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(SPOILERS) Too worried about waking up Dad?

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Re: Too worried about waking up Dad?
Post by fallsfromtrees   » Thu Nov 20, 2014 4:58 pm

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runsforcelery wrote:..snip..
He knows it was good enough to take out the Alexandria Enclave (presumably under human control), and he will shortly (in HFQ) receive evidence that it could be used for something rather smaller than smashing entire enclaves.
..snip..

This is actually good news (in light of the snippets already received), since it means the the OBS controls were not destroyed by Kau Yung's vest pocket nuke when he took out Langhorne. One of the major reasons for not taking out the Temple and what's underneath it is that the controls for the OBS are there and they may be the ONLY way to deactivate it. That is certainly a strong enough possibility that destroying those controls should only be done as an act of complete desperation.

Don mentioned the subject of passwords required to access the computer system in the basement. I posit that the passwords required are contained in a block of molycirc sitting on Father Paityr's desk. Is it not curious that Saint Kohdy was going to see Shueler when he dies, and the the block of molycirc is known as the Stone of Schueler? Could be a coincidence, but RFC doesn't have a whole lot of them around, even if it appears to be one at the time.
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Re: Too worried about waking up Dad?
Post by Duckk   » Thu Nov 20, 2014 5:01 pm

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I think this runs afoul with Paityr's warning that it could only be used once. David has already said the OBS isn't a one shot deal.
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Re: Too worried about waking up Dad?
Post by fallsfromtrees   » Thu Nov 20, 2014 5:39 pm

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Duckk wrote:I think this runs afoul with Paityr's warning that it could only be used once. David has already said the OBS isn't a one shot deal.

Well, that's what Paityr was told - doesn't necessarily make it true. The warning could well have been designed to keep it from being over used - but it is something to keep in mind.
The problem with any other solution to passwords is how to make sure that they get passed down through the generations without being corrupted or lost. Can't be word of mouth for obvious reasons. And if it's something written down, it would almost certainly have been entrusted to the Grand Inquisitor's care. If so, why hasn't Clyntahn used it - certainly not through an sense of scruples - he hasn't got any.
One other thought just occurred to me. When the Stone of Schueler is used to invoke whatever, a new password is written back to the Stone, along with a time limit that prevents the use for at least one generation, which effectively limits its use to one time.
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Re: Too worried about waking up Dad?
Post by n7axw   » Thu Nov 20, 2014 5:50 pm

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Duckk wrote:I think this runs afoul with Paityr's warning that it could only be used once. David has already said the OBS isn't a one shot deal.


Hi Duckk,

You've got a point. But as I think about it, it seems that we have several things going on here.

First there is the OBS which may or may not be controlled by the computer in the basement which as you point out isn't a one shot deal.

Secondly we have whatever happens when the key is plugged in and someone calls for help. That we know can only happen once.

Finally we have the mellenial return of the archangels which is in all probability one or more AIs programed to do ??

Any one or all of these could be related to whatever is in the basement with the most direct evidence pointing to the second item.

For better guessing I guess we will need more evidence.

Don
When any group seeks political power in God's name, both religion and politics are instantly corrupted.
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Re: Too worried about waking up Dad?
Post by phillies   » Thu Nov 20, 2014 6:04 pm

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Reading the key data...Why not build a copy of OWL, minus some number of features that would let him cause trouble, or a special purpose data file opening machine that, e.g., cannot readily be subverted because its operating system is only on read-only memory.
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Re: Too worried about waking up Dad?
Post by TN4994   » Thu Nov 20, 2014 6:06 pm

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n7axw wrote:
Duckk wrote:I think this runs afoul with Paityr's warning that it could only be used once. David has already said the OBS isn't a one shot deal.


Hi Duckk,

You've got a point. But as I think about it, it seems that we have several things going on here.

First there is the OBS which may or may not be controlled by the computer in the basement which as you point out isn't a one shot deal.

Secondly we have whatever happens when the key is plugged in and someone calls for help. That we know can only happen once.

Finally we have the mellenial return of the archangels which is in all probability one or more AIs programed to do ??

Any one or all of these could be related to whatever is in the basement with the most direct evidence pointing to the second item.

For better guessing I guess we will need more evidence.

Don

Let's return to a point south of Armageddon Reef, where certain scientists are in hibernation.
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Re: Too worried about waking up Dad?
Post by n7axw   » Thu Nov 20, 2014 6:14 pm

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I think we are all getting bored...

Don
When any group seeks political power in God's name, both religion and politics are instantly corrupted.
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Re: Too worried about waking up Dad?
Post by n7axw   » Thu Nov 20, 2014 6:19 pm

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phillies wrote:Reading the key data...Why not build a copy of OWL, minus some number of features that would let him cause trouble, or a special purpose data file opening machine that, e.g., cannot readily be subverted because its operating system is only on read-only memory.

.
I've wondered about something like this myself... Could a separate AI Be constructed for the express purpose of deconstructing the files in the stone that would remove the risk to Owl and possibly counter the files destruction?

Don
When any group seeks political power in God's name, both religion and politics are instantly corrupted.
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Re: Too worried about waking up Dad?
Post by fallsfromtrees   » Thu Nov 20, 2014 6:22 pm

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n7axw wrote:
phillies wrote:Reading the key data...Why not build a copy of OWL, minus some number of features that would let him cause trouble, or a special purpose data file opening machine that, e.g., cannot readily be subverted because its operating system is only on read-only memory.

.
I've wondered about something like this myself... Could a separate AI Be constructed for the express purpose of deconstructing the files in the stone that would remove the risk to Owl and possibly counter the files destruction?

Don

Not clear that you want to risk the destruction of the data on the Stone - and there doesn't appear to be any way of reading the data that won't trigger its destruction.
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Re: Too worried about waking up Dad?
Post by fallsfromtrees   » Thu Nov 20, 2014 6:27 pm

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With regard to the suggestions that the OBS be attacked via flying space hamsters, or some such, do we know if Merlin even has the capability to get to deep space. I know that he has access to LSO (Low Safehold Orbit), but do we know that the OBS won't fire on anything that get more that 1 planetary radius from the planet. Given the nature of the Archangel's business, this would have allowed them to move easily around the planet, but would never allow anyone to leave it, even if Shan Wei has managed to lose one of the terraforming ships and left it in the asteroid belt.
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The only problem with quotes on the internet is that you can't authenticate them -- Abraham Lincoln
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