Topic Actions

Topic Search

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 35 guests

Considerations about naval designs

This fascinating series is a combination of historical seafaring, swashbuckling adventure, and high technological science-fiction. Join us in a discussion!
Re: Considerations about naval designs
Post by Graydon   » Mon Dec 15, 2014 10:54 pm

Graydon
Commander

Posts: 245
Joined: Sat Oct 13, 2012 7:18 pm

n7axw wrote:
Tonto Silerheels wrote:n7axw wrote:

Why would we believe that they were powered by anything other than steam?

Compressed air?


That works, although I'm pretty sure that the steam would do the compressing.


There's nothing at all preventing the blowers being powered directly by the engines, which is still powered by steam.

A little geared power takeoff with a long drive shaft off to the fans, rather like a supercharger. Or belt drives. Belts are traditional for aspiration. All the fans need is sheet metal and bearings. If they can't make bearings, the steam engine won't work at all, so I'm pretty sure they're OK for the necessary bits there.
Top
Re: Considerations about naval designs
Post by AirTech   » Tue Dec 16, 2014 8:25 am

AirTech
Captain of the List

Posts: 476
Joined: Mon Dec 09, 2013 4:37 am
Location: Deeeep South (Australia) (most of the time...)

n7axw wrote:
BarryKirk wrote:The Delthak and other steam ships had ventilation blowers. It was never discussed how they were powered.


Why would we believe that they were powered by anything other than steam? Turbines perhaps rather than piston stroke engines...but steam.

Don

Or the traditional line shafting from the main engines (way more efficient than air power). You then have couplings to the fans.
Top
Re: Considerations about naval designs
Post by n7axw   » Tue Dec 16, 2014 10:12 am

n7axw
Fleet Admiral

Posts: 5997
Joined: Wed Jan 22, 2014 8:54 pm
Location: Viborg, SD

Air Tech wrote:
There's nothing at all preventing the blowers being powered directly by the engines, which is still powered by steam.

A little geared power takeoff with a long drive shaft off to the fans, rather like a supercharger. Or belt drives. Belts are traditional for aspiration. All the fans need is sheet metal and bearings. If they can't make bearings, the steam engine won't work at all, so I'm pretty sure they're OK for the necessary bits there.


To be sure it could be done that way but piping for air or steam makes for a safer work environment than shafts, pulleys and belts. And for a comaratively small craft facing combat situations, that's important.

Don
When any group seeks political power in God's name, both religion and politics are instantly corrupted.
Top
Re: Considerations about naval designs
Post by 6L6   » Tue Dec 16, 2014 1:44 pm

6L6
Commander

Posts: 165
Joined: Sat Apr 26, 2014 8:37 pm
Location: Sourthern Md. USA

Steam powered ships require two sets of blowers, one to provide air for the boilers and another to supply ventilation to the engine spaces. Powering the blowers with hydrolic fluid would be a fire hazard if hit with a shell.
Top
Re: Considerations about naval designs
Post by Dilandu   » Tue Dec 16, 2014 2:26 pm

Dilandu
Admiral

Posts: 2541
Joined: Sat May 07, 2011 1:44 pm
Location: Russia

Draken wrote:We have first ironclads coming online soon, so what about creating proper battleships in next generation?


For what reason? Even the KH is greatly overpowered, and would meet virtually no real opponents for at least fifteen or twenty years (well, unless the continentals wouldn't be able to obtain their own <s>Mary Sue</s> seijin. ;) ) For what reason Charis may need to spend money on even more overpowered warships?
------------------------------

Oh well, if shortening the front is what the Germans crave,
Let's shorten it to very end - the length of Fuhrer's grave.

(Red Army lyrics from 1945)
Top
Re: Considerations about naval designs
Post by Weird Harold   » Tue Dec 16, 2014 7:44 pm

Weird Harold
Fleet Admiral

Posts: 4478
Joined: Thu Apr 24, 2014 10:25 pm
Location: "Lost Wages", NV

6L6 wrote:Steam powered ships require two sets of blowers, one to provide air for the boilers and another to supply ventilation to the engine spaces. Powering the blowers with hydrolic fluid would be a fire hazard if hit with a shell.


That would, of course, depend on what you use for hydraulic fluid and where you route the tubing.

FWIW, water is an excellent hydraulic fluid for most applications. It's only real problem is it's low boiling point.
.
.
.
Answers! I got lots of answers!

(Now if I could just find the right questions.)
Top
Re: Considerations about naval designs
Post by Draken   » Tue Dec 16, 2014 7:47 pm

Draken
Commander

Posts: 199
Joined: Fri Jun 06, 2014 12:58 pm

How much they could make engine smaller without losing great amount of power? If by a lot, than we should be able to put another one and we would have something like 50% increase in output and in fuel usage.
Top
Re: Considerations about naval designs
Post by chrisd   » Wed Dec 17, 2014 9:51 am

chrisd
Captain (Junior Grade)

Posts: 348
Joined: Tue Apr 30, 2013 10:38 am
Location: North-East England (70%) and also Thailand (30%)

6L6 wrote:Steam powered ships require two sets of blowers, one to provide air for the boilers and another to supply ventilation to the engine spaces. Powering the blowers with hydrolic fluid would be a fire hazard if hit with a shell.


Is there "Textev" that the boilers are forced or induced draught?
I've overlooked it if there is, or is the draught solely due to the "tall, slim funnels"

The fact that sparks are discharged as a result of firing (as mentioned during the canal raid) suggests that forced/induced draught is in use but otherwise I have found no mention.
Last edited by chrisd on Thu Dec 18, 2014 4:38 am, edited 1 time in total.
Top
Re: Considerations about naval designs
Post by chrisd   » Wed Dec 17, 2014 10:09 am

chrisd
Captain (Junior Grade)

Posts: 348
Joined: Tue Apr 30, 2013 10:38 am
Location: North-East England (70%) and also Thailand (30%)

Draken wrote: I'm thinking about something similar to KGV or Bismarck,


Why a KGV?, not a very good design IMNVHO as the design was constrained by the (useless ?) Washington and London Treaties. (As also the two "Cherry Trees")

Surely a better design would be the "Queen Elizabeth" or "Vanguard" if using RN practice as your guide.

The Imperial Russian "Gangut" and"Imperatritsa Maria" Classes had some novel and potentially useful attributes as well for first generation dreadnaughts.
Top
Re: Considerations about naval designs
Post by n7axw   » Wed Dec 17, 2014 10:50 pm

n7axw
Fleet Admiral

Posts: 5997
Joined: Wed Jan 22, 2014 8:54 pm
Location: Viborg, SD

I agree that there is not much point in developing large warship design for the EOC further as long as there are no peers for the ICN on the horizon.

But it probably would make sense to develop a fleet of cruiser sized vessels for response and power projection purposes along with whatever the required coaling stations to fuel the fleet.

Don
When any group seeks political power in God's name, both religion and politics are instantly corrupted.
Top

Return to Safehold