what I think is considered a young adult book where some researcher came to Sphinx to study the treecats and they got stranded somewhere and their gravity belts ran out of power. I wasn't really paying attention to where the researchers came from and I guess I was assuming they came from a light gravity planet and that is why they needed the gravity belts. But now that I know that Sphinx is a high gravity planet a few other things make more sense.

There are a number of places that IIRC Sphinx is referred to as having a surface gravity of 1.37 g.

Getting back to Beowulf tactics, in ART Honor, at the wedding conversation, was worried about not having a "visible" deterrent to convince the SLN not to attack. But I can't figure out a way to provide/produce a "visible" deterrent with out causing a great many political problems in the situation. But yet Beowulf MUST survive the imminent attack hinted at in the end of the book. The attack that Honor has her bad feeling about and for which she is bound to find some way to defeat.

My imagination can only come up with the idea of Manticore handing over large numbers of missile system to Beowulf. That will allow them to survive the storm of the attack before the vote. Then after the vote lots of Manticore SD's can be put in place for a "visible" deterrent. Which along with what will become and assumed large planetary missile defense should keep any further threat away.

But after the attack before the vote Beowulf must respond in some way, it just has to, to prevent further aggression and to take an initiative in the conflict. But it must strike as something that represents the SL and the Mandarin's control not the individual planets. And I still say that that the most obvious target of that perceived power of the SL and the Mandarins is the mothball fleet. Destroy that mothball fleet and both the perceived threat as well as the actual threat of the SLN being able to bring overwhelming force against a star system, or a group of system or an empire goes away. At that point the shell and fringe of the SL starts to split away. Starting with the Maya sector. I think it's Maya that already building their own ships, they couldn't help but be gone when that opportunity comes along.

And if I remember correctly, the SLN keeps the bulk of their mothballed fleet at only 2 separate star systems. The attack on these 2 systems would be a combined fleet attack. As Manty missiles are in short supply most SD and SD(P)'s used would have to be Haven but they would be supported with Manty ships using FTL recon assets which would vastly improve Haven missile effectiveness. To further save on missile resources the attack group would bring Manty and Grayson LAC's that could use their grazer energy weapons to destroy or permanently disable the static Mothballed ships. Even if there are 20,000 mothballed ships of various sizes, 600 to 800 LAC's would make quick work of them.

In my mind the picture of that kind of an attack would be a beautiful thing. And as I have said, it would be an attack on the structure of the SL and it's instrument of control not the member planets themselves. Though it should strike the feeling of vulnerability into the hearts of those member planets. That would play havoc with the SLN's deployment of what ships they did have available. It's such a clear picture in my mind that I want to see it in the next book. I am sure that Weber would work magic with it.

JeffEngel wrote:

n7axw wrote:
As for Beowulf, I've wondered if that nice extra large SDF wasn't also a preventative measure against retaliation for some of the BSC's more nefarious activities...

Don

Another function of any League SDF is a measure of independence. Even if no one has seriously contemplated secession for so long, the possibility of it may be some small factor in political considerations. If you can maintain an SDF that a Frontier Fleet squadron and OFS intervention battalions could not casually wipe out if you did secede, you've got a bit more wiggle room to kick up a stink in the Assembly. Even without any form of Manticoran assistance, Beowulf's SDF is enough that the SLN cannot brush it aside without making more news than the shadowy apparatchiks in charge of the League would prefer.

I don't blame most League systems for not caring about that - who wants to contemplate the end of Pax Solaria, especially being ground zero for the following Dark Age? - but I can certainly credit the foresight of those, like Beowulf, that have made some investment that way.

Edit: Beowulf's large SDF would also provide cover for (1) budgetary shenanigans to funnel funds to the BSC and black ops, and (2) plenty of screening elements which can go off and nail Manpower installations as discovered.

One reason I would put forth as a reason for the unusually large size of Beowulf's SDF is Haven. During its People's Republic phase (which was several hundred years I believe), Haven's eyes were fixed on taking Manticore. Most especially in the last century. Beowulf has a backdoor leading directly to Manticore. Their SDF would have been increased to deal with the possibility of a Haven victory in which Beowulf needs some defense in their system at all times to protect against a possible Haven attack.

kzt wrote:

n7axw wrote:My curiosity is up and I am going to have to go look... Report back if I can find it. I know that Detweiler and his crew left in disgust over the Beowulf code. That might help locate it chronologically.

Don

It's explained partially in David's posts here, as well as the pearls and in the text.

IIRC there is a detailed discussion in CoG about the final war and the creation of Mesa.