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HFQ Offical Snippet #4

This fascinating series is a combination of historical seafaring, swashbuckling adventure, and high technological science-fiction. Join us in a discussion!
Re: HFQ Offical Snippet #4
Post by n7axw   » Mon Nov 10, 2014 4:46 pm

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anwi wrote:
AncientMariner wrote:Without understanding of the structure of various other languages (ie. only having English as an example), the grammatical rules, the colloquial expressions, "false friends" as pointed out by Pokermind above, and words that have no obvious equivalencies, I think the SSK had very little chance of getting any meaningful translation.


Here we can agree to disagree. I'll allow that there are conditions which lead to that scenario, e.g. if Kohdy was writing about concepts unintelligible to a Safeholdian like renormizing graviton vertices in generalized Yang-Mills theory (but Kohdy seems to be a common Safeholdian), or if Bedard stripped and limited the English vocabulary of Safeholdian beyond the obvious scientific keywords like electricity (but the Brothers of St. Zherneau could read pre-safeholdian texts).

Overall, since I am basically using a translation approach by word-mapping for Spanish with acceptable results, I'm still in favour of the theory that Aivah knows more about those sections than she implies - and her conclusions (see below) could be rooted in info from those sections...

AncientMariner wrote:Given that she already believes that Merlin and the Adams, Eves and Archangels came from "somewhere else", I think she will ultimately accept the truth, and become a key player in the inner circle going forward.


That is certainly a possibility and not even unlikely. However, as things are playing out recently, there needs to be some adversary to Merlin's plans more dangerous that the current CoGA. So, either Aivah turns out to be that player or - at least as likely - that trip to Zion shows us that player. At least that's my current speculation.
As a further remark: With LAMA, RFC has made Merlin redundant (literally). Makes me wonder...


I think that the main tension in the plot has to do not with Nynian, but with the return of the archangels and the great reveal.

Don
When any group seeks political power in God's name, both religion and politics are instantly corrupted.
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Re: HFQ Offical Snippet #4
Post by Bahzellstudent   » Wed Nov 19, 2014 5:44 pm

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OlorinNight wrote:This whole snippets thing is awful!!!

I was already suffering (deeply) over the fact that I can't stop myself from reading again and again and again AND AGAIN David Weber's books while I still have hundreds (litterally hundreds) of books that I still have to open for the first time. But know I've started to read again and agin the snippets too!! I think I'm doomed... Am I a junkie?


Just read this from OloriinNight, and being massively glad that I am not the only person for whom that is true. Have read the quote to my wife who is always challenging me for the vast piles of un-read books in my house when I am re-reading Safehold, or Honor Harrington or Bahzell!
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Re: HFQ Offical Snippet #4
Post by Ramhawkfan   » Wed Nov 19, 2014 5:55 pm

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Bahzellstudent wrote:
OlorinNight wrote:This whole snippets thing is awful!!!

I was already suffering (deeply) over the fact that I can't stop myself from reading again and again and again AND AGAIN David Weber's books while I still have hundreds (litterally hundreds) of books that I still have to open for the first time. But know I've started to read again and agin the snippets too!! I think I'm doomed... Am I a junkie?


Just read this from OloriinNight, and being massively glad that I am not the only person for whom that is true. Have read the quote to my wife who is always challenging me for the vast piles of un-read books in my house when I am re-reading Safehold, or Honor Harrington or Bahzell!


BTDT says the man up to Echoes of Honor for the umpteenth time..
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Re: HFQ Offical Snippet #4
Post by TN4994   » Wed Nov 19, 2014 6:41 pm

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thanatos wrote:I'd always wonder if and when other languages might be used. Frankly I was hoping that Charis would start using something like Hebrew or Arabic as a code language, much like the Navajo code talkers of World War II. This adds an entirely different aspect to Nynian's operations though and does point out that Cody was a disaffected member of the command crew (he'd have to be since none of the Adams and Eves were given any language but English - probably interspersed with words from other languages such as "Jihad") whose disaffection became apparent to the surviving members of the command crew.

runsforcelery wrote:Merlin Athrawes had no need to breathe, yet he inhaled sharply in muscle memory reflex as she paused and looked up from the fire at him. The matter-of-fact way in which she’d suggested — no, not suggested; stated — that the most important sacred writings of the Church of God Awaiting, outside of the Holy Writ itself, had been forged, or at least significantly ‘edited,’ was astonishing. Not so much because they had been, but because she was so obviously confident they had. In its own way, that was an almost greater surprise than Maikel Staynair’s revelation of the journal of Saint Zherneau in Tellesberg had been.

But she clearly wasn’t finished yet, and she smiled crookedly as he waved for her to continue.

“Saint Kohdy was a seijin, too,” she went on after a moment. “I don’t think he had all the abilities you have, Merlin, but he had quite a few . . . superhuman capabilities. And the stories about Helm Cleaver are true. I know they are, because I’ve handled it myself, used it to shave slivers off a solid block of granite.” She smiled again, the expression softer yet somehow bittersweet, and shook her head. “I didn’t realize when Sister Klairah recruited me — I was much more innocent and naïve in those days — that I would have suffered a very sad accident if she hadn’t been able to convince me she was telling the truth.” Her expression darkened. “Some candidates have ‘suffered an accident,’ and I never would’ve lived to see Helm Cleaver or Saint Kohdy’s journal if Sister Klairah hadn’t convinced me.”

Merlin stiffened, and she nodded as if his reaction pleased her.

“We can’t read some of it,” she admitted. “It’s not written in any language we can understand. According to the part of the journal we can read, Seijin Kohdy wrote that part of it in something called ‘Español.’ He didn’t say why, but I’ve read the rest of it dozens of times, and I think he’d begun keeping his journal well before he began to feel any doubt about which side he was on. That’s certainly how the first half reads, at any rate. The ‘Español’ portions are brief, initially, interspersed with the ones we can still read, but its last eight months are recorded entirely in ‘Español.’ I suspect he switched to that language when he wrote down things that might have done serious damage to the cause of Chihiro and Schueler if it had fallen into someone else’s hands. Or perhaps they were things he might not have been certain of in his own mind at the time he wrote them down. From a handful of entries in the part I could read, I think it was a combination of the two. He wasn’t certain, and if it turned out he’d been wrong to doubt and what he’d written were to fall into anyone else’s hands, he didn’t want it to draw others who might trust him because of who and what he was into the same error.

“I don’t know that for certain, because he never explaned his reasoning in the portions of the journal we can read. Until I encountered that ‘Español’ of his, it had never occurred to me another language might even exist! And however reasonable it may’ve seemed to him at the time, his decision to use it means even the Sisterhood’s members are divided on at least a few points.”

“Oh?” Merlin tilted his head, and Aivah smiled more than a little tartly.

“Some of us — myself included — have interpreted the passage in which he recorded his decision to begin using ‘Español’ to suggest that it came from some time or place which predated the Creation. Combined with a few other puzzling references, one could almost read that as saying all of the Adams and Eves were . . . somewhere else before Safehold was called into existence.”

Her dark eyes were suddenly very intent, boring into him like twin blades, but she went on calmly, almost tranquilly.

“Even those of us who read it that way are divided about where that ‘somewhere else’ might have been. Most of us interpret it as evidence that not even an Archangel could create a soul — that God Himself must be the sole Creator in that sense — and that all those Adams and Eves were with Him while the Archangels prepared the world in which they would live. But a fair number of us think he might just as well have meant the Adams and Eves lived and breathed on an entirely different world and that God and the Archangels brought them here from that other world, rather than first giving them life on the Day of Creation. It’s a substantial distinction, and one I’ve often thought we could have found the answer to if he’d written the ‘Español’ portions in something we could read. Or,” she added, raising both eyebrows, “that the Sisterhood could read, at any rate.”

“I might be able to do a little something about that,” he acknowledged slowly. “I can’t promise. And you’d have to trust me with the journal — or a true copy of it, at any rate.”

“Either we’re going to trust one another a great deal eventually, Merlin,” she said, “or this is going to end very badly for someone.”

Seems that there is no major birth defects due to genetic manipulation over mankind's history.
Perhaps a human semaphore language. What we would call Sign Language for the Deaf.
And then we can pass messages in short of a Braille system of scratches along trails, etc.
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Re: HFQ Offical Snippet #4
Post by Draken   » Sat Nov 22, 2014 6:39 pm

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There is a high chance that Kohdy was a noble or even ruler of something and onto his court travelled sb from Alexandria before it destruction and taught him Espanol and gave him this sword. My other theory is that he was one of the angels which survived purge, because they go into cover and show up after let's say fifty or even more years and started creating organizations, similar to intelligence cells.
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Re: HFQ Offical Snippet #4
Post by anwi   » Sun Nov 23, 2014 12:29 pm

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Draken wrote:There is a high chance that Kohdy was a noble or even ruler of something and onto his court travelled sb from Alexandria before it destruction and taught him Espanol and gave him this sword. My other theory is that he was one of the angels which survived purge, because they go into cover and show up after let's say fifty or even more years and started creating organizations, similar to intelligence cells.


As I understand the textev it does support neither theory. Before Kohdy lost to someone probably from the Shanwei faction he got a memory wipe (like every colonist) and it's irrelevant if he was part of the crew or on cryo-sleep before.
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Re: HFQ Offical Snippet #4
Post by Draken   » Sun Nov 23, 2014 6:59 pm

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Also next snippets suggest that it's basically very black operation and it could easily blow into our face or into Church face. If they have battle steel sword, they shouldn't have problems with reverse engineering, it's blade and should be able to make battle steel, unless it need something crazy like titanium or other rare metal.
We know that they're a black operation, so I will be surprised if they didn't get any spies inside Council of Vicars and inside Inquisition. They are sisterhood but many intelligence agencies have agents everywhere and with sufficient enough payment you could convince anybody to sell you informations. Only question is how much you must pay. Best example would be project Manhattan it was top secret and most of the Congress didn't have any clue about it, but NKWD had spies there
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